RECRUITING: Jaren Holmes commits to Iowa State

[WhoISthis]

No, I think its comical that a poster disagrees with you and you want to BET THEM. Their reply isn't to YOUR liking and you CALL THEM OUT again.

Lighten Up. It's OK for people to have different opinions than you!! It doesn't mean they are dumb or even wrong!

Like you said, Relax It is a Message Board. And it's not a generic message board, it's an ISU Sport message board. So if people are optimistic about the players we recruit- AWESOME. If you can't be a FANATIC about your team, what can you be a Kool-Aid drinker? You don't get any virtual money for being the "I Told You So" guy.

So you agree or don’t agree on Conditt?

Sounds like you’re being overly emotional about a different opinion on Conditt and next year, and voicing my reply that I disagree wasn’t to your standards.


A bet on a sports message board evokes such emotion? Relax, it's a message board.

Here's a hint, the bet is a device to point out the laughable fallacy in the poster's response. They don't actually disagree with the risk profile in regards to not improving. No one was contending it is not possible, but rather unlikely.

 

[cyclonepower]

I think he'll hurt us the same on offense if we use our 5 like that again. Maybe more, as Conditt was surprisingly a decent passer at the 5. Both are the types dependent more on the system and teammates to make an impact on offense.

Whether he is better on defense, I'm not sure. He should have better ability to defend more positions. His athletic profile in terms on help defense potential is elite, but you don't really know on team defense until you see it. His ability to defend the block could be lower.

Although I wonder if in hindsight they'd add Ward if they knew they could later add Osunnyi, I like going all-in on defense in the NIL era. It's exactly how Green and the UNI types have always been good while having no chance winning recruiting battles against 90+ other programs.

Curious of the bigs who do u prefer? Bates, Osun, and Bates?

 

[isucy86]

A bet on a sports message board evokes such emotion? Relax, it's a message board.

Here's a hint, the bet is a device to point out the laughable fallacy in the poster's response. They don't actually disagree with the risk profile in regards to not improving. No one was contending it is not possible, but rather unlikely.

The beauty of the Ignore poster feature.

 

[Kaner04]

I also think Watson has a couple inches to grow too

Watson is already 6’8”

 

[Stormin]

So, you agree it is questionable whether we're better next year, let alone loaded in the backcourt? If so I have no idea why you objected. If you just wanted to use this as an opportunity to bash Prohm, proceed.

Including the tournament round reached is a risky metric on a one season basis. It is mostly a crapshoot, and can lead you astray in both directions to the job done.

A lot riding on Holmes. My belief is he was targeted originally as a complementary piece to an improved Hunter and AJG. Maybe even with IB if he came back for the NIL we were offering. Now we need him to be a good #2 in the Big 12. I wonder if he's better suited for the #3 guard role like Gabe had a year ago. But you take what you can get, particularly now with NIL

We could also be improved. We will see. All depends on the pieces we get and how they play together.

 

[WhoISthis]

Curious of the bigs who do u prefer? Bates, Osun, and Bates?

Tough call, and one we likely won't need to make (all three wanting to commit).

I believe a guy like Basile, in a base case scenario, slightly makes us the better team over the other two. If he plays how we think he can, he is the most different player than what we otherwise have. Could be a bit Niang type in which he can be a high usage guy in the front court. His one game sample against Arizona very good. He also has two years left and his dad is the former head coach of Pewaukee HS (until 2018), where two of our top prep targets are players. Ward's ability to defend the 4 allows him to play with Basile.

Some feel Bates is the highest upside and best talent. Former 4-star, ex-ACC, and NBA measurable (7'3" wingspan 6 years ago, maybe 7'8" or longer now). There is some tape to suggest he's a good passer and has some ability to need a double on the block. His block rate in the ACC very good. We definitely would be very good on defense with him behind our on-ball pressure. But he also is injury prone, and hasn't yet put a lot on tape as a much better player on offense than we saw from Conditt's first two seasons (Conditt's numbers those years actually suggest he was an equal of all these guys). I think he is much harder to fit with Ward, but good with King and Kunc. Possible two year guy, too.

I don't know much about Osunniyi, although I did just listen to a podcast in which he claims he wasn't serious about basketball until 11th grade. Perhaps that's why he slipped to A10. Only one year, but he seems to have a safe floor. I don't see him fitting well with Ward, particularly if our backcourt shoots to last year's percentages. If he comes with his teammate Welch, I am all in.

 

[Statefan10]

Watson is already 6’8”

You know I thought so and he looks far taller than 6’6”. Maybe that’s why I thought he could grow more lol

 

[WhoISthis]

The beauty of the Ignore poster feature.

If that is what you need to do to relax.

But you should really think about who is the one being comical over disagreement or not posting to your liking. I'm flattered you wanted to make it about us, but my disagreement was about basketball and next year.

 

[Statefan10]

I think he'll hurt us the same on offense if we use our 5 like that again. Maybe more, as Conditt was surprisingly a decent passer at the 5. Both are the types dependent more on the system and teammates to make an impact on offense.

