UFO stuff & "The Secret of Skinwalker Ranch"

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https://skepticalinquirer.org/wp-content/uploads/sites/29/2010/03/p25.pdf

Bad UFOs: Skepticism, UFOs, and The Universe

A skeptical blog about UFO claims, aliens, etc.

badufos.blogspot.com

This is a good example of why I don't follow very closely the whole UFO scene. It's a real rabbit hole with opinions going back and forth forever. I had formed my opinion at an early age and when Erich von Daniken came out with his "Chariots of the Gods" in 1968 it confirmed my opinion. I loved how the book confirmed my attitude toward the subject and I really didn't need to devote much time to anyone else's opinion.

 

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This is a good example of why I don't follow very closely the whole UFO scene. It's a real rabbit hole with opinions going back and forth forever. I had formed my opinion at an early age and when Erich von Daniken came out with his "Chariots of the Gods" in 1968 it confirmed my opinion. I loved how the book confirmed my attitude toward the subject and I really didn't need to devote much time to anyone else's opinion.

I was also a big fan of Erich von Daniken, "Chariots of the Gods" and subsequent follow-ups. Soon after I moved on to Carl Sagan, et al, in search of vindication from science. From there it doesn't take too long to realize how fatally flawed the whole UFO, whatever, really is.

Maybe if someone produced actual analyzed physical evidence that is stamped "Made in Proxima Centauri" I might come back around, but that won't happen. The thinly veiled hint that alien visitors are singling out American earthlings to reveal themselves to, but not really reveal, I feel, is somewhat ludicrous. The search for alien techno-signatures will bear fruit first.

 

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I was also a big fan of Erich von Daniken, "Chariots of the Gods" and subsequent follow-ups. Soon after I moved on to Carl Sagan, et al, in search of vindication from science. From there it doesn't take too long to realize how fatally flawed the whole UFO, whatever, really is.

Maybe if someone produced actual analyzed physical evidence that is stamped "Made in Proxima Centauri" I might come back around, but that won't happen. The thinly veiled hint that alien visitors are singling out American earthlings to reveal themselves to, but not really reveal, I feel, is somewhat ludicrous. The search for alien techno-signatures will bear fruit first.

I think that it's pretty cool that two guys can read the same book and end up with opposing attitudes toward the subject. Perfectly normal and natural. I am currently reading "Imminent" by Luis Elizondo that was just released and am about half way through it. So far, he has tip-toed around some pretty wild stuff surrounding the subject of UFO's that his investigative group with the DOD was looking at.

 

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I think that it's pretty cool that two guys can read the same book and end up with opposing attitudes toward the subject. Perfectly normal and natural. I am currently reading "Imminent" by Luis Elizondo that was just released and am about half way through it. So far, he has tip-toed around some pretty wild stuff surrounding the subject of UFO's that his investigative group with the DOD was looking at.

Looking forward to your impressions of Imminent. Author seems to be a straight shooter.

 

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The Army "alternative interpretation" was proposed as a possibility by Vallee after it was pointed out that the treasured artifact that Jose had taken from the craft was a windmill tailbone casting. Oops! It was such a weak "alternative interpretation" as to be laughable.

As for my opinion of the whole incident, I think that the boys saw something. What it was, no one knows except the Army. Does that cast doubt on the whole UFO subject-no it doesn't. There are countless numbers of better documented UFO incidents.

An example would be the Socorro NM UFO landing just 10 miles up the road. Observed by a trained professional law-enforcement officer, policeman Lonnie Zamora while on duty. Evidence of the landing was documented and photographed. Lonnie was thoroughly investigated and found to be an extremely reliable witness. A memorial exists to this day near the site where he observed the craft on the ground and it's occupants walking around.

View attachment 133446

As noted in the Presidential Assassination and Attempts comparison of the evidence and pictures, videos are all there yet even with that it will be contested. Whatever happened in "Trinity" could have been just enough outside of the experience of Padilla and Baca to make them think it was unearthly. The agreement on what happened will now be relegated to untenable as manmade materials were forwarded as proof of the crashed craft.

 

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This is a good example of why I don't follow very closely the whole UFO scene. It's a real rabbit hole with opinions going back and forth forever. I had formed my opinion at an early age and when Erich von Daniken came out with his "Chariots of the Gods" in 1968 it confirmed my opinion. I loved how the book confirmed my attitude toward the subject and I really didn't need to devote much time to anyone else's opinion.

