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ca4cy said:
I spent a lot of time defending KJ but this is just getting depressing. The excuses have all been used up and we are now an also ran....if that.
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I agree .... have gone out of my way to support KJ and the current path, and I was as ****** as anyone about the destruction by Cael on his way out, but ISU wrestling is a train-wreck. Actually, it's a train that wrecked, fell into a sink hole, burst into flames, burned through to the center of the earth, and caused a volcanic eruption that brought total darkness and ended life as we know it.
 
CyPlainsDrifter said:
I agree .... have gone out of my way to support KJ and the current path, and I was as ****** as anyone about the destruction by Cael on his way out, but ISU wrestling is a train-wreck. Actually, it's a train that wrecked, fell into a sink hole, burst into flames, burned through to the center of the earth, and caused a volcanic eruption that brought total darkness and ended life as we know it.
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We arent a train wreck. Recruiting is decent and we have more guys pan out than not. This weekend didn't change our NCAA projection much. We just seem stuck in 'not quite there' mode. I was expecting this year to be good and show us that we could really expect to peak next year. But at this point I am not so sure that is going to happen.

We're championship friendzoned.
 
Rebrand to Near Central Iowa State and we wouldn't feel so bad losing to a city and directional college. And NCIS would be cool.
 
crawfy54 said:
Give KJ time. Next year will be a good one. Plus, he appears to be bringing in quality recruits.
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At what point do we stop giving him "time"? When he was hired I don't think anyone had this level of performance in mind over the firstfive years, or more specifically years 2-5. There are quality recruits but are there enough of them? We aren't signing highly rated classes.

KJ will be the coach next year. No doubt. I'm OK with that but JP will have a decision to make at that point. I think he has to finish in the top 5. If we don't finish that highly we will have seen enough of KJ to know if he's got the ability to contend for national titles.
 
NEICyFan said:
At what point do we stop giving him "time"? When he was hired I don't think anyone had this level of performance in mind over the firstfive years, or more specifically years 2-5. There are quality recruits but are there enough of them? We aren't signing highly rated classes.

KJ will be the coach next year. No doubt. I'm OK with that but JP will have a decision to make at that point. I think he has to finish in the top 5. If we don't finish that highly we will have seen enough of KJ to know if he's got the ability to contend for national titles.
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Unfortunately, I don't think JP cares about wrestling. He has to prioritize and I think he has wrestling somewhere near the bottom (not that I blame him in todays NCAA economic arms race).
 
Judoka said:
We arent a train wreck. Recruiting is decent and we have more guys pan out than not. This weekend didn't change our NCAA projection much. We just seem stuck in 'not quite there' mode. I was expecting this year to be good and show us that we could really expect to peak next year. But at this point I am not so sure that is going to happen.

We're championship friendzoned.
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I don't think decent recruiting will get us in the top 5 let alone contending for titles especially when I'm just not that awed by the development of the guys we have now. For every decent kid we bring in PSU, OU, OSU, tOSU, Minny, Iowa, Cornell etc are bringing in a horse. Decent won' t close the gap. I'm far from a KJ/program basher. I want it to work especially for great Cyclones like TnT and Jackson but I can't see the trajectory. Something is wrong and the trend is not going in the right direction.

Appreciate and respect your opinion Judoka and I hope you're right but I'm losing faith more and more by the day.
 
I'm just going to express myself in a way that I hope doesn't get taken out of context but I'm sure it will by some people. It is time to put down the ******* phone stop ******* tweeting and stop trying to be buddy buddy with all the kids and start making them fight like dogs, this **** is getting really really frustrating. Make them run after the meet, make them do something cause what he (KJ) is doing is not working. Fun time should end and punishments should start for the kids that should know better, get their heads in the right direction that includes the ******* coaches case in point Kyvens match, my god take a little pride in the history of the program.

Edit: For ****'s sake I just watched ESPN's The Season: Iowa Wrestling (real old school show) and hate to even mention that dirty word (Iowa wrestling) but you know what those are the guys I want to see, ones that are ****** that they only won by a major and didn't get the pin or the tech. The guys that are ****** off at another guy for doing something stupid. Give me a no name kid from bum **** no where that has the drive of a lion, the willingness to smell blood like a shark and mold him with technique that I know KJ can do.
 
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Overall the biggest gainer this weekend was Hall. He'll be back into the rankings tomorrow and put a lock on his NCAA allocation with his performance this weekend. He also looked a lot more like the guy who we saw at the start of the season. Quean also was a big winner just for getting those wins, but that won't impact our NCAA standings. Quean has as good a chance as anybody of stealing an NCAA spot at this point. But he isn't likely to score us any points if he does, unlike Hall, who could score us a lot of points if he is on.

The biggest loser was Lelund/Beard. They had a chance to push themselves into NCAA allocation contention and they biffed it. Weatherman would take that spot but his match against Ottinger today took the edge off his loss on Sunday. His problem is consistency, not ability. Little Moreno doesn't get it because he's a freshman and my expectations for him are pretty low at this point anyway.

