John Deere as corporate punching bag

[Jer]

Unfortunately it seems to be happening on both sides. Companies have not shown loyalty to employees in many ways but have employees become less loyal at the same time? How many people do you know that have switched jobs in less than a years time or have agreed to take a job only to turn it down days before their onboarding because another company got back to them and instead of saying they had taken a job, they listened to the offer and then accepted that one? It seems there is the same amount of loyalty to companies as there is loyalty from companies. Neither one is right and I dislike it.

Don't disagree. I'm very loyal because my philosophy is I work incredibly hard to learn and become a wide and deep expert on as much as possible, and I feel I can both contribute the most and feel the most reward from using that knowledge over the years.

I worked at Marsh (60K employees) for 9 years (only moved because I could double my pay and was getting tired of the extreme greed) and I've been where I'm at now for 9.5 years (150ish employees) and have no reason or desire to leave. I'm the go-to expert on anything IT or business because I was one of the leaders that in my first year helped design and direct the building of a whole new admin system (claims, eligibility, billing). We're also a "not for profit" that gives the majority of all revenue back to the people of Iowa in various ways so there isn't "greed".

 

[lionnusmb]

Deere is a weird company when you look at them. They have been having decent profits but when you look at their balance sheets, their debt is climbing at a pretty steady pace for the profit they are turning.

They are buying lots of tech companies. My neighbor Gabor works at JD. I have heard him speak of at least three companies they’ve purchased in the past three years.

 

[IcSyU]

Unfortunately it seems to be happening on both sides. Companies have not shown loyalty to employees in many ways but have employees become less loyal at the same time? How many people do you know that have switched jobs in less than a years time or have agreed to take a job only to turn it down days before their onboarding because another company got back to them and instead of saying they had taken a job, they listened to the offer and then accepted that one? It seems there is the same amount of loyalty to companies as there is loyalty from companies. Neither one is right and I dislike it.

At least when I was at Iowa State, everything you heard from professors was "the fastest way to move up is to move out."

I also know far too many business owners who would rather take home $410,000 this year and lose an employee over $10,000 than invest in their employees. They then ***** about spending $20,000 hiring the replacement. The difference between $400,000 and $410,000 is virtually nothing. The difference between $50,000 and $60,000 is huge.

 

[Jer]

This is true, but the flip side is that cost-cutting also reduces costs for consumers. It's like free trade, net-net society is better off, even though some people lose, and even though its hard to see & feel that broad overall impact.

Note I am not defending JD here, what they're doing seems short-sighted to me. Their whole MO seems sub-optimal to me.

Absolutely. My wife and I actually talked about this a lot the other day. She's the Accounting Director of a local company of probably 300 real estate agents across Iowa and Florida. She has to deal with the new regulations around minimum pay for 40 hr/wk salaried employees, insurance coverage mandates, etc and it certainly makes her job more difficult with those costs going up in a big way.

I reminded her though that it's about the only jump there has been in the past 30 years and if it would have kept up with inflation and the value of the dollar, it's where it should have gotten to naturally. Instead, companies had 30 years of bonkers revenue and now want to raise prices to maintain that massive revenue rather than just making a bit less for a quality of life improvement for their employees.

Again, not trying to be political at all.

 

[Clonehomer]

This is true, but the flip side is that cost-cutting also reduces costs for consumers. It's like free trade, net-net society is better off, even though some people lose, and even though its hard to see & feel that broad overall impact.

Note I am not defending JD here, what they're doing seems short-sighted to me. Their whole MO seems sub-optimal to me.

No it doesn’t. Prices are set based on what people will pay. If the margins are sufficient to produce the good at that price, they will. If not, they won’t. If that good costs less to manufacture, that extra profit goes to the shareholders. Fair markets went out the window a decade ago. Almost all industries are run by monopolies or dualopolies.

 

[WISCY1895]

Certainly not here to defend Deere but there is a severe downturn in the Ag economy right now. Commodity prices are poor so future earnings for Deere and many others in the Ag space are uncertain. Farmers are going to cut costs. One way to do that is to keep older equipment longer and not buy the latest one.
I know I have Deere equipment in my picture but I can tell you I work in agriculture but not in the equipment industry

 

[Turn2]

Remember the stink over "right to repair"? Customers won't even hold their feet to the fire, it seems.