A rabbit hole, in this case, was invented by the one whose hypothetical story about the never-identified, never-identified how they did it, students. This is a red herring, tossing up manure to manufacture doubt: to cast doubt negates the possibility of the whole "it happened" mindset. Students pranksters or the Sococco tourist trap gambit. Really?! Meritless, absolutely nothing but say so to redoubt a case where every angle physical and from witnesses leaves no doubt something big happened

Digging into this case is informative:

FBI file: file:///C:/Users/lrsch/Downloads/FBI-UFO-Socorro-fbi1-1.pdf

Blue Book: (Left Unidefied) https://www.theblackvault.com/casef...february-1965-socorro-new-mexico-ufo-landing/

Hector Quintanilla says in the film video that "it showed no indications of interplanetary origin," but Blue Book could not tell you what it was. Blue Book says no but either could not reveal a national secret or had no resources to say what it was. But assured it was not indicative of anything out of the ordinary (!). ​

Allen J; Hynek: Astronomer, Debunker, turned investigator: Found the case profoundly important.

UFO Landing at Socorro, New Mexico (Zamora Incident) - UFO Evidence

Check other resources. Lots of material to support there is little wiggle room to say it was a lunar lander test or other explanation.

If fully apprised of the Socorro/Lonnie Zamora case a debunker/critic/cynic has to use "debunked bs" to find ways to piss on this case, good luck!

 

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I was also a big fan of Erich von Daniken, "Chariots of the Gods" and subsequent follow-ups. Soon after I moved on to Carl Sagan, et al, in search of vindication from science. From there it doesn't take too long to realize how fatally flawed the whole UFO, whatever, really is.

Maybe if someone produced actual analyzed physical evidence that is stamped "Made in Proxima Centauri" I might come back around, but that won't happen. The thinly veiled hint that alien visitors are singling out American earthlings to reveal themselves to, but not really reveal, I feel, is somewhat ludicrous. The search for alien techno-signatures will bear fruit first.

I loved the first Von books. He and Sagan were among my favorites along with Lewis Thomas, Stephen Jay Gough, John Fowles, John Steinbeck, and a few others.

Von was a teenage boy's distraction and a little critical thinking and practical experience made me question many of the artifact interpretations he made. However, there are real questions about the age, and method of construction, of some mega-monoliths, desperate things like the Antikythera Mechanism, and sites like Göbekli Tepe.

Seeing Von was a claptrap I kept reading UFO literature as if it were fun fiction. Until the 2016 release of the TicTac video, it was back to taking the topic more seriously and evaluating some of my old authors. Especially my idol, that being Sagan. I started diverging from Sagan, I had read three of his books, some repeatedly, and found him coming off not as a physicist, though he knew astronomical physics, or as an inventor or creator. Carl's genius was not forward-looking but suffered elitist, siloing, and close-mindedness, and through his masterful telling why this "is" and that "can't." Not, a great mind's way to see the mystery of UFOs.

I had to laugh when after the movie "Oppenheimer" came out I stumbled on this:

Why the 'Father of the Hydrogen Bomb' Hated Carl Sagan​

"Who was he?" The 90-year-old Teller remarked when asked about Sagan in 1998. "He was a nobody!"


"What did he do? I know he criticized me–that is the only accomplishment of his that I know of… He never did anything worthwhile."

https://www.realclearscience.com/bl...e_hydrogen_bomb_hated_carl_sagan_821874.html#!

Sagan's ideas need to be revisited and revised because physicists are moving into a world Sagan was not privy to, maybe he could adapt, but as things move on he is right less often. There are reasons he would not know extraterrestrial (?) life if he'd seen it as I think he was not open to it.

 

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I loved the first Von books. He and Sagan were among my favorites along with Lewis Thomas, Stephen Jay Gough, John Fowles, John Steinbeck, and a few others.

Von was a teenage boy's distraction and a little critical thinking and practical experience made me question many of the artifact interpretations he made. However, there are real questions about the age, and method of construction, of some mega-monoliths, desperate things like the Antikythera Mechanism, and sites like Göbekli Tepe.

Seeing Von was a claptrap I kept reading UFO literature as if it were fun fiction. Until the 2016 release of the TicTac video, it was back to taking the topic more seriously and evaluating some of my old authors. Especially my idol, that being Sagan. I started diverging from Sagan, I had read three of his books, some repeatedly, and found him coming off not as a physicist, though he knew astronomical physics, or as an inventor or creator. Carl's genius was not forward-looking but suffered elitist, siloing, and close-mindedness, and through his masterful telling why this "is" and that "can't." Not, a great mind's way to see the mystery of UFOs.

I had to laugh when after the movie "Oppenheimer" came out I stumbled on this:

Why the 'Father of the Hydrogen Bomb' Hated Carl Sagan​

https://www.realclearscience.com/bl...e_hydrogen_bomb_hated_carl_sagan_821874.html#!