I'm not sure if Hall's rise in the rankings will offset the drop from Weatherman's drop. Probably won't because Weatherman dropping to around 12-13 will cost us more points than Hall showing up around 15-17. I didn't pay enough attention to other duals this weekend to know if Moreno will move up or down at all. But at this point I expect no points from 184 at NCAAs, which is a huge drop from pre-season expectations. Moreno, Gadson, and Weatherman are all about where I expected (top 3 for Kyven, top 6 for Moreno, top 12 for Weatherman) but I thought Beard would be top 12 as well and that we'd be getting some support for a point or two from Goettl and Nicholson
 
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ISU22CY said:
I'm just going to express myself in a way that I hope doesn't get taken out of context but I'm sure it will by some people. It is time to put down the ******* phone stop ******* tweeting and stop trying to be buddy buddy with all the kids and start making them fight like dogs, this **** is getting really really frustrating. Make them run after the meet, make them do something cause what he (KJ) is doing is not working. Fun time should end and punishments should start for the kids that should know better, get their heads in the right direction that includes the ******* coaches case in point Kyvens match, my god take a little pride in the history of the program.

Edit: For ****'s sake I just watched ESPN's The Season: Iowa Wrestling (real old school show) and hate to even mention that dirty word (Iowa wrestling) but you know what those are the guys I want to see, ones that are ****** that they only won by a major and didn't get the pin or the tech. The guys that are ****** off at another guy for doing something stupid. Give me a no name kid from bum **** no where that has the drive of a lion, the willingness to smell blood like a shark and mold him with technique that I know KJ can do.
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Careful. Judoka and his band will start branding you an Iowa fan.
 
You are talking about several seeds in the teens. That should be our worst wrestlers, with most higher and a handful in the top 5.
 
NEICyFan said:
Careful. Judoka and his band will start branding you an Iowa fan.
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Definitely need to see more fire out of our team at times but I definitely don't want to be anything like Iowa. I would much rather remain mediocre than be represented by the meat headed ****** bag Brands bros. They get results but they're just the worst kind of human being.

Not sure what to think about our team right now. I've been mostly positive to this point but it's getting harder and harder. Obviously it takes time to rebuild after losing pretty much everything but how long should it take? If we're not a steady top 5 team in 2 years I think we need to let KJ go. Hate to say it but if he hasn't turned it around by then, he isn't going to.

One last thing........NEICyFan when are you going to remove your head from Judoka's ***?
 
NEICyFan said:
Careful. Judoka and his band will start branding you an Iowa fan.
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Haha No Judoka and I got a good understanding, he knows I'm a clone through and through. I appreciate everything he does for the board always provides the best insight for duals and stats. I've been a clone with season tickets far too long to jump off any bridges, but that doesn't mean I don't like to make some yelling noises from time to time :biglaugh::biglaugh:
 
HitItHard58 said:
Definitely need to see more fire out of our team at times but I definitely don't want to be anything like Iowa. I would much rather remain mediocre than be represented by the meat headed ****** bag Brands bros. They get results but they're just the worst kind of human being.

Not sure what to think about our team right now. I've been mostly positive to this point but it's getting harder and harder. Obviously it takes time to rebuild after losing pretty much everything but how long should it take? If we're not a steady top 5 team in 2 years I think we need to let KJ go. Hate to say it but if he hasn't turned it around by then, he isn't going to.

One last thing........NEICyFan when are you going to remove your head from Judoka's ***?
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While i agree brands bros are goners.. in todays game its basically win at all cost in all sports. I know KJ focuses a lot on matchups and i appreciate that. But the major thing lacking is development. which iowa is one of best at. I believe next year is KJ's do or die year. No more excuses.

Judo is half full kinda guy. I am not. What do you mean you dont know what to think?? Do you not have any expectations? After having as many recruits flop as we have, how do you not start to think its not the kids, but the environment?
 
Primetime26 said:
While i agree brands bros are goners.. in todays game its basically win at all cost in all sports. I know KJ focuses a lot on matchups and i appreciate that. But the major thing lacking is development. which iowa is one of best at. I believe next year is KJ's do or die year. No more excuses.

Judo is half full kinda guy. I am not. What do you mean you dont know what to think?? Do you not have any expectations? After having as many recruits flop as we have, how do you not start to think its not the kids, but the environment?
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Yes I do have expectations. Solid top 5 throughout the year the season after next. I'm not sure what to think about our team because we're so up and down. Such inconsistency makes it hard to tell if we're just not that good, have potential but need to put it all together, or just plain mediocre.
 
HitItHard58 said:
Yes I do have expectations. Solid top 5 throughout the year the season after next. I'm not sure what to think about our team because we're so up and down. Such inconsistency makes it hard to tell if we're just not that good, have potential but need to put it all together, or just plain mediocre.
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honestly, What evidence have you seen that we will be a top 5 team next year? gaining meeks will help alot, but we are far from the psu, iowa, minny, and cornells of the world...
 
Primetime26 said:
honestly, What evidence have you seen that we will be a top 5 team next year? gaining meeks will help alot, but we are far from the psu, iowa, minny, and cornells of the world...
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I don't think we will be top 5 next year but the year after that we should be or bye bye KJ. As far as next year goes, sticking around the top 10 seems realistic. If we don't improve next year and repeat the same inconsistent performance, I would be totally fine with letting KJ go.
 
HitItHard58 said:
I don't think we will be top 5 next year but the year after that we should be or bye bye KJ. As far as next year goes, sticking around the top 10 seems realistic. If we don't improve next year and repeat the same inconsistent performance, I would be totally fine with letting KJ go.
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That seems like a tall order after losing Gadson and Moreno after next year, aka the only two guys that are going to get us any points at this year's tourney.
 
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