What would it take?

[Toasted40]

I don't want hope. I want wins. And I don't see a new coach giving that to us anytime soon. Don't know if Mac can either, but I think he has a much better chance than a new coach will.

Whatever decision is made, I can back either of them up. I just think people are looking for a quick fix, when the quick fix actually may end up costing the program more than sticking it out one more year.

Since kg won't answer, I will ask you. What have you seen in the past four years that makes you think that we will magically start to win?

People want a reason to believe we can win. We have shown that we can win here. It's what get's them opening their checkbooks to buy tickets. What does Mac do that make you believe?

A new coach, could at least get people excited.

 

[Toasted40]

There is only one way to "sell that hope" now, and that's winning. If McDermott is back next year, and the team wins, people will show up. It's that simple, really.

And if next year is like any of the past four, there will be 5000 people in the stands. This same discussion will be going on, in fact, the year will start with this discussion. For the people that still care, anyway.

 

[Toasted40]

Ticket sales are going to take a hit next year no matter the coach.

And why is that?

 

[BigBake]

And if next year is like any of the past four, there will be 5000 people in the stands. This same discussion will be going on, in fact, the year will start with this discussion. For the people that still care, anyway.

His point was that if we start winning there will be more butts in seats.

 

[cycloneG]

And why is that?

People are waiting for wins to come back. Hope isn't going to do it anymore. A coaching change isn't going to sell more tickets. Winning is the only thing that's going to sell more tickets.

 

[BigBake]

And why is that?

Because you'll have a chunk of buyers who didn't want Mac fired who won't buy. You'll have another chunk who doesn't agree with whoever we hire.

Both of those will absolutely happen.

 

[bawbie]

And why is that?

because this year was a disappointment. the only way to avoid it would be to get a BIG name coach, which I don't think is possible.

 

[cycloneG]

because this year was a disappointment. the only way to avoid it would be to get a BIG name coach, which I don't think is possible.

I agree.

 

[BigBake]

A new coach really isn't going to put more butts in seats until he wins consistently.

 

[BigBake]

because this year was a disappointment. the only way to avoid it would be to get a BIG name coach, which I don't think is possible.

And I think that is a very very valid point.

 

[Clonegrad07]

No one on this board would want him fired if he won the Big 12 tourney and made the NCAA... nobody. That's the only way we'd get to that though.

 

[CTAClone]

Since kg won't answer, I will ask you. What have you seen in the past four years that makes you think that we will magically start to win?

People want a reason to believe we can win. We have shown that we can win here. It's what get's them opening their checkbooks to buy tickets. What does Mac do that make you believe?

A new coach, could at least get people excited.

This year was built around hope, with a new coach next year will be the same. I'm tired of hope. I just want wins. I haven't seen anything that says Mac is the answer the last four years. Except that year-after-year his recruiting is better and better. That's because he's had time to develop relationships. With a new coach, all that goes away. I'm just arguing the fact that getting a new coach isn't necessarily the answer here. We could be taking a step sideways, backwards or maybe in forward. I think most likely it's sideways or backwards. A new guy will be starting with the cupboard bare, a fickle fanbase and a must win in said amount of time type of situation. Not a very likely prospect for a lot of coaches or fans.

Let me ask you, would one more year of Mac make things that much worse than they are already are?

 

[bawbie]

No one on this board would want him fired if he won the Big 12 tourney and made the NCAA... nobody. That's the only way we'd get to that though.

I disagree. There is a small (and very vocal) minority here that I believe has so ingrained their dislike for McDermott, and blame him for absolutely everything, that I think they would want him gone regardless.

Judging by the poll in this thread, I'd say that's at about 28% :wink:

 

[Toasted40]

People are waiting for wins to come back. Hope isn't going to do it anymore. A coaching change isn't going to sell more tickets. Winning is the only thing that's going to sell more tickets.

OK, so how all of a sudden does Mac turn this around? Where do these wins come from (and I don't mean the 11-12he will schedule himself with another pathetic non conference schedule)?

How, all of a sudden, do we learn how to play smart at the end of games? How, all of a sudden, do we learn how to stop people from getting to the rim at will? How, all of a sudden, do we stop people from killing us on the boards?


And you are both right and wrong with your theory. Wins are the only thing that will get people to come back and watch the team if Mac is the coach.

A new coach does sell more tickets because a new coach offers a fresh start. And as long as he continues to show improvement, people will be there.

It's like the Johnny Orr thing that people were trying to use to defend Greg, there was a huge difference. Johnny's teams got better every year, Greg's have really gotten worse.

 

[cycloneG]

OK, so how all of a sudden does Mac turn this around? Where do these wins come from (and I don't mean the 11-12he will schedule himself with another pathetic non conference schedule)?

How, all of a sudden, do we learn how to play smart at the end of games? How, all of a sudden, do we learn how to stop people from getting to the rim at will? How, all of a sudden, do we stop people from killing us on the boards?


And you are both right and wrong with your theory. Wins are the only thing that will get people to come back and watch the team if Mac is the coach.

A new coach does sell more tickets because a new coach offers a fresh start. And as long as he continues to show improvement, people will be there.

It's like the Johnny Orr thing that people were trying to use to defend Greg, there was a huge difference. Johnny's teams got better every year, Greg's have really gotten worse.

