New Big 12 Super Conference

[HFCS]

BYU is the obvious choice right now. I think Bebee should just focus all his attention on getting them to join the conference next year. This will get us back up to 10 teams (a nice number IMO) and help us end the "recession" in the Big XII. Adding a quality school will help us shed the preception that the Big XII is dying; we will look like a viable conference that schools actually want to join.

Schools like UNLV, Air Force...etc are a big reach for a power conference. I think Bebee should take one step at a time and add quality schools as they become available. Once BYU is in and we become a conference that is expanding rather than shrinking, we'll have a better chance with the big prizes like ND.

Could have had them 10 months ago, they were aching for their invite when their hated rival got a seat at the BCS table. We stood them up. If they say no a year later, can't see how that is anything but a monumental F up.

I still think they'll likely join, but it's not the slam dunk automatic it was last year.

 

[proisu]

this mighta been posted, but why not go for a diff approach a little ... how bout invite BYU, ND, Air Force, Army and Navy ..... dont kill me on this, but they bring tvs even when they stink, the big boys of our conference are not gonna be threatened by their talant/success .... we would have a national conference with integrety also .... AND ND would still play most of the teams they do now and they could all have their own networks (which we may not like, but REALLY doesnt affect us) we would have people all over country watchin ... PS FUDGE A&M

 

[Tedcyclone]

Stopped reading here. Not just no but hell no.

why no? explain, who would you rather add? why?

my ideal teams would be Notre Dame, BYU, and north east coast team.

 

[tazclone]

I don't think Larry Scott is a great guy, but he is aggressive and he only cares about his league's success. Five leagues are being aggressive (let us not forget the ACC already did its poaching a few years back and the Big East is one top ten team stronger this season). ONE BCS league not. Adding CU and Utah is a good thing for the Pac 12. New markets with a team that was elite in the 80s/90s and a team that was elite in the 00s. They only lost, oh wait the Pac 12 didn't lose a top 5 and two top 30 football programs, that was us.

Beebe, UT, the presidents, or whoever the mighty TAZ deems made the decisions were idiotic not to add BYU and go to 11 teams the minute CU/Neb left. The TV contract would have been split 11 ways instead of 10 but it would have included a new region the league had just lost along with a much more national fanbase than CU. Iowa State is in a more dangerous position than it should be because the Big 12 was stupid and meek last summer.

Look at this board, people have their fingers crossed that BYU will accept an invitation there was a 99.999% chance they accept last year. That's the definition of a F-up right there, take off the blinders man.

It isn't who I deem made the decisions. The presidents made the decision. That is fact. People that don't realize that have no clue how the conferences work. Much like Slive had to get permision for a$m to join, Beebe has to get permission from the Big 12 presidents. The conference commissioners actions are controlled by the presidents of the conference.

I didn't say the Big 12 was stupid. The Big 12 presidents have been stupid since 1994. At any time, a$m, or NU or OU could have voted for equal revenue sharing and/or a network but they all stuck together. Now two of those schools who could have reeled in power at anytime have left or are leaving. They are reaping what they sow. That isn't Beebe's fault nor is it the fault of the comissioners before him.

At the same time, a few weeks back the presidents voted to be more aggressive and gave Beebe the power to pursue other schools IF a$m left. I think you over estimate BYU's willingness to join the Big 12 last year. I think they would have wanted the same things last year as they will want this year. Their decision to go Independent wasn't made on a whim and had been in the works for a while. They are just as likely to join this year as last year. Maybe even moreso since the confernce looks to be more stable going forward. It was clear last year that a$m was not dedicated tot the conference

People that are crossing their figners are chicken littles. Either BYU joins and we go forward as a 10 team confernce or they don't and long term the ND, the Big 12, and Big East join to form a megaconfernce. There is a reason the Big East and the Big 12 have been having talks.

BTW- when you go after Texas, OU,Okie St and TT and instead end up with CU and Utah is a failure. It was a fly ball instead of a homerun.

 

[tazclone]

this mighta been posted, but why not go for a diff approach a little ... how bout invite BYU, ND, Air Force, Army and Navy ..... dont kill me on this, but they bring tvs even when they stink, the big boys of our conference are not gonna be threatened by their talant/success .... we would have a national conference with integrety also .... AND ND would still play most of the teams they do now and they could all have their own networks (which we may not like, but REALLY doesnt affect us) we would have people all over country watchin ... PS FUDGE A&M

When is the last time you watched an Air Force game?

 

[tazclone]

Could have had them 10 months ago, they were aching for their invite when their hated rival got a seat at the BCS table. We stood them up. If they say no a year later, can't see how that is anything but a monumental F up.

I still think they'll likely join, but it's not the slam dunk automatic it was last year.