Sagan's ideas need to be revisited and revised because physicists are moving into a world Sagan was not privy to, maybe he could adapt, but as things move on he is right less often. There are reasons he would not know extraterrestrial (?) life if he'd seen it as I think he was not open to it.

JFC, looks like someone has a bur in their britches over Sagan's Paradox.

 

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JFC, looks like someone has a bur in their britches over Sagan's Paradox.

The comments are interesting too.

 

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The comments are interesting too.

Yeah, a person gets the impression that the 90-year-old nuke hawk Teller wasn't a very nice fellow anymore. At least the man who made the MRI possible didn't seem to think so.

Nobel Prize winning physicist Isidor I. Rabi once suggested that "It would have been a better world without Teller."

 

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Yeah, a person gets the impression that the 90-year-old nuke hawk Teller wasn't a very nice fellow anymore. At least the man who made the MRI possible didn't seem to think so.

Sagan entertained many with his "Cosmos" show narrated in his distinct voice. Youngsters got interested in Science, space, and Cosmology, and were curious about Earth's place in the Universe through him. I was one of those glued to the TV and caught the episodes on PBS. Sagan is a proponent of life likely elsewhere in the Universe, but not UFO visitations.

Here is a video capturing his dismissal of the whole UFO phenomenon as a myth and a replacement for religion:

Had Sagan spent much time in the field, examining the purported landing site, looking at the photos/videos, or speaking with multiple witnesses? His exposure to the UFOs was mostly in reports filtered to him. And here another layer seems to be added to his stuffy old professor-type talking down to the unwashed masses. If he did get rigorous reports from other scientists and was aware of their concerns on the topic what convinced him to dismiss the whole issue of sightings, landings, and abductions?

Was he like Donald Menzel and Philip Klass? There is evidence that points to them both being part of a clandestine effort to debunk reports to the point of destroying the UFO observers' and UFO investigators' lives.

 

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Why is it that the deep space exploration strategies of advanced alien civilizations so closely resemble those inspired by 1950’s B movie producers? Even Gene Roddenberry was more advanced. Far more.

 

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Why is it that the deep space exploration strategies of advanced alien civilizations so closely resemble those inspired by 1950’s B movie producers? Even Gene Roddenberry was more advanced. Far more.

Good question. Believe it or not, indications from many abduction encounters where the aliens use what is in a person's memory to generate a "believable" interaction with them. They do this as a screen memory to obscure what they are really doing which seems to be genetic manipulation-Why, who knows,

 

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The new "wow" signal. Contained herein are a handful of reasons why crazy alien uncles harassing the universe and Earth in their Corvette UFOs is a ludicrous thought. (HINT: Unless they're just a few steps away there is no reason for them to suspect there's a compelling reason to come here.)

 

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The new "wow" signal. Contained herein are a handful of reasons why crazy alien uncles harassing the universe and Earth in their Corvette UFOs is a ludicrous thought. (HINT: Unless they're just a few steps away there is no reason for them to suspect there's a compelling reason to come here.)

Thanks for the video. SETI is a curious side quest of Astronomy and will likely not find advanced life communications in my opinion:

1. To be an advanced dominant life form you survived and conquered to reach that point. Don't blast your location or state at your technology level realizing there may be even more advanced civilizations that have survived and conquered and may see you as a threat.

2. Communication by aliens among themselves would likely be covert in channels we don't even realize. So finding them may be beyond our technology to detect.

Knowing how aliens communicate, how they transverse space or their intentions is a test of our ability to comprehend, and a challenging reality to accept.

 

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Finished the book and here are my quick reaction thoughts...

​

Imminent: Inside the Pentagon's Hunt for UFOs​

by Luis Elizondo

Imminent: Inside the Pentagon's Hunt for UFOs|Hardcover

INSTANT #1 NEW YORK TIMES BESTSELLERINSTANT USA TODAY BESTSELLERINSTANT #1 SUNDAY TIMES BESTSELLERThe former head of the Pentagon program responsible for the investigation of UFOs&...

www.barnesandnoble.com

In 2008 Luis Elizondo was recruited to join a classified program to study Unidentified Aerial Phenomena UAP (UFO). Accepting the position changed his world as he was enlightened by the massive classified files he reviewed. Luis went from being uninterested in the UAP topic to being a firm believer.

He recounted his early life and how it prepared him for a position as a high-level U.S. Army counterintelligence operative.
Elizondo's repeated attempts to follow highly credible reports of the deposition of non-terrestrial crafts/materials and alien bodies met in blocked access and deadends within the Government.

