You're the Commissioner. Now Fix Wrestling!

[DantheFan]

Somebody (jokingly I think) mentioned cages. Another mentioned scoring by rounds like boxing. David's post match interview got me thinking. He talked about his style as being more 'finesse' based.

I've been trying to compare our sport to boxing. Nobody whined (much) when Muhammad Ali danced and avoided direct contact with Frazier, Liston and Foreman. He's still one of the all time greats and could score in flurries. But he was in a small ring and could be cornered with good footwork and quickness by his opponent.

This is a big stretch, but could wrestling do something similar? It would eliminate just about all stalling issues and set up great matchups of differing styles. Imagine Cody vs Lewan confined to a small space. Or David looking for his opening while avoiding Messenbrink's bullrush. Could be fun!

A pit with padded walls, maybe? It might be challenging to watch, though.
A reinforced plexi barrier around the mat?
I agree that having a physical barrier around the mat would be a fun way to remove the option of fleeing the mat and promote more constant action. I doubt it would be adopted, but you never know!

@Cyclone Pfan mentioned a "JV meet" to open dual meets. I think a full-on opening meet might drag things on a bit too much, but I love the idea of featuring a couple of "Opening Acts," say a couple of redshirt matches, that don't count on the official record but give some guys on the team a taste of the big show. Having the coaches agree on some intriguing non-starter matches to showcase up-and-coming guys throughout the season would be great.

I like @crablegs idea of a point system from the dual season jumpstarting NCAA team scoring at the individual tournament. This definitely incentivizes wrestling duals and rewards teams with a deep and well-developed roster.
I don't know who mentioned it, but using a point system for seeding makes sense too. This rewards the guys that actually wrestle throughout the season. You gotta wrestle the matches to earn your seed. This is more or less how they do it on the international level too.

 

[DantheFan]

I feel like someone already mentioned this but I'm not sure.

A March Madness style dual tournament would be pretty amazing.
Imagine getting the 1 seed in our pool and hosting some epic duals in that format.

I'm not sure how this would work logistically. Start the conference season almost immediately and do conference tournaments earlier? I don't see anyone being okay with getting rid of the individual tournament so it makes things pretty tight.

 

[Mead For My Horses]

There are some really interesting recommendations here. Is there a group that is taking seriously proposals for rule changes?

There is a rules committee, but I don't know who is involved. They did institute the 3 point take down this year, which was well received, but change is generally pretty slow, it seems.

 

[CyGold]

Stalling. That’s it IMO.

I can see why people don’t want to watch two guys hand fight the entire match and do nothing.

Or have guys get hit for stalling when they are literally in the act of taking a guy down, but others can run away like scared babies and not get anything. It’s broken…. and frustrating as hell.

I agree with this. The sport is in great shape IMO especially with the new 3 point takedown. Input some sort of back out/step out rule being an auto stall and that solves the ref's self interpitation problem.

Side rant regarding wrestling from 1 knee: - For everyone that bashes on knee wrestling and wants it to be illegal. Please read this... If you watch quality guys who wrestle from a knee they can shoot/drag/snap and score from that position... IF you make that illegal you might as well pass a rule against taller wrestlers. Most wrestlers are short/stalky in stature and they don't need to drop to a knee to lower their level. However, taller guys like Ayala, Degen, Biscoglia, Mark Branch and the great David Carr often drop to a knee to lower levels and change tactics. They also use their long arms to their favor and score from that position. Shorter guys can just push forward and bull rush opponents without lowering their levels but they really aren't taking any shots or trying to score (other than trying to get a stall call) at little to no risk... This approach is also a stall tactic. David Carr had some great comments on stalling calls vs. Mitchell Mesenbrink who was just pushing and rushing forward. Let the guys who are technical, slick or whatever you want to call them use their strategies as long as they end up scoring. That's one of the things I like the most about wrestling... Anybody with any-body type can compete with current rules. There, I said it... come at me bro

 

[mdk2isu]

Implement a shot clock from neutral. If there is no takedown attempt (legit shots - fakes don't count, throw attempts, slide by with an attempt to get behind, snap down into a front head and arm position with attempts to score) by either wrestler for 30 seconds then both get a stall warning. If either individual's shot clock gets to 1 minute without a legit takedown attempt, then that individual is hit with a stalling call.

The riding time point is only awarded if there were back points earned.

In collaboration with the above, if there are no back points earned after a minute of riding, the match restarts in neutral with no escape point. An escape point could still be earned like one is now, same for reversals.

Back points have to be scored in order to earn bonus points for the team score.

 

[cytor]

Folding chairs admissable.

 

[buf87]

The problem that happened with the 3 point takedown is, it allowed more stalling in the close matches. When up 4-1 in the 3rd, you can run a lot because you need the warning, 2 regular stall call and the 2 point stall call to make a difference. I do like the 3 point takedown. Most wrestlers aren't taking advantage of it to score a major.
The only time I saw close to that many stall calls being called was David Carr vs Messenbrink.

Maybe a reversal needs to be 3 points also.

