McCarney - Buy or Sell?
- Thread starter Kyle
- Start date
I've said it before and I'll say it again, we as fans don't "deserve" anything. Why do we deserve anything? We can't sell out our stadium or have even a respectable budget in the Big 12. In fact, if we're talking about what we "deserve" as fans, we probably deserve a team like Baylor's. When people start talking about what we deserve, it just pisses me off.
There are no moral victories here, but losing to Iowa at Kinnick with a senior quarterback isn't a bad loss. Jesus, if Meyer makes that first down and keeps himself in bounds, we might have won the game. And by the way, that was a very agressive call. I think Mac called an agressive game, and Iowa just played better than us. Hey, guess what, that happens to some good teams and programs. This whole thread is re-god-damn-diculous.
Those of you supporting McCarney, can you think of any justification for sitting on it at the end of the first half? Less than 50 yards to have a legitimate field goal chance, over a minute left, and three time outs. It blows my mind.
I was going to argue that budget and talent level have not been huge factors in the recent past as I can just think of so many talented players. We've had two NFL caliber QBs, and Bret is very good. Blythe is amazing. People are talking NFL for DeAndre. We've had Ellis, Dobbins, and Leaders. A quick google search revealed this though. Note that it is for last year.
http://www.aggieathletics.com/pressRelease.php?PRID=10070
Players on NFL Training Camp Rosters
As of Aug. 5, 2005
Big 12 Rankings
Texas A&M 42
Nebraska 42
Oklahoma 35
Kansas State 34
Colorado 33
Texas 25
Missouri 17
Oklahoma State 14
Texas Tech 14
Baylor 11
Kansas 9
Iowa State 8
I was going to argue that budget and talent level have not been huge factors in the recent past as I can just think of so many talented players. We've had two NFL caliber QBs, and Bret is very good. Blythe is amazing. People are talking NFL for DeAndre. We've had Ellis, Dobbins, and Leaders. A quick google search revealed this though. Note that it is for last year.
http://www.aggieathletics.com/pressRelease.php?PRID=10070
Players on NFL Training Camp Rosters
As of Aug. 5, 2005
Big 12 Rankings
Texas A&M 42
Nebraska 42
Oklahoma 35
Kansas State 34
Colorado 33
Texas 25
Missouri 17
Oklahoma State 14
Texas Tech 14
Baylor 11
Kansas 9
Iowa State 8
If we canned Mac, we wouldn't be able to afford the likes of Mark Mangino. Part of upgrading coaches is being able to upgrade their payscale. Midmajor schools are realizing that their coaches are jumping ship for bigger budget schools. I think it was Boise State that just gave their coach a huge pay raise in the off season.
Don't forget that not all risk taking on coaches pay off. Colorado is seeing that right now. Nebraska went through a lot of pains to get back to where they are now, which is still no where near where they had been.
I think as long as McCarney can continue to upgrade the talent, budget and facilities of our program, we should keep him around.
Someone mentioned Bill Snyder earlier, incredible coach. He and Barry Alvarez are the only two coaches in the recent era to quickly rebuild a program to prominence. We will see once what the programs do under new supervision.
Big 12 North Title THIS YEAR or bust for me. 12 years was long enough to fight and defeat the Great Depression, the Nazis, and the Japanese. Apparently it is not long enough to build a championship-caliber FB team at ISU. As for other coaches getting it done quickly: Dennis Erickson at Oregon State (Fiesta Bowl win over ND), Joe Tiller at Purdue (Rose Bowl with Drew Breese), and Les Miles at Oklahoma State (Cotton Bowl) all put their teams into big bowls in under 3 years.
C'mon clones... I agree with many of you, but you even hear Mac say it himself as he was heading for the locker rooms at halftime, "We made that TD too easy for 'em." it was pure conservative foot ball with :90 seconds left on the clock. Many of you are asking the same "buy or sell" questions now that you did last year. ISU may be a football coaches graveyard, but at some point, some coach is going to win about 10 games consistantly for us. And when that time comes, I don't think it's going to take 12 years to do it.
