Severance: Season 2 (Spoilers)

[CydeofFries]

Didn't watch the first season when it came out and binged my way to caught up in the last 5 days. I am a little conflicted about this show.

Season 1 sucked me in with the mystery, comedy, and sci-fi that's up my alley. It was a quick watch and I was really excited to get go through season 2.

Unlike most of you on this board, I feel like season 2 has been a slog. While the season 1 felt like all episodes were connected and seemed to flow seemlessly, the first half of season 2 didn't feel very connected even though they were supposed to be.

I appreciate the last half of the season giving more context to how the world we are viewing came to be while slowly moving the story. I just wish it was the other way around, moving the story while adding a little context here and there.

Which leads me to my actual complaint. I feel for every detail or mystery figured out there are three new ones. And at what point do they actually start finishing it out. I worry it ends one of three ways:

• Like Lost where some people are statisfied but many upset they didn't answer all the questions they set up
• Like Game of Thrones where they ran out of steam (along with source material) and just rushed an end
• Or like a show like Serenity where a great story was set up but the show was cancelled

Sorry for the long post. More of me just needing to get it all off my chest since no one I know is watching.

Continue with your praise; I don't fault you cause I think it's a good show.

I think you are mostly right, and someone earlier touched on it as well. Every episode on its own is a good episode, but it also doesn't feel as strong cohesively as season 1 did.

It feels like they took the wrong lesson from season 2 of twin peaks (RIP Lynch). Laura Palmer's killer was never supposed to be identified. Her death was supposed to be the catalyst that led to Coop going to the town and then telling the stories of the lives of the town and characters. The mystery was always the window dressing, never the story. The town was the story.

Lumen/Severance wasn't the story in season 1, Mark, Helly, Dylan, and Irving were. In season 2, it switched, and now Lumen and Severance is the story.

And I get it, especially for season 1 they really needed to up the ante and get a good cliff hanger/plot hook to get renewed, but it forced them away from being able to do the satire of office drone work that really elevated season 1.

 

[Mr Janny]

I think you are mostly right, and someone earlier touched on it as well. Every episode on its own is a good episode, but it also doesn't feel as strong cohesively as season 1 did.

It feels like they took the wrong lesson from season 2 of twin peaks (RIP Lynch). Laura Palmer's killer was never supposed to be identified. Her death was supposed to be the catalyst that led to Coop going to the town and then telling the stories of the lives of the town and characters. The mystery was always the window dressing, never the story. The town was the story.

Lumen/Severance wasn't the story in season 1, Mark, Helly, Dylan, and Irving were. In season 2, it switched, and now Lumen and Severance is the story.

And I get it, especially for season 1 they really needed to up the ante and get a good cliff hanger/plot hook to get renewed, but it forced them away from being able to do the satire of office drone work that really elevated season 1.

Disagree heavily with this. This show has always primarily been an examination of corporatism and the nature of work. It's the backbone of the entire story. The trials and tribulations of Mark, Helly, Dylan, and Irving are window dressing for the larger discussion. The latest episode continues the overall theme by showing us how a corporation chewed up and spit out an entire town. Lumon did a massive amount of damage to Salt's Neck, both while the factory was active, and after it pulled out, but as it was said in the show, there really wasn't a town before Lumon. So, does that mean the denizens owe what little they have to the corporation?
Those are the very same questions that we ask in our own society. That's the type of message that the show has been trying to convey, and it's using all of the characters, not just the main four, to deliver that message. This week we shed some light on Cobel's path, a "lifer" who gave everything to the company. We've seen the challenges from Milkshake's POV, as a middle manager and person of color. These are all stories illustrating that central theme. It goes significantly deeper than just answering "What are those MDR folks really up to?"

 

[Jeffreyisu]

What in the hell were they thinking for Episode 8? What a waste of an episode. That could have been shrunk down to 10 mins and still gotten the same point across.

 

[Mr Janny]

Setting up a lot to occur in the season finale. Cobel's line about how if Cold Harbor were completed, Gemma would already be dead, makes me curious if that means her Gemma personality, or the physical death of her body.

This episode dropped what could be some pretty big clues. I guess the episode makes multiple references (even the title of the episode) to a classic Twilight Zone episode called "After Hours". They lifted some of the exact dialogue, when Cobel is taking Mark and his sister to the cabin, she talks to the guard about going to the 9th floor to find a golden thimble. This is straight out of the Twilight Zone episode, which is about a woman who can't seem to leave a department store, only to find out that she's a mannequin, that has been temporarily brought to life. Very much tracks with the overall theme, particularly as it relates to Gemma.

There's a theory out there that Gemma's personality, the one that Mark married, is actually an innie, that only existed as an experiment by Lumon. Not sure if I buy that, but it's an interesting possibility.