Farmers have clamored for the Right to Repair for years. It’s getting little traction in John Deere’s home state. - Investigate Midwest

The Farm Bureau agreed not to support R2R legislation in exchange for consumer repair diagnostics. Farmers and repair advocates say the tools fall short.

investigatemidwest.org

 

[jsb]

Certainly not here to defend Deere but there is a severe downturn in the Ag economy right now. Commodity prices are poor so future earnings for Deere and many others in the Ag space are uncertain. Farmers are going to cut costs. One way to do that is to keep older equipment longer and not buy the latest one.
I know I have Deere equipment in my picture but I can tell you I work in agriculture but not in the equipment industry

My feelings is companies should be able to withstand the downturns for a while before cutting 35% of salaried workers. Not many years ago the ag industry was at an all time high.

 

[Cyched]

Unfortunately it seems to be happening on both sides. Companies have not shown loyalty to employees in many ways but have employees become less loyal at the same time? How many people do you know that have switched jobs in less than a years time or have agreed to take a job only to turn it down days before their onboarding because another company got back to them and instead of saying they had taken a job, they listened to the offer and then accepted that one? It seems there is the same amount of loyalty to companies as there is loyalty from companies. Neither one is right and I dislike it.

I don’t disagree, but will pose the question of who came first?

Think a lot of younger workers have seen layoffs either from family or friends and have adopted a “look out for yourself” mentality. Which may not seem right, but sometimes that’s what you’ve got to do to advance in today’s world.

People ultimately don’t like interviewing for and switching jobs unless they feel they have to, but the days of working for one company your entire career are gone and not coming back.

And ultimately finding the best situation for yourself isn’t a bad thing. I switched jobs a couple times early in my career, and have been with my current company 6 years now. Good fit and good career development, so no desire to leave unless something drastically changes.

 

[cyfanatic13]

Unfortunately it seems to be happening on both sides. Companies have not shown loyalty to employees in many ways but have employees become less loyal at the same time? How many people do you know that have switched jobs in less than a years time or have agreed to take a job only to turn it down days before their onboarding because another company got back to them and instead of saying they had taken a job, they listened to the offer and then accepted that one? It seems there is the same amount of loyalty to companies as there is loyalty from companies. Neither one is right and I dislike it.

Last month at my work we had a guy accept a job, email us late the Friday afternoon before his first day that following Monday that he had a family situation pop up and wondering if he could push his start date back a week. It turned into two weeks due to timing on both ends with the 4th of July mixed in there.

Then the day of his new start date, HR sent him an email first thing in the morning confirming that he’d be there later that day. He emailed back at the exact minute he was supposed to be there that he wouldn’t be taking the job as we were “dishonest with him on our pay structure”. I’ve sat through that part of the process multiple times and know our HR team is extremely clear with that side of things.

It was super annoying as the main part of my job is writing the training calendars for new hires and basically mapping out their first two weeks to get them on their feet. It’s not too hard but super time consuming so I wasted a lot of time for nothing

 

[spierceisu]

I don’t disagree, but will pose the question of who came first?

Think a lot of younger workers have seen layoffs either from family or friends and have adopted a “look out for yourself” mentality. Which may not seem right, but sometimes that’s what you’ve got to do to advance in today’s world.

People ultimately don’t like interviewing for and switching jobs unless they feel they have to, but the days of working for one company your entire career are gone and not coming back.

And ultimately finding the best situation for yourself isn’t a bad thing. I switched jobs a couple times early in my career, and have been with my current company 6 years now. Good fit and good career development, so no desire to leave unless something drastically changes.

I am ok with looking out for yourself, but there are so many people that change jobs every year chasing the almighty dollar and never seem happy anywhere. That can't look good on an application for a new job.

 

[ScottyP]

Deere is a manufacturing company that wants to think its a tech company.