You could have ended your sentence right there. Wins are the only thing that's going to bring people back no matter the coach. Fans aren't looking for hope which is what a new coach brings. They're looking for wins no matter who the coach is. The only way fans are going to come back because of a new coach is if the new coach is big or if they bring back TF or LE. Hope isn't going to work next season.

 

[bawbie]

How, all of a sudden, do we learn how to play smart at the end of games? How, all of a sudden, do we learn how to stop people from getting to the rim at will? How, all of a sudden, do we stop people from killing us on the boards?

Well, to start will, we aren't getting killed on the boards. We have a +1.3 rebounding margin in Big 12 games. That part has been fixed from earlier in the season.

In my opinion, this team has the talent to compete, but has been dogged by the intangibles all season. Whether it be chemistry, leadership, cohesiveness, identity, mental toughness, etc. Intangible issues are tough to predict and even tougher to fix during the season. The "hope", as it is, for next year is that the team gels and comes together to be a sum greater than their parts, unlike this current team with is clearly a team less than the sum of their parts. If that happens, winning covers up many of the other ills that have befallen the team this year. It's really amazing what winning by itself fixes.

 

[Toasted40]

This year was built around hope, with a new coach next year will be the same. I'm tired of hope. I just want wins. I haven't seen anything that says Mac is the answer the last four years. Except that year-after-year his recruiting is better and better. That's because he's had time to develop relationships. With a new coach, all that goes away. I'm just arguing the fact that getting a new coach isn't necessarily the answer here. We could be taking a step sideways, backwards or maybe in forward. I think most likely it's sideways or backwards. A new guy will be starting with the cupboard bare, a fickle fanbase and a must win in said amount of time type of situation. Not a very likely prospect for a lot of coaches or fans.

Let me ask you, would one more year of Mac make things that much worse than they are already are?

I am still thinking that he is going to be here next year anyway.

How the people in charge (Pollard) handle the situation will go a long way in shaping how I feel about it. Greg has become a very polarizing figure in this fanbase. You know that is the case when his supporters try to personalize the coach. How many people on here say "you just hate Greg, and that's all"

It's silly, because nobody hates Greg McDermott the person. Mac is a good guy. People may hate that Greg McDermott coaches their favorite team, but there is nothing personal that I can see. Pointing out repeated mistakes is not hating the person.

But because he is so polarizing, and people see nothing good about this program right now, Pollard really needs to get out in front of the story, and sell it. Then at least there is something positive being said.

The common perception is that we can't afford to buy him out. That may very well be true. But it is the worst reason in the world to bring Greg back. To let that be the reason cuts Greg off at the knees, and makes a bad situation worse. It will damage Greg's career, and Pollard will suffer for it as well.

If they believe he is the right guy, then sell it. But if it's all about money, then we are doomed, and you have to make the move then.

Also if he is to come back, Greg needs to get out and sell himself. Trust me was the worst possible thing he could have said.

 

[Toasted40]

Well, to start will, we aren't getting killed on the boards. We have a +1.3 rebounding margin in Big 12 games. That part has been fixed from earlier in the season.

In my opinion, this team has the talent to compete, but has been dogged by the intangibles all season. Whether it be chemistry, leadership, cohesiveness, identity, mental toughness, etc. Intangible issues are tough to predict and even tougher to fix during the season. The "hope", as it is, for next year is that the team gels and comes together to be a sum greater than their parts, unlike this current team with is clearly a team less than the sum of their parts. If that happens, winning covers up many of the other ills that have befallen the team this year. It's really amazing what winning by itself fixes.

Way to try to use a nonsense stat to defend something that has been a real problem for four years. The numbers are so skewed by the Colorado games, it isn't even funny, and you know that. But you still try to use it like it's a point in your favor.

Take away the two Colorado games, and see where we rate.

The second part is true, and that is what I have said all along. As you try to personalize all of this about how people just hate Mac and it's so unfair.....All he has to do is win, and he will be as popular as any coach ever here.

 

[bawbie]

Way to try to use a nonsense stat to defend something that has been a real problem for four years. The numbers are so skewed by the Colorado games, it isn't even funny, and you know that. But you still try to use it like it's a point in your favor.

Take away the two Colorado games, and see where we rate.

Why is the stat more valid without Colorado? And how is rebounding margin "nonsense"?

You say we get killed on the boards, but then you want to change the stats that disprove that to remove the game where we absolutely destroyed the other team on the boards. How does that make any sense at all?

Oh, and removing Colorado from the rebounding stats, we are getting out rebounded by 1.8 boards a game in the other 13 Big 12 games, which is NOT getting "killed on the boards" by any means.

 

[tee1up]

I'll get laughed out of the gym for this, but I think next year we see a different, better team. I think GAMC got scared by the whole WJ thing, and got soft. Then when CB came back, he was given free reign to do whatever. I love CB, great kid and proud to call him a Cyclone. But he regressed this year, and was not held accountable. I think some other guys, like DG, feel like they have to defer to him. Next year, without him, I think GMAC goes back to his old style, kicks some ***, holds everyone accountable. CC takes control of the team, Phillips brings some attitude, and DG and SC become the very good role players they should be. Ham flourishes inside with a couple guards who open things up. Booze provides energy, JVB hits some 3's.

You heard it hear first.