Whether he is better on defense, I'm not sure. He should have better ability to defend more positions. His athletic profile in terms on help defense potential is elite, but you don't really know on team defense until you see it. His ability to defend the block could be lower.

Although I wonder if in hindsight they'd add Ward if they knew they could later add Osunnyi, I like going all-in on defense in the NIL era. It's exactly how Green and the UNI types have always been good while having no chance winning recruiting battles against 90+ other programs.

Yeah your last paragraph is spot on I think.

And you’re right that our bigs weren’t utilized well last year. I don’t think sticking them at the high post to get our guys to drive worked consistently but I’m not sure what else we could’ve done. We certainly weren’t a good enough shooting team to spread the floor. I think we worked with what we had last year and basically said “we’re going to make every single game ugly and see what happens” and it worked.

 

[Klubber]

People are pretty tempered with their expectations. Good.... Good.

It was the same with Brockington. Many felt he'd be an 8 pt/per type guy partly based on his time at PSU.

I'm really stoked about JH. I've seen him in some game action with the Bonnies and really like his game.

 

[CyLyte2]

We made the Sweet 16 going through legit schools LSU and Wisconsin with a roster of cast offs that were projected last in the conference. Everyone was utilized well last year.

 

[Statefan10]

We made the Sweet 16 going through legit schools LSU and Wisconsin with a roster of cast offs that were projected last in the conference. Everyone was utilized well last year.

Don’t think you’re wrong. I think for the team to succeed we had to put Conditt in positions where he might not have individually succeeded as much.

 

[SolarGarlic]

They were the best by far. I doubt many on this forum saw them. That's why they think Sullivan was so good. Jake is not even top 10 IMO.

Sullivan played with Tinsley. If they saw Sullivan, they probably saw the group before him. It was one year.

I guess I missed the legions of posters on here thinking Sullivan was so good.

 

[WhoISthis]

Yeah your last paragraph is spot on I think.

And you’re right that our bigs weren’t utilized well last year. I don’t think sticking them at the high post to get our guys to drive worked consistently but I’m not sure what else we could’ve done. We certainly weren’t a good enough shooting team to spread the floor. I think we worked with what we had last year and basically said “we’re going to make every single game ugly and see what happens” and it worked.

If you're not going to use the space in the lane, there is no good having your 5 handling the ball beyond the 3P line.

Going 4-22 on 3Ps but just 4 FTA is not just personal related. That is a poorly designed or executed offense.

 

[WhoISthis]

It was the same with Brockington. Many felt he'd be an 8 pt/per type guy partly based on his time at PSU.

I'm really stoked about JH. I've seen him in some game action with the Bonnies and really like his game.

8 points/gm?

He averaged over 12 points/game in under 30 minutes/game in the Big 10. I don't recall "many" feeling he'd score over 4 fewer points per game, all while likely playing more and getting more usage.

 

[Klubber]

Lmao. How much money are you willing to wager they’re better? 10k?

Is TJ good with it? Coaches balance risk of getting worse, when they get what they can. That’s never meant they think it’s good enough to improve on the year before. And it’s never been more true in the NIL era.


Last year we were 7-11 and a shot away from not making the tournament with a top-5 defense. Not ideal. TJ wasn’t “good” with a top-170 offense, just as he wasn’t “good” with his UNLV years.

A shot away from not making the tournament? C'mon man. We comfortably made it in. It's not like we played in Dayton or something.

JH had a lot of suitors, so apparently TJ wasn't just settling for plan B.

I guess we're now not giving TJ any credit for the huge turnaround last year with a patchwork team due to him being left kind of a mess?

You must still be sore that we didn't hire Porter Moser — who didn't make the Tourney BTW.

As for next year, the front line's already been bolstered and is a much better unit than last year's. Add Basile or Bates and it's even better. And if AJ Green is on board, the back court will also be really good with much better depth than last year as well.

That should translate to a better team on paper overall heading into next year. Hopefully chemistry will also be there.

Someone might take you up on that 10 grand bet you're tossing around.

 

[Klubber]

8 points/gm?

He averaged over 12 points/game in under 30 minutes/game in the Big 10. I don't recall "many" feeling he'd score over 4 fewer points per game, all while likely playing more and getting more usage.

If you want to nitpick my post, have at it. He averaged 12.6 in '20, 8.1 in '19 for PSU, and 4.3 in '17 for the Bonnies. That doesn't translate to "elite scoring".

Nobody predicted IB would be an elite scorer at ISU (except for maybe the coaches) in large part because of those stats. Which is the point I made in the prior post.

 

[CyLyte2]

We’ll be better next year than we were this year. Our success is getting us better players than we got last year coming off two wins.

 

[CyLyte2]

And if listened to Jamie’s interview with Murph we’re handling NIL in a great way. Our culture is our edge. And that’s a real thing.

 

[Cyinthenorth]

I know Conditt was listed as 6'9 here but there was no way he wasn't pushing 7'0

6'10" in his shoes I'll bet