Luis is committed to serving the people of the U.S. and feels there is a right for Americans to know what is going on. Contesting the secrecy, he relinquishes his position within the Government attacking the issue from the outside. He then suffered loss of income, personal attacks, and continued harassment.

He joined Blink 142's Tom Delonge's newly formed UAP investigation group To The Stars Academy only to see the paid position there disappear. He moves to California and buys a home, further deterioration of his finances occurs, rents his house out for income, and lives out of his RV.

Elizondo fights all the way and he meets the best and brightest in and out of the Government, all following the UAP mystery push for disclosure. Congressional hearings lead to President Biden signing

H.R.2988 - Whistleblower Protection Improvement Act of 2021​

https://www.congress.gov/bill/117th-congress/house-bill/2988/text

I got what I expected out of this book and a few surprises. Luis is still bound by non-disclosure agreements so he cannot reveal much of what he knows. His life evolution was exceptional and therefore interesting to follow. Some of his ideas, like UAPs using Earth's water resources to fuel their crafts is conjecture with a lot of holes. One revelation was his late-night call with a tank commander to investigate one, clean, small hole that penetrated through two tanks and appeared to be UAP related according to a witness.

This is a NY Times bestseller and I will follow up by reading some reviews and reader comments to see their interpretations and reactions. "Imminent" is worthy as it may be one of the most direct documentation of possession of non-human technology in the hands of the Government and passed off under extreme secrecy in the private sector.

 

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Season 6 of The Secret of Skinwalker Ranch (TSSR) looks set to air April 22, 2025 https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Secret_of_Skinwalker_Ranch

It's no surprise that the show costs peanuts to produce, and there are doubts that TSSR's "reality stars" will get huge payoffs. TSSR, believe it or not, has a pretty decent following. I like it and think they are on to something, since the investigation offers surprising results at times, and often offbeat methodology.

 

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Finished the book and here are my quick reaction thoughts...

​

Imminent: Inside the Pentagon's Hunt for UFOs​

by Luis Elizondo

Imminent: Inside the Pentagon's Hunt for UFOs|Hardcover

INSTANT #1 NEW YORK TIMES BESTSELLERINSTANT USA TODAY BESTSELLERINSTANT #1 SUNDAY TIMES BESTSELLERThe former head of the Pentagon program responsible for the investigation of UFOs&...

www.barnesandnoble.com

In 2008 Luis Elizondo was recruited to join a classified program to study Unidentified Aerial Phenomena UAP (UFO). Accepting the position changed his world as he was enlightened by the massive classified files he reviewed. Luis went from being uninterested in the UAP topic to being a firm believer.

In order to get a deeper feeling about Luis, I watched this discussion that Luis had with Curt Jaimungal on Curt's "Theories of Everything" channel. They discussed the book and went deeper into Luis' experiences. I must say that I was beyond impressed with Luis and on all levels; personal, professional, and intellectual, etc. He is very down-to-earth and humble; what you see is what you get.

 

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In order to get a deeper feeling about Luis, I watched this discussion that Luis had with Curt Jaimungal on Curt's "Theories of Everything" channel. They discussed the book and went deeper into Luis' experiences. I must say that I was beyond impressed with Luis and on all levels; personal, professional, and intellectual, etc. He is very down-to-earth and humble; what you see is what you get.

Luis Elizondo's parents influenced his life committed to America and defending our Democracy. Protecting our country includes the possible threat of UAPs/UFOs being collision hazards in the sky and more. I am from a military family and his mindset is one I can relate to. Yet, he is supremely motivated and highly focused at a level that is hard for an average person to understand. It is maniacal. For me, that is great. This means that when HE took on the UAP phenomenon he took us along for the ride and forced it to be openly dealt with and transparently revealed. He is a committed UAP believer in whatever it is and for that I tip my hat to him.

 

[StClone]

In order to get a deeper feeling about Luis, I watched this discussion that Luis had with Curt Jaimungal on Curt's "Theories of Everything" channel. They discussed the book and went deeper into Luis' experiences. I must say that I was beyond impressed with Luis and on all levels; personal, professional, and intellectual, etc. He is very down-to-earth and humble; what you see is what you get.

At 1:31:40 time Luis talks of implants and Morgellons (disease) Fibers. Interesting as this is physical proof. Morgellons: https://www.healthline.com/health/morgellons-disease

I went to YouTube to watch it as it includes interesting comments. There are comments about needing physical proof which with UAPs/UFOs leads to the question of why it is so hard to pin down. With implants, they seem to be designed to self-decompose quickly when they are detected and/or removed. The elements and technology are at a level that we can't say what it is and therefore can not determine that it is proof of anything.