You keep saying this but I don't remember that being the case. BYU had long thought about going independent. There have been a couple good articles about it lately. I think they would have joined last year but I also think they will join this year

 

[CycloneNC2015]

 

[proisu]

when they play army or navy ... i know it sounds old, but u cant tell me their arnt MILLIONS of service vets ... im not one, but i still watch ... and this may sound way naive and stupid on my part, but why not as a conference try to take a positive approach to the 'school' approach of college also .... we are in a weak positison as a conference on super power teams .... take a strong approach on a student athlete approach that ALSO has national following and MILLIONS upon MILLIONS of alum .... if we are looking to expand, we r not in postion to ask some big boys, but if we approach it diff, we can add many tvs and many great institutions, AND the egos of big boys wont be bruised (even though that pisses me off) .... the big boys can get Ws in FB and and smooth their egos some, and the conference would have a HUGE following ..... U have to work to your strengths, not away from your weaknesses ... Just my opinion

 

[HFCS]

Taz logic...

getting Colorado, getting Utah and losing nobody = a huge failure

Nebraska leaving, A&M leaving, CU leaving, nobody joining = not a huge failure

At what point is it not bad to add somebody? I'm guessing you think ISU would be best off as an independent, split that pie one way!

I'm not going to dig up year old articles and tweets, but the brass at BYU was very shocked that a B12 invite did not come last summer. I was all over reading about it because I wanted them to join last year, the same way half of this board did then and 99% of the board does now. Imagine if Iowa and ISU were both in the MAC and Iowa joined the Big Ten. Yeah I'm sure ISU would turn down a Big 12 or SEC invite in that situation in the heat of the moment the same week Iowa got "called up".

The Big 12 gave them the perfect opportunity last year to maintain their own network they already had (that is in more homes than LHN will ever be), along with better exposure and access to the BCS.

A year later it makes them look weak and indecisive to give up on being independent after just one season. I think they'd have joined either year too, but last year was a slam dunk 99% deal, this year it won't shock me if they say no. Last year the B12 had only lost two teams, now we've lost 3. That doesn't help either.

 

[ISUAgronomist]

why no? explain, who would you rather add? why?

my ideal teams would be Notre Dame, BYU, and north east coast team.

TCU, Houston, SMU = SWC Part II. Texas will not let that happen. Networks gain zero value from these teams. Houston will take some of our Texas recruits if they get in the Big 12. SMU and TCU are just too damn small.

Boise State = JUCO level academics. Their team is built on partial qualifiers and that is not allowed in the Big 12 (see initial issues Nebraska had when Big 12 formed).

UNLV - No specific issues other than we should strive to do better than UNLV.



I'd rather add BYU, which was on the list. Obviously, ND + a local rival (Pitt) would be great but I have a hard time believing we can pull in ND. If we have to go more than 10 teams (without ND + Pitt) then we either raid some ACC/Big East schools or form two super conference with Big12/Big East/ACC (this I do not support but could happen).

 

[Peter]

Army? Navy? Really? I think we would raid the MAC before we go after these schools.

Expanding too quickly would be a mistake. We need to be careful how we do it.
There are actually two kinds of expansion: Big East expansion (adding teams like UConn, or perhaps even Villanova) and Big 10 expansion (adding Nebraska and or other national powers). If we start adding schools like UNLV, Army or Memphis we will be diluting our conference and losing cash. Our "expansion" would be the joke of college sports and we would start sliding towards Big East status. If we want to stay legit we have to go after legit schools. BYU is the obvious choice.

 

[Al_4_State]

I think if we get BYU, we make a hard pitch on Pitt and WVU. I think that's a great league right there.

2 very solid programs in both football and basketball whose average attendance fits very well with the Big 12 and would open up new markets.

 

[IcSyU]

I think if we get BYU, we make a hard pitch on Pitt and WVU. I think that's a great league right there.

2 very solid programs in both football and basketball whose average attendance fits very well with the Big 12 and would open up new markets.

WVU so Al can tailgate.

Tailgating in Morgantown or Ames with WVU would lead to the national guard being dispatched.

 

[Peter]

TCU, Houston, SMU = SWC Part II. Texas will not let that happen. Networks gain zero value from these teams. Houston will take some of our Texas recruits if they get in the Big 12. SMU and TCU are just too damn small.

Boise State = JUCO level academics. Their team is built on partial qualifiers and that is not allowed in the Big 12 (see initial issues Nebraska had when Big 12 formed).

UNLV - No specific issues other than we should strive to do better than UNLV.



I'd rather add BYU, which was on the list. Obviously, ND + a local rival (Pitt) would be great but I have a hard time believing we can pull in ND. If we have to go more than 10 teams (without ND + Pitt) then we either raid some ACC/Big East schools or form two super conference with Big12/Big East/ACC (this I do not support but could happen).

This ^^^^

The only thing Boise has going is football. If and when BSU football begins to decline (something that happens to even the big boys...see USC and Oklahoma) we would be stuck with a crappy athletic school with crappy academics way the hell in the middle of nowhere.

 

[Al_4_State]

WVU so Al can tailgate.

Tailgating in Morgantown or Ames with WVU would lead to the national guard being dispatched.

