How Long Before Our (CF) Wrestling Experts Get Worried?
- Thread starter bellzisu
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I was at the meet last night and can honestly say that other than Reader and Ward's match I found it more entertaining to watch the Gymnasts . The Weatherman choke-out was pretty scary. Imagine trying to do your floor routine with that going on right next to you.
I don't think it is KJ's fault and its reasonable to wait a couple years before panicking for things to stabilize.
I don't think it is KJ's fault and its reasonable to wait a couple years before panicking for things to stabilize.
Yep, it's easy to see why we are where we are. The lineup of guys that we were counting on being here would be very formidable. Long, Clark, Jensen, Taylor, Beard, & Thompson would make the program much better.
That said, they are NOT here and where we are is VERY scary. Next year will likely be worse. We lose maybe our best two wrestlers to graduation in Drouin & Reader. Former walk-on Sorenson will be our best returning starter. We will have weights with wrestlers who should be D2 or career backups (133 & 141) and other weights with logjams. 3 of our best wrestlers are all natural 165 with Sorenson, Spangler & Moreno. Gadsen and Ward will have to battle 197, so we will not improve there. I think you could argue that the only weight we will be better at is 125 with Finch.
And I do not feel that there is a ton of talent being recruited. If you look at the rankings of the recruits we are bringing in, they are well below what other top 10 schools bring in. We are used to that in Football and Basketball, but in Wrestling, we should be bringing in the top talent.
This is what concerns many Cyclone wrestling followers. The wrestling coach at ISU should have a huge presence and impact on recruitng the top talent, both in Iowa and the country. We have a tremendous tradition.
Yet KJ has yet to prove he has the "pull" to get the talent here. Bono was responsible for the best of last year's class, and he's gone now.
This. This is the biggest thing that I have been questioning since Cael and Bono left. It seems like we don't have a solid recruiter at all anymore, and that needs to get fixed and fast. Otherwise I feel like we're in for Douglass v.2
I don't know if I agree with that. I think Finch and Goettl are here because of KJ tenure with Sunkist Wrestling in Arizona.
I want us to be national champs as much as anybody, but it's a lot harder to be a dominant program in the sport now than it was years ago when it was basically Iowa, Iowa State, Oklahoma and Oky State. There are now too many good coaches and programs out there. Probably good for the sport but a lot harder for a few teams or a single team to dominate year in and year out, and I think Iowa will find that out. A top 10 finish would be great this year, and as KJ gets more established I'll be happy with consistent top 5 finishes and an occasional good shot at a national title. I think that's about the best anybody's going to do in the future, and that includes Iowa.
Also, my other worry is about something I"m not sure is going to happen. Will the Big 12 drop wrestling as a conference sport next year now that Nebraska left? If so, will we be able to convince any remaining schools to add the sport (highly unlikely) to get it back to varsity status?
If we all thought watching Chizik win a national title this year at Auburn was bad, get ready to possibly see it again at nationals. Cael has Penn State on a roll and they could win the whole thing...with one-time ISU commit Taylor in the running for a NCAA title as a freshman and ISU transfer Long scoring points.
I will say watching Penn St. go from barely a top twenty team to my pick to win the whole thing in March and us going from a top three team to a barely a top twenty team all in a year and a half is very disturbing. That said Long, Clark and Thompson in the lineup would put us in the top five. Would'ves and could'ves don't win matches.
What if next year we can do this -
125 - finch
133 - goetl
141 - cozart
149 - weatherman
157 - moreno
165 - spangler
174 - sorenson
184 - gadson
197 - ward
hwt - simonson/gibson
This looks like a pretty solid line up to me. Odds are it would be too hard for some of them to cut weight but it looks nice on paper.
125 - finch
133 - goetl
141 - cozart
149 - weatherman
157 - moreno
165 - spangler
174 - sorenson
184 - gadson
197 - ward
hwt - simonson/gibson
This looks like a pretty solid line up to me. Odds are it would be too hard for some of them to cut weight but it looks nice on paper.
Weatherman looks small at 157, not sure about Moreno. If they have all spring/summer/fall to do it the cut would be totally doable and give us a very solid lineup.
I don't know a whole lot about wrestling, either. But I don't think I'd be too worried at this point. Iowa is currently winning, but we aren't a contender in any sense of the word, IMO. We backed out of the national duals (which I didn't agree with), so we gave away a chance to really test the team.
If a team returns one of the top coaches in the game and has a young/inexperienced team, and takes a step back for a year, then it should come as little surprise that a team who is replacing one of the top coaches in the country and has a young/inexperienced team would take a step back as well. We're talking about Iowa State here. You won't stay down (in the sense that you aren't quite getting over the hump) for long.
If a team returns one of the top coaches in the game and has a young/inexperienced team, and takes a step back for a year, then it should come as little surprise that a team who is replacing one of the top coaches in the country and has a young/inexperienced team would take a step back as well. We're talking about Iowa State here. You won't stay down (in the sense that you aren't quite getting over the hump) for long.
The days of "We are ISU" will not necessarily get the people here. Looking like the loss of Cael was just huge.
+1 To most Cael was Iowa State and when he didn't want to be at ISU then everyone probably wonders if they want to be at Iowa State.
I don't think I'd say that. We'll be better at 125 for sure. Weatherman will be better next year, whether it's at '49 or '57. Sorenson isn't going to regress at 165 and given how much he's improved in his career I'd say he'll be better next year. If it's Shafer at 184, he will improve. I honestly think Gadson will be a step up from Ward at '97 and if Ward wants to wrestle I say he needs to cut back to 184. He's had plenty of chances to prove himself. As with Sorenson, I think Simonson is better with another year under his belt. Are we going to magically jump into the top 3? Probably not, but I do expect that we'll be better at several of out weights.
I like the way you're thinking but I too don't know how many of them could handle those cuts. I think it will be Sorenson at 165 and Spangler at 174. As I said above, from everything I've heard, Gadson is going to be at 197 and I hope he gets the spot. I'd rather build toward the future than put up with another year of Ward's routine.
Last night sucked....a lot. I'm glad to see we have some "fringe" fans here asking questions, but as someone else said, some of us "regulars" that see these questions week after week are probably a little oversensitive. This year was not going to be pretty and we are not a good dual team. The loss of depth we have suffered is most evident in the dual format. If Drouin can come back healthy, I think we have 4 potential AA's on the squad with a champ in Reader and that probably puts us in the top 10-12 at nationals. If we can pull that off, that's about as good as we could have hoped for considering what we've gone through.
Nobody has a crystal ball that can guarantee that there are better days ahead. I'm in the boat that whatever happens this year is what it is. If we're still outside the top 10 next year or top 5 after that, I'll get concerned. One thing I will concede is that I'd really like to see a bigger name assistant on the staff that has some recruiting ties. When you see what a guy like Sammie Henson has done in a couple of years at OU, you realize that we're are definitely fighting an uphill battle there.
I saw some of the Oklahoma wrestlers at the airport this morning? One of the smaller guys had a nasty looking shiner. Small consolation for a tough night.
I also got to talk to their head coach for a few minutes. He seemed pretty high on KJ since KJ had been his Olympic coach.
