How can the coaching staff not know what down it is??? EVER HEARD OF A TIMEOUT??

cyfanatic1968

Member
Mar 25, 2014
67
17
8
From the Ames Trib this morning - Rhoads explains fourth quarter play calling...

Seriously CPR? Call a timeout for pete's sake.

By Bobby La Gesse
Sports Editor
rlagesse@amestrib.com


When Iowa State wide receiver Carson Epps fell near the first down marker, the coaching staff thought it was a first down.
A pass was called, but the Cyclones, driving to take the lead late in the fourth quarter, found themselves in third down.
The ensuing pass was incomplete and ISU failed to convert on fourth down a play later, ending a drive full of confusion in a 35-31 loss to No. 5 Oklahoma State on Saturday.
“Got to execute,” coach Paul Rhoads said. “Got to block. Got to run. Got to get that first down.”
Rhoads wasn’t going to use the play calls as an excuse. He said the Cyclones should have converted regardless.
ISU started the drive on its own 28-yard line. The second play was the Epps catch. Thinking Epps moved the chains, offensive coordinator Todd Sturdy called a pass play.
“We thought we got the first down,” Rhoads said. “From our view on the spot it sure looked like a first down. Line to gain is something they are supposed to stop to review if they feel it is necessary. So we made a call based on what we thought was a first-and-10 play.”
Rhoads said the staff realized it was third down before the ball was snapped, but didn’t have time to change it because the offense wouldn’t look to the sideline during its two minute offense.
“Everything had been in and eyes were off of us, so the play was going to be run,” Rhoads said.
Quarterback Joel Lanning threw an incomplete pass to wide receiver Allen Lazard.
“We should have been able to get it anyways,” Lanning said. “We just kind of hurt ourselves toward the end of the game.”
Rhoads said the fourth down call — an inside run to running back Mike Warren — would have been the third down call. Regardless, he felt the Cyclones were in a spot to convert the first down.
Warren was quickly engulfed by defenders on the handoff and never made it to the marker.
“They were bringing everyone off the edge and inside and they just stuffed every gap,” Rhoads said. “That’s pretty much the answer for fourth-and-one.”


- See more at: http://amestrib.com/sports/football-rhoads-explains-fourth-quarter-play-calling#sthash.eMDqFEbq.dpuf




Football: Rhoads explains fourth quarter play calling - See more at: http://amestrib.com/sports/football-rhoads-explains-fourth-quarter-play-calling#sthash.eMDqFEbq.dpuf
Football: Rhoads explains fourth quarter play calling - See more at: http://amestrib.com/sports/football-rhoads-explains-fourth-quarter-play-calling#sthash.eMDqFEbq.dpuf
 

Wesley

Well-Known Member
Apr 12, 2006
70,923
546
113
Omaha
Does sound like our staff of the last three years. What a mess, manginator.
 

chuckd4735

Well-Known Member
SuperFanatic
SuperFanatic T2
Mar 29, 2006
27,745
8,660
113
39
Indianola
First of all, it was a first down pretty clearly. Second the far side judge (on ISU's side) singled a first down.
While I completely understand how they may have thought it was a first down, its completely inexcusable that it happened. I also agree a timeout should of been called, and I dont understand for the life of me why it was not.
 

cyfanatic1968

Member
Mar 25, 2014
67
17
8
Don't even get me started on the defense. JHC if you give Rudulph 8-10 seconds to throw the ball HE IS GOING TO COMPLETE PASSES. I have said it before - get the darn DB's up on the WR and bump and slow them down on the line. WHY ARE THEY PULLING TUCKER OUT ON 3RD DOWNS and why why why not rush 5 guys.

Seems this defense should have some kind of upside - like you give a lot of cushion but in theory get better breaks on the ball - kind of high risk high reward. Bad bad plan to let Rudulph sit back there.
 

bozclone

Well-Known Member
SuperFanatic
SuperFanatic T2
Nov 18, 2011
3,452
3,838
113
Indiana
The spot of the ball on that play was terrible. The ref marked it a good yard short of where it should have been marked. Since marked it so short, there was no delay to see if the first down had been made. Since there was no delay, the timing of the events on the field more closely resembled us gaining the first down.

Burned by a terrible mark and us trying to run plays at a high tempo. It was a game changer.
 

bozclone

Well-Known Member
SuperFanatic
SuperFanatic T2
Nov 18, 2011
3,452
3,838
113
Indiana
Don't even get me started on the defense. JHC if you give Rudulph 8-10 seconds to throw the ball HE IS GOING TO COMPLETE PASSES. I have said it before - get the darn DB's up on the WR and bump and slow them down on the line. WHY ARE THEY PULLING TUCKER OUT ON 3RD DOWNS and why why why not rush 5 guys.