OK, but would that really change anything? How about I expect we win 12 games this year? Is the "force" going to take over and make it so?
The reality is it doesn't matter what you think or what I think about the team or Coach Mac. Unless you were thinking about contributing 190 million dollars but won't do it if Mac is the coach, it doesn't really matter. Why can't you just watch the team and support the team and quit complaining?
JP will do what is necessary to move the program to the next level.
Duh! If your expectations were higher, you wouldn't be on here writing that you're "OK with the result" of yesterday's game, which you somehow consider a "moral victory"! You'd be discouraged that a winnable game got away from us...
As for part two, I haven't missed a home game in four plus years, during which I've purchased five season tickets / year and made a contribution in return for a parking pass. My family and I have attended more than a few road games. Though we live in Iowa City, we wear so much Cyclone clothing that it's a running joke with friends. Finally, I'm the unpaid "voice of the Cyclones" on a small AM radio station in Iowa City, doing short updates on Friday & Monday mornings. I watch the team and I've never wavered in my support of the team. Given the level of my support for the team, I believe I've earned the right to voice my opinion, be it good, bad or indifferent.
What do you do to support the program from CO, other than to offer up excuses and worship the new AD?
I'll leave you alone now. Please don't question my committment again!
But how many times has the opposing team made better adjustments than Mac??? My goodness, do we ever see this staff coming out in the second half, and forcing the opponent to adjust to them?
I cannot remember seeing this, and I have lost count how many times I have watched Mac clapping his hands on the sideline, talking into his headset, while the other coach makes decisions that truly impact the game.
But hey at least we are still undefeated in the first half of games.
we basically lack any sort of killer instinct, and this comes from the coaching staff. iowa state has never been able to absolutely put away an inferior team and show how much better of a team we are, and we either A)lack the confidence to realize when we're beating a top team that yes, we are that good and continue playing at a top level; or B)cannot maintain the intensity level needed to compete for a full game. whatever it is, our coaching staff is falling short.
Wow- lots of great comments on here showing each ends of the spectrum.
My gut feeling yesterday after the squandering of the 1:22/3 TO scenario just told me we'll never reach the next level with Focus-on-the-Family conservative play calling. In fact I think I'm gonna start calling DMac James Dobson. When they decided not to move the ball at that point, what does that tell every team member on the sideline? It certainly has to change their mentality a wee bit?
I loved the K-State analogy... very similar to compare the two... both land-grant universities in low-populated states with another "university of..." in the state and each had horrible programs thru much of the 20th century. If we won 9 games in 2000, why haven't we come close to matching that since?
DMac has elevated the program from when he took over, but it couldn't have gotten much lower. I respect his hard work to turn things around. But looking at the losses (KU 05, Mizzou 04, Baylor 05, UCONN 02) in recent years and the near losses (Army, Toledo, UNLV) just tells me there is something wrong w/ the mentality of the coaching staff that starts from the top down. DMac is wound up tighter than a piano string... and someone compared his style to Pete Carroll, and there is no comparison. Carroll and his team are loose and have a certain amount of mox and attitude that I don't see in ISU. I want to someday see killer instinct, but we see now is a mentality of playing "not to lose."
I can't even give the "Big 12 north or bust" stipulation, because there is no way ISU will win the north. After seeing Nebraska last night, despite getting rolled over by USC, their D is still formidable, Mizzou is off to a great start, and with ISU playing at OU and UT, it's just not going to happen. We'll eek out 6 wins again, and head to shreveport or some other dump hole and watch Iowa go to another january bowl game in a coastal setting.
My gut feeling yesterday after the squandering of the 1:22/3 TO scenario just told me we'll never reach the next level with Focus-on-the-Family conservative play calling. In fact I think I'm gonna start calling DMac James Dobson. When they decided not to move the ball at that point, what does that tell every team member on the sideline? It certainly has to change their mentality a wee bit?