 

[CloniesForLife]

Setting up a lot to occur in the season finale. Cobel's line about how if Cold Harbor were completed, Gemma would already be dead, makes me curious if that means her Gemma personality, or the physical death of her body.

This episode dropped what could be some pretty big clues. I guess the episode makes multiple references (even the title of the episode) to a classic Twilight Zone episode called "After Hours". They lifted some of the exact dialogue, when Cobel is taking Mark and his sister to the cabin, she talks to the guard about going to the 9th floor to find a golden thimble. This is straight out of the Twilight Zone episode, which is about a woman who can't seem to leave a department store, only to find out that she's a mannequin, that has been temporarily brought to life. Very much tracks with the overall theme, particularly as it relates to Gemma.

There's a theory out there that Gemma's personality, the one that Mark married, is actually an innie, that only existed as an experiment by Lumon. Not sure if I buy that, but it's an interesting possibility.

How would that theory work since Ms Casey is who she is on the severed floor?

 

[Mr Janny]

How would that theory work since Ms Casey is who she is on the severed floor?

Not sure. Maybe they have specific controls to enable different parts of the chip in different areas, ala the Overtime contingency.

Or it could all be bunk. Who knows?

 

[Mr Janny]

Wow.

Bring on season 3.

 

[SolterraCyclone]

Wow.

Bring on season 3.

Just finished the finale myself.

 

[ghyland7]

Wow.

Bring on season 3.

I really hope we don't have to wait 3 more years.

 

[AirWalke]

That was a crazy finale. Not an all-time classic like Season 1’s finale but honestly it’s hard to top that one. This one was still greatly enjoyable even if the ending did piss me off. (Only because of relationship drama… the conclusion itself is fine)

 

[Angie]

I cannot wait for the C&M memes of Milchick dancing. That guy is frigging fantastic.

 

[Angie]

That was a crazy finale. Not an all-time classic like Season 1’s finale but honestly it’s hard to top that one. This one was still greatly enjoyable even if the ending did piss me off. (Only because of relationship drama… the conclusion itself is fine)

Yeah, Jenny and I were talking about that last night.

Spoiler

It’s good a character development for Marc S to stay and protect his own interests, which Jenny said was the obvious and right thing to do.

To me, it was illogical. He is likely going to die either way. But at least if he had left, Mark Scout would have had a life. Best case scenario, he and Helly have about 10 more minutes together. Like she said, “I am her.”

The only chance is if Jame sees enough Kier in Helly that he orders it to be her dominant personality.

 

[bos]

If they ever full integrate that dude is gonna have some wild memories. Two women to love, a murder, and goat people. Guess my deskjob isnt so bad.

 

[Angie]

If they ever full integrate that dude is gonna have some wild memories. Two women to love, a murder, and goat people. Guess my deskjob isnt so bad.

I like how he didn’t even pause about what happened in the elevator after leaving the goat lady. I suppose you would just get to a “whatever” point.

 

[Angie]

Also. MINOR SPOILER, but not really and mostly talking around it:

The reason that Cobel gave for Cold Harbor. There has to be more to it than that. Because obviously they have already been testing the stretches of the severance by Ms Casey and Mark S interacting in therapy sessions, Dylan meeting his outie’s wife, etc. They already KNOW what happens in those situations.

I also have questions on Gemma’s activity inside the room. It was related to her, obviously, but it wasn’t an activity for which she was even in the room when it first occurred. One would think that it would be more a trigger for the original person who experienced it.

 

[SolterraCyclone]

Yeah, Jenny and I were talking about that last night.

Spoiler

It’s good a character development for Marc S to stay and protect his own interests, which Jenny said was the obvious and right thing to do.

To me, it was illogical. He is likely going to die either way. But at least if he had left, Mark Scout would have had a life. Best case scenario, he and Helly have about 10 more minutes together. Like she said, “I am her.”

The only chance is if Jame sees enough Kier in Helly that he orders it to be her dominant personality.

Spoiler: Spoiler

While not a happy ending, I thought the ending was great! And very relatable on both fronts. Outtie Mark doing whatever he can, including essentially begging his innie, to get his wife back. And innie Mark clearly not trusting outtie Mark, as their conversation went completely off the rails.

It was clear, at a surface level, outtie Mark was sympathetic to his innie, but at the end, it was obvious he didn’t really view his innie as a sentient person. Basically treating his and Hellie’s relationship as a fun, little high school crush “oh hey! I hear you like someone down there. That’s great!”. That really rubbed innie Mark the wrong way.

I thought innie Mark was completely justified in his action, even if it was an emotional decision and he hadn’t thought the plan all the way through. Would you go through with the greatest sacrifice you can give, for someone you don’t trust and/or particularly like after one conversation? It reminded me of the ending of The Graduate.