Seems this defense should have some kind of upside - like you give a lot of cushion but in theory get better breaks on the ball - kind of high risk high reward. Bad bad plan to let Rudulph sit back there.

If you watched the game, Rudulph was actually more effective when we blitzed him. We clearly had more success against him when we only rushed 3 and dropped 8. In many of those situations he threw the ball away or was forced to scramble for little or no gain.
 

CycloneWanderer

Well-Known Member
Nov 4, 2007
7,177
3,529
113
Wandering
The only thing I thought abhorrent is that the 4th down play went backwards and the officials decided the measure for the first down. I've NEVER seen a play go backwards and then get measured before. If it is close enough to measure AFTER going back a half a yard, why the hell didn't they measure it after 2nd down?
 

ArgentCy

Well-Known Member
Jan 13, 2010
20,384
11,175
113
The refs almost never measure on anything other than 3rd or 4th downs anymore. Pretty sure they don't want to slow the game. Also makes it much easier for them to screw teams with bad spots on plays that aren't going to get measured or reviewed.
 

cyfanatic1968

Member
Mar 25, 2014
67
17
8
If you watched the game, Rudulph was actually more effective when we blitzed him. We clearly had more success against him when we only rushed 3 and dropped 8. In many of those situations he threw the ball away or was forced to scramble for little or no gain.

I watched the game - apparently you missed it. I saw Rudulph standing back there several times for 8 seconds, I saw OSU WR catch passes without an ISU DB within 10yds of them (just like OU). I saw Rudulph go 24/36 for 327 yds and a TD. I saw and have seen Tucker come out on 3rd downs most of the year. I saw our DB sit 10-12 yds off the line of scrimmage and OSU complete several 6-8 yd passes. I saw OSU drive 84 yds for the win mainly throwing the ball and managing the clock.

The defensive scheme was weak - particularly in the 2nd half.
 

FootballinTexas

Well-Known Member
Aug 2, 2009
1,348
72
48
I've OC'd high school football for a long time. I have always had a coach in the pressbox and his only job was to give me the down, distance, hash, or middle of the field after every offensive play. This allowed me to stay focused on the play sheet. If we can afford to have that coach in Texas High School football, I would think ISU could afford that coach as well.

Now, the true test of CPR's head coaching ability is if that coach does exist and he blew that assignment, he should have been fired last night for potentially costing him a huge win and his job. Instead, CPR is making an excuse which means he should have been fired last night. That's more embarrassing in my opinion than losing to a top 10 team.
 
Last edited:

SwirlyBird

Well-Known Member
Aug 2, 2015
2,254
2,014
113
The answer to all football questions is Paul is a ******* terrible head coach.
 

SwirlyBird

Well-Known Member
Aug 2, 2015
2,254
2,014
113
I've OC'd high school football for a long time. I have always had a coach in the pressbox and his only job was to give me the down, distance, hash, or middle of the field after every offensive play. This allowed me to stay focused on the play sheet. If we can of ford to have that coach in Texas High School football, I would think ISU could of ford that coach as well.

Now, the true test of CPR's head coaching ability is if that coach does exist and he blew that assignment, he should have been fired last night for potentially costing him a huge win and his job. Instead, CPR is making an excuse which means he should have been fired last night. That's more embarrassing in my opinion than losing to a top 10 team.

You are over qualified for the job, JP doesn't have the money to spend on you.
 

FootballinTexas

Well-Known Member
Aug 2, 2009
1,348
72
48
I want JP's job! They fire high school coaches in Texas with a much better record than CPR for not making the playoffs. ISU has the facilities, fan base, and Big12 backing to be much better. But until football is taken seriously by the AD, nothing will change.
 

RealisticCy

Well-Known Member
Nov 2, 2014
1,269
1,764
113
Ames, IA
The chains didn't move, seems like a giant indicator

Paul, if you are reading this, "the chains" are marked by those big orange sticks on each end. They move and reset them when the team gets a first down, which is a very good sign that it is indeed first down. I always thought you had to know something about the game of football to actually be a coach, but I guess not...

