2024-2025 MBB computer projections thread

KennyPratt42

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I know this is a crazy long YT video but this is a group of well established online bracketologists (all pretty high on bracket matrix) who basically did a mock NCAA committee bracket process yesterday afternoon. It's super thorough and I think the most high level bracketology prediction your going to find.

They have us as the last 3 seed in Milwaukee ahead of Wisconsin. If Wisconsin and us were to filp then we'd be in Denver as the 1st 4 seed.


I tend to agree with this, I think we are about a 12 on the s-curve currently. Which means we could potentially drop to a 4 with an early exit and are unlikely to play our way up a seed line. Win one and there is reasonable confidence in being a 3 seed. Win two and we should solidly be a 3 seed. A championship maybe gets us in the conversation for 8 on the s-curve.
 

cyclones500

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I've always thought WAB should be the magic one but it probably isn't the one.
FWIW: Here’s current WAB rank listed as seeding/s-curve, with Bracket Matrix seed line in parentheses, thru 3/9 listings … Matrix is likely to lag behind NET updates (overall). Close in quite a few places, several are two or three lines off.

Of course, matrix collectively not guaranteed to match precise placements of committee.

1
Auburn (1)
Alabama (2)
Houston (1)
Florida (1)
2
Tennessee (2)
Michigan State (2)
Duke (1)
Texas A&M (3)
3
Kentucky (3)
St. John’s (8)
Oregon (5)
Ole Miss (6)
4
Texas Tech (3)
Iowa State (4)
Wisconsin (3)
Purdue (4)
5
Maryland (4)
Michigan (5)
Louisville (6)
Clemson (5)
6
Arizona (4)
UCLA (6)
Saint Mary’s (5)
Memphis (8)
7
Illinois (7)
BYU (7)
Kansas (7)
Mississippi State (8)
8
Missouri (6)
Marquette (7)
Georgia (9)
New Mexico (9)
 
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Cyclonepride

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I know this is a crazy long YT video but this is a group of well established online bracketologists (all pretty high on bracket matrix) who basically did a mock NCAA committee bracket process yesterday afternoon. It's super thorough and I think the most high level bracketology prediction your going to find.

They have us as the last 3 seed in Milwaukee ahead of Wisconsin. If Wisconsin and us were to filp then we'd be in Denver as the 1st 4 seed.


I really can't imagine a 4 seed unless the committee just completely throws the Momcilovic, Gilbert and Jones missed starts out the window. IMO they've earned at least a 4 seed even if that hadn't happened.
 
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cyclones500

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I know this is a crazy long YT video but this is a group of well established online bracketologists (all pretty high on bracket matrix) who basically did a mock NCAA committee bracket process yesterday afternoon. It's super thorough and I think the most high level bracketology prediction your going to find.

They have us as the last 3 seed in Milwaukee ahead of Wisconsin. If Wisconsin and us were to filp then we'd be in Denver as the 1st 4 seed.



This is cool. I do wish their pacing was sharper, but even with that I've watched quite a bit of it, and it gives a general sense of how the committee shapes the bracket.
 

NWICY

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I think "misinformation" is a bit strong of wording considering how loaded that term is nowadays and we're dealing with college basketball here, not matters of war and peace and life and death.

My justification for posting them for now would be something like...

(1.) This thread became an annual tradition 4-5 years ago when I was posting that email update in the more general bracketology thread. @Cyclonepride made the suggestion we should have an annual thread for a consolidated discussion of the analytics and the men's basketball team; hence, it started.

It has some incumbency and nostalgia value for me and is easy to do.

(2.) Most of the regular posters in here and probably most of the lurker readers know by now that Team Rankings has its flaws (especially weird edge cases in its model "they" should really do some work to clean up in a newer version). It is a flawed source but its flaws are "known knowns" easy to adjust for.

(3.) Their round-by-round odds in the Big 12 tournament and the NCAA tournament are unique from what I've seen of these projection models. FiveThirtyEight used to do something like that and maybe Nate Silver will in the future, but FiveThirtyEight is dead now. So, we might as well use all the data we have.

They might not be on the dot, but I think the 11.1% chance to win the tournament in KC and 2% to win The Big One are reasonable enough estimates, which help me ground my expectations this month. Even a very good team by the historical standards of Iowa State basketball only has roughly 1/50 odds to win it.

It is just so hard to do. :/

It's a flawed source but I don't think it is intentionally and maliciously misleading somehow. Saying Iowa State is going to be a #5 seed instead of a #3 or maybe a #4 isn't exactly genius propaganda.
For what it's worth I appreciate this thread.
 

KennyPratt42

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A couple notes about this Oklahoma St. vs Cincinnati game. If Cincinnati wins they are probably a Q1 game tomorrow (50 in NET going into today and 26 to 50 NET on a neutral court is a Q1b game). Oklahoma St. is 91 in NET and will stay a Q2a loss unless they drop past 100.

