What this guy said. No one in the country thinks that outside of a few ISU fans... Doesn't mean it will work out better but come on guys.
Porter Moser to Oklahoma
- Thread starter Dandy
- Start date
The new coaching staff has been talking about energy and working hard and an up front presence. That doesn’t sound like Hoiball. By all reports Fred’s top players worked hard outside practice on strength and shooting skills but on court energy wasn’t a program philosophy. Time will tell if there actually is a philosophy change
I’m not sure is a great hire. But I do think he is the right hire for us In 2021. As for Moser, those that are critical are probably looking at the first 13 years of Moser’s head coaching career and see a well below .500 coach.
He was only at ALR for 3 years, then at Illinois State 4 where it didn't work out. When he arrived at Loyola, they were under a massive rebuild, but their turnaround is very impressive.
Was it impressive after Year 6 of that turnaround at Loyola? Moser was on the hot seat at Loyola in Year 5 and 6.
He also had Bryan Mullins who's now HC at Southern Illinois and is doing a nice job getting that program turned again even though he got crushed by injuries this year.
Just to be clear six consecutive years of below .500 in conference play equates to a great turnaround. Lol.
Jim Whitesell (current coach at Buffalo) was at Loyola the seven years before Moser. He was 119-109 and 50-70 in conference. Moser was 33-73 in his first six years in the conference. I guess I’m not seeing this masterful rebuild through the first six seasons.
I think that's just oversimplifying things. You need to get talent for sure, but coaching matters. A lot.
ISU has never recruited top 2-3 in the conference and has managed to find success beyond .500 in the Big 12 with those players.
CycloneErik
Well-Known Member
Hmmm. They stepped up to a higher conference after year 2. Nobody's mentioning that. Looks like they kept a solid upward track, and won the CBI in his 4th year of a pretty huge project.
He's definitely better than our guy right now. Maybe TJ grows and surpasses him, or maybe we get what we pay for.
Or how bout, hear me out now, maybe it’s a great turnaround since they’ve won their conference 3 out of the last 4 years and have taken them to a sweet sixteen and final four in that stretch. We’re talking about Loyola here, a program before Moser that’s been to the tourney a total of 5 times in its 107 year history.
Nah, TJ will be better just cause he’s a Cyclone. Throw out all other evidence.
I think the argument would be familiarity with the program and recruiting territory. Also losing Manek right off the bat has to hurt.
The higher conference argument is interesting. In the two years under Moser the Horizon was ranked 13th and 12th in Kenpom.
Missouri Valley in the 4 years before the Final 4 appearance were ranked 11th, 12th, 11th and 10th.
There was a slight upgrade but the Horizon wasn’t a low major at that time. It became a low major when Valpo went to the Valley.
And what I’m saying is that the last 4 years is a recruiting cycle; correct? Maybe Moser has it figured out and Oklahoma will become the Virginia of the Big 12. Or maybe the 13 years before the last 4 years is the more significant evidence and he will be another mid-major flameout.
Certainly true. The combo of Butler with the history under Stevens and Valpo who was actually the powerhouse in the final two years of the Horizon really did them in.
Why are you arguing against Moser being a good coach when he has a F4 and S16 under his belt, along with multiple conference championships? At Loyola!
I can be selective with my stats too. Steve Prohm was 83-53 in his first 4 years with 3 tournament appearances and 2 B12 tournament titles. Does that mean he’s a good coach?
Nope. And I think if he stayed at Loyola they would be above average the next 4 years. He had his Georges Niang (once in a generational player) in Cameron Krutwig. It would have been interesting to see if Loyola took a step back with five of the top 6 graduating this year. It was a hell of a recruiting cycle. But I’m not going to disregard 13 years of evidence in an effort to look beyond a single recruiting cycle. What he has done in the last 4 years at Loyola is great. But it’s not like he has coached for 5-6 years. That four years has to be measured based on the total body of work.
I think it will be a massive failure at Oklahoma. I’m on the record that I think he will be lucky to have a winning record over the next 5 years at Oklahoma. One NCAA tournament appearance and I think he is fired by 2026.
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Fred was a golden child. Everything came easy and that’s how he coached. TJ has been a grinder his whole career, playing and coaching.