This is just icing on the fire CPR cake. While we are here:
1. It was a ****** "first down" play anyway...if we completed it it would be trading 3 yards for roughly 2o seconds of game time.
2. Can we just once, on a third or fourth and 1, not get into shotgun formation so the ball doesn't have to go 4 yards deep? Get under center, grow a pair, and run a QB sneak with your 230 pound QB! Hell, a jumbo package with Lazard out wide and throwing him a jump ball would be a better play than going -4 yards and running a draw. Same **** happened in the K-State game last year, when we needed 1 yard to ice the game when we were ahead with 3 minutes left.
3. When we send 3 rushers against 5 OL plus a RB, that means everyone is double teamed. That gives the QB forever to find an open receiver. That is bad for our team's chances.
4. 3rd down and 2 is very easy to convert for the opponent when our DB's are 10 yards off the receiver when the ball is snapped.
5. I would be interested in seeing how often we let the opponent convert 3rd down and 8 or more yards.

To the people that think we have a competent head coach and staff, how do you explain the fact that this crap keeps happening in year 7?
 

NWICY

Well-Known Member
Sep 2, 2012
20,284
14,735
113
I want JP's job! They fire high school coaches in Texas with a much better record than CPR for not making the playoffs. ISU has the facilities, fan base, and Big12 backing to be much better. But until football is taken seriously by the AD, nothing will change.

The real question is would you take the head coaching job at ISU? I would just because of the money.
 

RealisticCy

Well-Known Member
Nov 2, 2014
1,269
1,764
113
Ames, IA
From the Ames Trib this morning - Rhoads explains fourth quarter play calling...

Seriously CPR? Call a timeout for pete's sake.

By Bobby La Gesse
Sports Editor
rlagesse@amestrib.com


When Iowa State wide receiver Carson Epps fell near the first down marker, the coaching staff thought it was a first down.
A pass was called, but the Cyclones, driving to take the lead late in the fourth quarter, found themselves in third down.
The ensuing pass was incomplete and ISU failed to convert on fourth down a play later, ending a drive full of confusion in a 35-31 loss to No. 5 Oklahoma State on Saturday.
“Got to execute,†coach Paul Rhoads said. “Got to block. Got to run. Got to get that first down.â€
Rhoads wasn’t going to use the play calls as an excuse. He said the Cyclones should have converted regardless.
ISU started the drive on its own 28-yard line. The second play was the Epps catch. Thinking Epps moved the chains, offensive coordinator Todd Sturdy called a pass play.
“We thought we got the first down,†Rhoads said. “From our view on the spot it sure looked like a first down. Line to gain is something they are supposed to stop to review if they feel it is necessary. So we made a call based on what we thought was a first-and-10 play.â€
Rhoads said the staff realized it was third down before the ball was snapped, but didn’t have time to change it because the offense wouldn’t look to the sideline during its two minute offense.

“Everything had been in and eyes were off of us, so the play was going to be run,†Rhoads said.
Quarterback Joel Lanning threw an incomplete pass to wide receiver Allen Lazard.
“We should have been able to get it anyways,†Lanning said. “We just kind of hurt ourselves toward the end of the game.â€
Rhoads said the fourth down call — an inside run to running back Mike Warren — would have been the third down call. Regardless, he felt the Cyclones were in a spot to convert the first down.
Warren was quickly engulfed by defenders on the handoff and never made it to the marker.
“They were bringing everyone off the edge and inside and they just stuffed every gap,†Rhoads said. “That’s pretty much the answer for fourth-and-one.â€

Knew it was third down before the play, had 2 timeouts, did not call one.
Thinks that sending everyone at the line is basically kryptonite for fourth and 1 plays.

Isn't that evidence to get under center and not snap it four yards deep? How about a hard count to draw offsides? Play action bootleg? If he truly thought they had the answer for our fourth down play and there was no chance of it succeeding, why didn't we punt? He is such an idiot; he had coached before he got here right? He didn't forge his entire resume, did he? Did anyone actually check?
 

DurangoCy

Well-Known Member
Jul 5, 2010
6,228
3,935
113
Durango, CO
We blitzed several times with cornerbacks playing soft coverage, which is a pretty easy pick up for the offense. I assume Wally has seen our receivers/qbs not be able to adjust with hot routes over the last 5 years and just assumed that other teams were that dumb too.

Also, I'm not totally convinced that a certain db for us, that everyone claims is our best, doesn't just spin in circles when he's back on coverage. Seems to be the only way he can get that far away from the guy he's covering that quickly.

...oh, back on topic, yeah the two play calls to end that series were embarrassing.
 

Help Support Us

Become a patron