F*** These Refs

Halincandenza

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Oct 24, 2018
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They also need to do something about block/charge.
These refs reward way too many flops and guys running under a driver
 

cayin

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yes, we did a lot to ourselves, but they let Tech play a completely different game than our guys. They let Tech play physical, holds, hand slaps like crazy, bumping, restricting movement, etc..which is fine as long as they let us do the same thing, they didn't and our guys were forced out of playing a physical and aggressive game because of how it was being called.
 

CYDJ

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Jan 12, 2013
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After both games, both teams have 31 turnovers in the series. ISU 15 tech 18 in the first game, ISU 16, tech 13 tonight. And as poorly as we shot tonight, we still made more shots than Tech. Refs had an impact, tech got into the bonus early and the game changed from there. Refs aren’t an excuse for poor play but they impact the game
You made some good points here. Let's see what the apologists have to say to your observations.
 
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clonedude

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Apr 16, 2006
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Refs didn’t cost us this game…. we played bad enough on our own to do that.

I just would like to see consistency and fairness not only within the game, but also in how they seem to favor the home teams as well. A charge needs to be called the same way throughout the game for both teams. You have to be consistent.

But also…. TJ needs to stand up for his guys a lot more, or refs will continue to screw us over. He doesn’t have to get technicals, but he needs to get on the refs when our guys are getting the shaft.
 

CYEATHAWK

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Not that it's any consolation.....but did anyone see the end of the KU/OU game? The league is back to if it's close.........KU wins. I don't know the KU player.....but in crunch time, he carries the ball, then just loses out of bounds on a drive in front of Higgins and Higgins just gives it back.
 

CYDJ

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So, I went back and looked at the game play-by-play on ESPN.

It kind of said what I felt through the second half.

1. We let the game get away from us in the first 10 minutes of the second half.
2. We went from 3 down to 12 down, an almost 10 point slide. 9 to be exact
3. In that time period, TT went 10-1 from the line and were up by 12. And had gained 9 points in the second half.
4. In that same time period we were given no opportunities at the freethrow line.
5. Then, between 10:00 left and 4:00 left, the deficit really ballooned and we got down by 20ish on average.
6. In that time period TT went 11-3 from the freethrow line, while ISU went 1-2.
7. Again, coincidentally, the FT disparity mirrored the point gain by TT.

It is clear that when the game counted, Freethrows were the EXACT difference in the game. I must point out, the officials are the ones who call the fouls that lead to freethrows. To say that the officials had nothing to do with the way this game swung, is being completely non-observant. The officials awarded the freethrows and that was the difference when it counted.

Now that that fact has been laid out. Let's argue about WHY those freethrows were awarded so unevenly. Here are a few of my points to get you started.

1. Fouls can be awarded at any place on the court. Not just under the basket or on drives to the bucket.
2. A foul 15 feet out can keep you from getting a shot off or driving the lane.
3. Adjusting to the way the officials are calling the game is something that smart teams do. Case in point, the officials weren't calling any hand checking or holding and TT took full advantage of that. Other case, ISU was not getting many obvious calls under the basket, so they shied away from getting mauled with no positive outcome and looked for other ways to score.
4. The first half was called better than the second half by quite a bit, but our foul problems and the way we played (and were allowed to play) the game as a team was thrown off by our bigs getting a few inconsistent calls in the first half.
5. TT may have had to change their tactics IF the officials had called similar actions on both sides of the court evenly. But that did not happen and TT took full advantage and had a killer instinct. Good for them.

Continue your discussion.
 

Lineup

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Jan 7, 2017
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we have zero pure shooters , sorry but no-one is a straight up scorer
 

2forISU

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Oct 8, 2008
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Not that it's any consolation.....but did anyone see the end of the KU/OU game? The league is back to if it's close.........KU wins. I don't know the KU player.....but in crunch time, he carries the ball, then just loses out of bounds on a drive in front of Higgins and Higgins just gives it back.
There was some bad missed calls in the last 5 minutes of that game and OU didn't benefit from them.
 

Irish1

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Feb 5, 2016
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I agree the refs were terrible, inconsistent, and it was dam hard to watch........ that being said, OUR game was never in control and consistent enough for TJ to throw a FIT. He has a philosophy about hard work, community, and integrity. He would have just looked like a whiny baby, the way we were playing.
I have my doubts about certain coaching decisions (offense!). But, I have no doubts regarding TJ's big picture. When it's the right time he will throw his ref
 

BryceC

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Honestly there were a lot of fouls that didn't get called in this game. Just awful.
 