 

[CyGold]

The problem that happened with the 3 point takedown is, it allowed more stalling in the close matches. When up 4-1 in the 3rd, you can run a lot because you need the warning, 2 regular stall call and the 2 point stall call to make a difference. I do like the 3 point takedown. Most wrestlers aren't taking advantage of it to score a major.
The only time I saw close to that many stall calls being called was David Carr vs Messenbrink.

Maybe a reversal needs to be 3 points also.

I like the 3,2,1 scoring setup currently. I already mentioned in another post on this thread that I'd change the rules on the feet to make an step out or backout result in an automatic stalling.

I'd also make a couple minor changes to top/bottom. 1. Give one point for each minute of RT advantage earned (beyond the 1 point total). 2. Have auto restarts after each 30 seconds of riding (unless someone is in a danger position). This would prevent the top guy from just getting a leg in and keeping the opponent belly down for a long period of time and it takes the Stalling call away from the Ref. The top rider would know he has 30 seconds to get a turn/exposure so it would cause him to take more risk sooner. Also, most bottom wrestlers have the advantage on restarts so it would make it harder to ride. Restart positions are typically exciting as the bottom guy gets a chance to explode into a standup/roll/etc. I think things get boring when a guy gets tangled up and can't move from the bottom position. Think about how MM was able to escape from David on a restart position in short time. That was a fight from both top and bottom wrestlers. This equalizer would also offset the need for making a reversal 3 points because IF there is a reversal then there would be the chance of gaining additional RT points (assuming there is enough time in the match). Hence 2 pt reversal and ride for another minute = 3 points scored.

 

[Nolaeer]

could just wrestle until 1 guy is pinned or taps out.

 

[alabamacyclone]

I agree with this. The sport is in great shape IMO especially with the new 3 point takedown. Input some sort of back out/step out rule being an auto stall and that solves the ref's self interpitation problem.

Side rant regarding wrestling from 1 knee: - For everyone that bashes on knee wrestling and wants it to be illegal. Please read this... If you watch quality guys who wrestle from a knee they can shoot/drag/snap and score from that position... IF you make that illegal you might as well pass a rule against taller wrestlers. Most wrestlers are short/stalky in stature and they don't need to drop to a knee to lower their level. However, taller guys like Ayala, Degen, Biscoglia, Mark Branch and the great David Carr often drop to a knee to lower levels and change tactics. They also use their long arms to their favor and score from that position. Shorter guys can just push forward and bull rush opponents without lowering their levels but they really aren't taking any shots or trying to score (other than trying to get a stall call) at little to no risk... This approach is also a stall tactic. David Carr had some great comments on stalling calls vs. Mitchell Mesenbrink who was just pushing and rushing forward. Let the guys who are technical, slick or whatever you want to call them use their strategies as long as they end up scoring. That's one of the things I like the most about wrestling... Anybody with any-body type can compete with current rules. There, I said it... come at me bro

I don't know that I agree with this. Some of the taller guys seem to really have an advantage when they are shot on, or in scrambles. I think that I some of Terukina's issues in trying to finish.

Moreover, I still hate knee wrestling. I would like to see a count implemented, much like it is for hanging on ankles to prevent an escape, or holding onto your opponent in a standup without a mat return attempt. A guy hits his knees, the count starts. He has a count of 5 to take his shot or get off his knees. Many of them simply do it not to get under their opponent, but to avoid their opponent getting under them. It is a stall tactic and should be recognized as such.

 

[CyGold]

I don't know that I agree with this. Some of the taller guys seem to really have an advantage when they are shot on, or in scrambles. I think that I some of Terukina's issues in trying to finish.

Moreover, I still hate knee wrestling. I would like to see a count implemented, much like it is for hanging on ankles to prevent an escape, or holding onto your opponent in a standup without a mat return attempt. A guy hits his knees, the count starts. He has a count of 5 to take his shot or get off his knees. Many of them simply do it not to get under their opponent, but to avoid their opponent getting under them. It is a stall tactic and should be recognized as such.

I can agree to disagree. Almost any position can be used as a stall tactic. You can't outlaw all positions.

 

[G-imJustafan]

Stalling. That’s it IMO.

I can see why people don’t want to watch two guys hand fight the entire match and do nothing.

Or have guys get hit for stalling when they are literally in the act of taking a guy down, but others can run away like scared babies and not get anything. It’s broken…. and frustrating as hell.

stalling leaves way too much to ref's discretion /

stalling on a whole need to re evaluated and have some concrete rules out in place

like when hear coaches yell - shoot him out - shot him out

that's stalling should be called every time

 

[crablegs]

stalling leaves way too much to ref's discretion /

stalling on a whole need to re evaluated and have some concrete rules out in place

like when hear coaches yell - shoot him out - shot him out

that's stalling should be called every time

Shooting should be stalling?

 

[G-imJustafan]

yes shooting a wrestler intentionally out of bounds is stalling.

 

[crablegs]

yes shooting a wrestler intentionally out of bounds is stalling.

And you want refs to determine “intent” now when someone shoots? Good luck with that.