I loved the K-State analogy... very similar to compare the two... both land-grant universities in low-populated states with another "university of..." in the state and each had horrible programs thru much of the 20th century. If we won 9 games in 2000, why haven't we come close to matching that since?
DMac has elevated the program from when he took over, but it couldn't have gotten much lower. I respect his hard work to turn things around. But looking at the losses (KU 05, Mizzou 04, Baylor 05, UCONN 02) in recent years and the near losses (Army, Toledo, UNLV) just tells me there is something wrong w/ the mentality of the coaching staff that starts from the top down. DMac is wound up tighter than a piano string... and someone compared his style to Pete Carroll, and there is no comparison. Carroll and his team are loose and have a certain amount of mox and attitude that I don't see in ISU. I want to someday see killer instinct, but we see now is a mentality of playing "not to lose."
I can't even give the "Big 12 north or bust" stipulation, because there is no way ISU will win the north. After seeing Nebraska last night, despite getting rolled over by USC, their D is still formidable, Mizzou is off to a great start, and with ISU playing at OU and UT, it's just not going to happen. We'll eek out 6 wins again, and head to shreveport or some other dump hole and watch Iowa go to another january bowl game in a coastal setting.
Maybe this should be the question - should ISU be winning 8-9 games this year with the offensive talent (returning) that we have? I say yes, but I am not sure the coaching staff is capable of getting them there. When the discussion centers on play calling, under utilization, lack of adjustments.... the coaching staff is not capable of advancing the talent they have. I wonder what UI's coaches could do with our receivers.....?
You apparantly miss the point of the question, and the thread. I can see that you are a big Mac guy and that is fine. I was just pointing out the fact that so many people around here are happy with where the program is at, and I can't understand why.
Iowa was horrible for 20 years, they had a low budget, and all of the things that everyone wants to point out as excuses for why we have gone from pathetic to mediocre.
Well they got a coach that didn't use all of the things against him as excuses for not being successful, and he got it done in three years.
Snyder went to Kansas State, which was the WORST program in Division 1 for 40 years, and didn't use all of the things against him as excuses for failure.
But yet here we are giving Mac an out, why then can't Walden have an out, they didn't increase his recruiting budget in the 8 years he was at Iowa State, the facilities were "atrocious" (Mac's words), he was swiming against a typhoon without a life jacket.
Yet we villify Walden, and praise Mac. Now please don't think that I am defending Jim Walden, I am not, but Mac has had a lot of advantages that his predecessors did not, that his mentors did not. So why do we assume that all of a sudden he is going to become this brilliant coach when we haven't seen it for 12 years???
I agree with that in principle, however don't you think that it also comes back to the idea that we haven't won, therefore the fanbase has not become energized.
And getting close like the past two years, and not finishing the deal, has further alienated a lot of the fans who have had the shortcomings of this staff illustrated to us painfully.
Mac always works the whole budget thing into all of the interviews he does (I will give him credit on his p.r. skillz), but if show me a guy making excuses for why something isn't getting done, I will show you a guy who won't get it done.
think about what happens if we get rid of Mac...we will lose many talented players to transfers and have to suffer through at least 2-3 losing seasons thereafter. I say take a look back after next season and think about it then. if he can't make a stellar season out of the current or the next years team, then we can justify this kind of talk. i say wait and see.
That's the really what this decision comes down to. Are we happy with 6 - 8 wins a year and a bowl game more often than not? If not, who will we bring in to replace Mac? We'll have to take a step back and hope the new coach will be able to build the team into a 10 game winner, but ISU is going to have a hard time attracting a big name coach. And if a young coach comes in and wins 10 games a year they'll most likely move on to a bigger program. I'm not saying we should keep Mac or let him go, but i'm wondering what those that want Mac gone at the end of the season expect to happen to ISU football in the future?