I think it’s clear innie and outtie Mark cannot both have happy endings. One will have to lose or both will. It’s a Greek tragedy unfolding.

 

[SolterraCyclone]

Also. MINOR SPOILER, but not really and mostly talking around it:

The reason that Cobel gave for Cold Harbor. There has to be more to it than that. Because obviously they have already been testing the stretches of the severance by Ms Casey and Mark S interacting in therapy sessions, Dylan meeting his outie’s wife, etc. They already KNOW what happens in those situations.

I also have questions on Gemma’s activity inside the room. It was related to her, obviously, but it wasn’t an activity for which she was even in the room when it first occurred. One would think that it would be more a trigger for the original person who experienced it.

Yeah that was my question. I’m still unsure what Cold Harbor is or is trying to achieve. How would it change the world? And why would Gemma have died after it?

 

[Angie]

Spoiler: Spoiler

While not a happy ending, I thought the ending was great! And very relatable on both fronts. Outtie Mark doing whatever he can, including essentially begging his innie, to get his wife back. And innie Mark clearly not trusting outtie Mark, as their conversation went completely off the rails.

It was clear, at a surface level, outtie Mark was sympathetic to his innie, but at the end, it was obvious he didn’t really view his innie as a sentient person. Basically treating his and Hellie’s relationship as a fun, little high school crush “oh hey! I hear you like someone down there. That’s great!”. That really rubbed innie Mark the wrong way.

I thought innie Mark was completely justified in his action, even if it was an emotional decision and he hadn’t thought the plan all the way through. Would you go through with the greatest sacrifice you can give, for someone you don’t trust and/or particularly like after one conversation? It reminded me of the ending of The Graduate.

I think it’s clear innie and outtie Mark cannot both have happy endings. One will have to lose or both will. It’s a Greek tragedy unfolding.

I do totally agree! I found the ending very satisfying. I’m not at all mad at it, my pragmatism just doesn’t agree with the decision, if that makes sense? It was another exemplary episode. And it really explained why we saw the entire episode about Gemma, and even the entire episode about Cobel. (I know people were mad at those.)

Yeah that was my question. I’m still unsure what Cold Harbor is or is trying to achieve. How would it change the world? And why would Gemma have died after it?

Right? Wouldn’t it have made more sense to just have a widow/widower/bereaved parent/whatever, who was in a ton of grief, do those activities while getting paid as a severed employee rather than kidnapping and eventually killing someone? I mean, there certainly wouldn’t be as much of a plot or storyline, and we certainly wouldn’t be as invested. But the math just doesn’t math, there is an easy way around it. Something more has to be going on.

 

[wenkeej]

I do totally agree! I found the ending very satisfying. I’m not at all mad at it, my pragmatism just doesn’t agree with the decision, if that makes sense? It was another exemplary episode. And it really explained why we saw the entire episode about Gemma, and even the entire episode about Cobel. (I know people were mad at those.)



Right? Wouldn’t it have made more sense to just have a widow/widower/bereaved parent/whatever, who was in a ton of grief, do those activities while getting paid as a severed employee rather than kidnapping and eventually killing someone? I mean, there certainly wouldn’t be as much of a plot or storyline, and we certainly wouldn’t be as invested. But the math just doesn’t math, there is an easy way around it. Something more has to be going on.

I'm hopeful there is more to the reasons behind why Marc and Gemma are in the positions they are in, from a story-telling, world-building perspective. My next point is a larger thought based on your comments but not specific to your point

Parts of this show remind me of an episode of Buffy, the dream episode (Restless) at the end of season 4. There is the Cheese Man that keeps popping up. He has no meaning to the story other than he exists.

I do think most everything in Severance may have some meaning, but there may be parts of it that exist just to exist. Don't forget that this is being made by Ben Stiller and I wouldn't put it past him to add some things to this show just to amuse him to see them on screen and watch everyone try to put meaning to them.

 

[SolterraCyclone]

I'm hopeful there is more to the reasons behind why Marc and Gemma are in the positions they are in, from a story-telling, world-building perspective. My next point is a larger thought based on your comments but not specific to your point

Parts of this show remind me of an episode of Buffy, the dream episode (Restless) at the end of season 4. There is the Cheese Man that keeps popping up. He has no meaning to the story other than he exists.

I do think most everything in Severance may have some meaning, but there may be parts of it that exist just to exist. Don't forget that this is being made by Ben Stiller and I wouldn't put it past him to add some things to this show just to amuse him to see them on screen and watch everyone try to put meaning to them.

Yeah I agree. The goats in particular seem more symbolic rather than integral to the plot

Although the goat herder played an important role in the last episode. Could have used more backstory there.