 

[Cyched]

I am ok with looking out for yourself, but there are so many people that change jobs every year chasing the almighty dollar and never seem happy anywhere. That can't look good on an application for a new job.

Yeah if I’m looking at resumes, someone with a job history like that throws up some red flags.

If you can at least stay places a few years and explain your reasoning for moving (better opportunity, moved, etc) you’ll be fine.

 

[Turn2]

My feelings is companies should be able to withstand the downturns for a while before cutting 35% of salaried workers. Not many years ago the ag industry was at an all time high.

Especially when Ag & Turf is <40% of their business, and the "huge downturn" in Ag is only compared to the previous few years and primarily due to greedflation by companies the size of Deere.

 

[bos]

I don’t disagree, but will pose the question of who came first?

Think a lot of younger workers have seen layoffs either from family or friends and have adopted a “look out for yourself” mentality. Which may not seem right, but sometimes that’s what you’ve got to do to advance in today’s world.

People ultimately don’t like interviewing for and switching jobs unless they feel they have to, but the days of working for one company your entire career are gone and not coming back.

And ultimately finding the best situation for yourself isn’t a bad thing. I switched jobs a couple times early in my career, and have been with my current company 6 years now. Good fit and good career development, so no desire to leave unless something drastically changes.

Yeah I dont love it. Since Ive moved back here Ive worked for 5 different organizations all in varying sectors. Its been the only way to move up financially and with skill opportunities. I am also sensitive to sudden culture changes and dont have the patience to fight for change when it comes to providing for my family so I move on. At least a few of those places, I have left not with ill will but positive advice to the exit interview and ultimately have watched as they improve the situation for those that stayed. So I take a little solace in that. I have been at my current employer for 7 years now. Ups and downs and all that but ultimately Im at an age where Im starting to taper back on my expectations and trying to sail out the other side to retirement. Definitely not a "company man".

 

[Messi]

Last month at my work we had a guy accept a job, email us late the Friday afternoon before his first day that following Monday that he had a family situation pop up and wondering if he could push his start date back a week. It turned into two weeks due to timing on both ends with the 4th of July mixed in there.

Then the day of his new start date, HR sent him an email first thing in the morning confirming that he’d be there later that day. He emailed back at the exact minute he was supposed to be there that he wouldn’t be taking the job as we were “dishonest with him on our pay structure”. I’ve sat through that part of the process multiple times and know our HR team is extremely clear with that side of things.

It was super annoying as the main part of my job is writing the training calendars for new hires and basically mapping out their first two weeks to get them on their feet. It’s not too hard but super time consuming so I wasted a lot of time for nothing

sucks you wasted that time but honestly probably dodged a bullet if thats how he handles his business

 

[KidSilverhair]

Again, not trying to be political at all.

That’s not political. That’s just math.

 

[Marcelason78]

Certainly not here to defend Deere but there is a severe downturn in the Ag economy right now. Commodity prices are poor so future earnings for Deere and many others in the Ag space are uncertain. Farmers are going to cut costs. One way to do that is to keep older equipment longer and not buy the latest one.
I know I have Deere equipment in my picture but I can tell you I work in agriculture but not in the equipment industry

How much of the downturn is a result of the South Korean and Indian manufacturers impacting JD tractor sales?

 

[ScottyP]

Investors like to look at companies and see if they can squeeze as much as possible out of it short-term. Even if that means hurting the employees and/or customers long term. I saw this first-hand where a hedge fund manager tried to to a proxy takeover of the company I work for because he thought he could get more profit from it and eventually split up the company.

 

[Tre4ISU]

Deere is a manufacturing company that wants to think its a tech company.

Deere is moving quickly toward being a tech company. Their guidance and overall tech package is better than anyone else's at this point and you can move their stuff into a lot of other brands.

Everything we've ever owned is green but there's at least a solid chance that won't be the case if we're ever in the market for something simply due to moving things to Mexico and how they operate in general. I will say though, one thing that a lot of people don't get or don't think about is that on the farming side a lot of equipment decisions are driven by service and proximity to service/parts and those things are completely isolated from JD corporate. We happen to have really good shop guys in our area so it's hard to walk away from that.