The most important result for us today, from a resume standpoint, is Kansas St. winning. They are sitting at a NET of 75 going into the day and a loss would almost certainly move the win to a Q2a and the loss to a Q3 (from a Q1b and Q2b respectively).
 

CPG4ISU

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A couple notes about this Oklahoma St. vs Cincinnati game. If Cincinnati wins they are probably a Q1 game tomorrow (50 in NET going into today and 26 to 50 NET on a neutral court is a Q1b game). Oklahoma St. is 91 in NET and will stay a Q2a loss unless they drop past 100.

The most important result for us today, from a resume standpoint, is Kansas St. winning. They are sitting at a NET of 75 going into the day and a loss would almost certainly move the win to a Q2a and the loss to a Q3 (from a Q1b and Q2b respectively).
Another positive NET note. UCF jumped from 77 to 72 last night, giving us another quad 1 win.

ISU now 8-6 in quad 1 games. Cincy is now at 48, so win today you should be at 9-6.

Baylor at 33 in NET. If they beat KSU tonight, could be at 10-6 by this time tomorrow morning.
 
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danrog

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good results for us from last night. K state went from 75->73. Hopefully a loss to Baylor means less than a win against arizona st and they stay top 75, to avoid that L at home becoming a quad 3. UCF was a huge one in that they went from >75-> 72, making that road game a quad 1(b) W, raising our record to 8-6 there.

Baylor is at 33, so thats our next likeliest opponent to help us look better. They are at 33, doubt a win over Kstate gets them <30, which would be an additional quad 1 W at home. We'd need them to win 2, I assume.
 
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VeloClone

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As already mentioned yesterday couldn't have gone much better for ISU's resume. Q3 games moving into Q2 and Q2 games moving into Q1:

Iowa State NET 9 (3rd in Big 12 – UH 3, TTU 7)
Overall: 23-8 NonCon: 10-1 Big 12: 13-7

NET SOS: 37, NET NonCon SOS: 98

Q1 8-6
..Q1a 2-4 (2 N Auburn L-2, 3 A UH L-9, 7 A TTU W+OT, 13 A UA L-OT, 13 H UA W+17, 18 A KU L-17)
..Q1b 6-2 (18 H KU W+17, 25 H Marquette W+11, 26 H BYU L-3, 46 A WVU L-7, 65 A Iowa W+9, 72 A UCF W+12, 73 A KSU W+16, 74 A ASU W+15,)
Q2 7-2
..Q2a 4-1 (33 H BU W+19, 48 H UC W+11, 67 N Dayton W+5, 90 A CU W+10, 95 A OSU L-6)
..Q2b 3-1 (70 H UU W+23, 72 H UCF W+25, 73 H KSU L-19, 90 N CU W+28)
Q3 2-0 (79 H TCU W+30, 90 H CU W+14)
Q4 6-0 (163 H UNO W+32, 242 H UMKC W+26, 275 H JSU+42, 317 H UI Indy+35, 335 H Morgan St+27, 364 H MVS+39)

ISU
Low Score: 52 High Score: 108 Ave Score: 80.1
OPP
Low Score: 44 High Score: 86 Ave Score: 67.5
ISU (conf only)
Low Score: 52 High Score: 108 Ave Score: 75.6
OPP (conf only)
Low Score: 52 High Score: 86 Ave Score: 68.7

Notes
ISU in top 15 of most results based (SOR, WAB) and predictive (BPI, POM, T-Rank) metrics except KPI (25).
 

Sigmapolis

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Yeah, because a win over Colorado doesn't move the needle much. ;)

Colorado plays Houston today.

So if Colorado wins it all in KC... we didn't play Houston.

The other side of the bracket is Tech, Baylor, Zona, and Kansas.
 

danrog

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Damn, kstate dropped to quad 3 L after getting their ass kicked. Need George Mason or st Joe's to drop badly
 

Sigmapolis

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Damn, kstate dropped to quad 3 L after getting their ass kicked. Need George Mason or st Joe's to drop badly

Obviously, they're not going to change it this week; however, the "steep cliff" where flipping one place in the rankings completely changes your quadrant tier has always struck me as lacking in nuance. This reason is why I prefer systems like WAB that take account of subtle differences in team/win quality.
 

CPG4ISU

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Damn, kstate dropped to quad 3 L after getting their ass kicked. Need George Mason or st Joe's to drop badly
Them dropping from 73 to 76 is a killer. The good news is whenever George Mason and/or St Joes loses, it will probably be to a team with a pretty low NET, so that should be a chance for Kstate to jump back to 75.

The good news: ISU quad 1 wins jumped from 7-6 in quad 1 to 9-6 overnight:
-Cincy only fell from 48 to 50, so yesterday is a quad 1 win.
-Baylor jumped from 33 to 30 overnight with the KSU win, so another quad 1 was picked up there
-UCF actually jumped from 72 to 70 since they played KU close in the OT loss