CycloneWanderer

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So, I went back and looked at the game play-by-play on ESPN.

It kind of said what I felt through the second half.

1. We let the game get away from us in the first 10 minutes of the second half.
2. We went from 3 down to 12 down, an almost 10 point slide. 9 to be exact
3. In that time period, TT went 10-1 from the line and were up by 12. And had gained 9 points in the second half.
4. In that same time period we were given no opportunities at the freethrow line.
5. Then, between 10:00 left and 4:00 left, the deficit really ballooned and we got down by 20ish on average.
6. In that time period TT went 11-3 from the freethrow line, while ISU went 1-2.
7. Again, coincidentally, the FT disparity mirrored the point gain by TT.

It is clear that when the game counted, Freethrows were the EXACT difference in the game. I must point out, the officials are the ones who call the fouls that lead to freethrows. To say that the officials had nothing to do with the way this game swung, is being completely non-observant. The officials awarded the freethrows and that was the difference when it counted.

Now that that fact has been laid out. Let's argue about WHY those freethrows were awarded so unevenly. Here are a few of my points to get you started.

1. Fouls can be awarded at any place on the court. Not just under the basket or on drives to the bucket.
2. A foul 15 feet out can keep you from getting a shot off or driving the lane.
3. Adjusting to the way the officials are calling the game is something that smart teams do. Case in point, the officials weren't calling any hand checking or holding and TT took full advantage of that. Other case, ISU was not getting many obvious calls under the basket, so they shied away from getting mauled with no positive outcome and looked for other ways to score.
4. The first half was called better than the second half by quite a bit, but our foul problems and the way we played (and were allowed to play) the game as a team was thrown off by our bigs getting a few inconsistent calls in the first half.
5. TT may have had to change their tactics IF the officials had called similar actions on both sides of the court evenly. But that did not happen and TT took full advantage and had a killer instinct. Good for them.

Continue your discussion.

I think this is partly a problem within officiating crews where you have different officials at different places depending on the side. If your partner is making calls a certain way for hand checks high out front, you should ideally be trying to maintain consistency on the other side when you are watching for it.

Unfortunately, it appears officials don't have the ability to see what their partner is calling and watch their own area and there evidently isn't much communication around what is/isn't a foul on any particular night between officials. This drives home the point that officiating crews are wildly inconsistent in what does/doesn't get called within crews and there is a great amount of inconsistency between crews. This is a whole-sports issue and until the game/rules are changed to make it easier to officiate, it's not going away.
 
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cyclonespiker33

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There was also the sure fire dunk coming for Conditt and got mugged by 2 or 3 tech players.... and of course no call. That was a page taken right out of the WWE reffing handbook. Nothing to see here.
It was Jones, but absolutely. He was body slammed by two players while going up for the dunk. Then ESPN used it multiple times as an example for the great defense Tech was playing.
 

BillBrasky4Cy

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Losing by 20, getting gutted in the paint and can’t hit a shot. But yeah, refs……

To be fair, Tech made their run against a small lineup because Kunc and Jones both had 4 fouls and Conditt had fouled out. Up until that point, we had really held our own both inside and out. 4 out of the 5 fouls on Kunc were absolutely brutal calls. That offensive foul was a complete flop and if the roles were reversed Kunc would have absolutely been given a flop warning. It's just weird how our bigs aren't allowed to defend like the other team we are playing and we've seen that a lot during conference play.
 

carvers4math

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Mar 15, 2012
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Were the refs great? No. On the other hand, I don’t understand why Conditt always blows through these games with at least one silly reach in foul. If you are going to foul, let it be bodying up to stop a score or get a board, not these little slap reach in things. They are usually when he is already beat anyway.

Niang was aware of his importance to our offense and didn’t get these ticky tack fouls. People thought he was just a bad defender but we had to keep him on the floor. Conditt would probably benefit from evaluation of all of his fouls. He seems to be in foul trouble in the first five minutes of every game.
 
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Nococy

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It was Jones, but absolutely. He was body slammed by two players while going up for the dunk. Then ESPN used it multiple times as an example for the great defense Tech was playing.
tech went after him because they weren’t calling fouls with the body on them. got real tired of the announcers saying how 2-3 guys were going after a shooter underneath, well hell yeah they were when nothing was going to be called