Damn straight.

But in all seriousness, they'd be a good addition, especially with Pitt.

 

[tazclone]

Taz logic...

getting Colorado, getting Utah and losing nobody = a huge failure

Nebraska leaving, A&M leaving, CU leaving, nobody joining = not a huge failure

At what point is it not bad to add somebody? I'm guessing you think ISU would be best off as an independent, split that pie one way!

I'm not going to dig up year old articles and tweets, but the brass at BYU was very shocked that a B12 invite did not come last summer. I was all over reading about it because I wanted them to join last year, the same way half of this board did then and 99% of the board does now. Imagine if Iowa and ISU were both in the MAC and Iowa joined the Big Ten. Yeah I'm sure ISU would turn down a Big 12 or SEC invite in that situation in the heat of the moment the same week Iowa got "called up".

The Big 12 gave them the perfect opportunity last year to maintain their own network they already had (that is in more homes than LHN will ever be), along with better exposure and access to the BCS.

A year later it makes them look weak and indecisive to give up on being independent after just one season. I think they'd have joined either year too, but last year was a slam dunk 99% deal, this year it won't shock me if they say no. Last year the B12 had only lost two teams, now we've lost 3. That doesn't help either.

Where did I say losing Nebraska, CU and a$m wasn't a failure? Fact is I didn't and it was. You wrongly blamed it on Beebe when it was in fact the fault of the presidents of the universities. But it was inevitable because the Big 12 Presidents were never on the same page. CU has wanted to go to the PAC 8/10/12 since the 1950s. Nebraska has always resented Texas especially when they were losing and looking for someone to blame/a$m has always hated Texas

As far as the PAC 12 being successful because they added two teams...you are leaving out one important fact. The Pac 10 went after Texas, OU, OSU and TT. They FAILED in getting them. Because they failed they scrambled and took CU and Utah. Both of which have smaller fanbases than ISU.

When is it bad to add two teams? It is bad if it waters down your product. Many companies have proven time and time again that expansion doesn't equal success and can actually be the demise of the organization. Did the ACC become a better confernce when they added VT, BC and Miami or is it a watered down football product? As far as the PAC 12 goes, time will tell if adding Utah and CU will be beneficial or if it just waters down their product. Now that Utah has to play competition week in and week out, will they slide? Will CU with their financial issues ever climb back up.

I would guess that if The Big 12 went after ND and BYU and ended up with Houston/SMU and Boisie St you would be disappointed and see it as a failure. You would be on here clamoring at how big an idiot Beebe is and claim that it shows the overall weakness of the Big 12 that they had to take lesser programs.

 

[tazclone]

when they play army or navy ... i know it sounds old, but u cant tell me their arnt MILLIONS of service vets ... im not one, but i still watch ... and this may sound way naive and stupid on my part, but why not as a conference try to take a positive approach to the 'school' approach of college also .... we are in a weak positison as a conference on super power teams .... take a strong approach on a student athlete approach that ALSO has national following and MILLIONS upon MILLIONS of alum .... if we are looking to expand, we r not in postion to ask some big boys, but if we approach it diff, we can add many tvs and many great institutions, AND the egos of big boys wont be bruised (even though that pisses me off) .... the big boys can get Ws in FB and and smooth their egos some, and the conference would have a HUGE following ..... U have to work to your strengths, not away from your weaknesses ... Just my opinion

Service Vets and current members tend to follow their home teams more than they do the service acadamies. That is why Army and Navy are not in a major conference and Air Force is stuck in the Mountain West. Air Force has a larger fan base but that is due to their success in the MWC which would dwindle when they came into the Big 12.

 

[MNCyGuy]

Damn straight.

But in all seriousness, they'd be a good addition, especially with Pitt.

I just don't see it. That's a long ways from the rest of the conference. I think you can make that case for BYU because their options are either Big 12, indepedent, or MWC/WAC. Their closest BCS conference won't have them because they're a religious university. Pitt/WVU have a very different situation.

 

[CYKOFAN]

BYU is obviously our first choice but I still wouldn't turn up our noses at UNLV if we wanted to go back to 12 teams, which I wish we would to get back to two divisions and reduce the current number of conference games. They have a strong history in basketball and could compete with the lower teams in the Big 12 in football (they beat us a few years ago). It makes sense geographically to expand into Utah and Nevada. Plenty of tv's and who wouldn't want another excuse for a trip to Vegas.

 

[MNCyGuy]

BYU is obviously our first choice but I still wouldn't turn up our noses at UNLV if we wanted to go back to 12 teams, which I wish we would to get back to two divisions and reduce the current number of conference games. They have a strong history in basketball and could compete with the lower teams in the Big 12 in football (they beat us a few years ago). It makes sense geographically to expand into Utah and Nevada. Plenty of tv's and who wouldn't want another excuse for a trip to Vegas.

Do people in Nevada even follow UNLV? I feel like Vegas would be a more transient city that isn't real attached to local school teams.