Is Next Year’s Team Honestly Going To Be Any Good?

[Cyclonepride]

I think talent is an issue for this team. Not talent at the top of the roster but talent in the middle of the roster. We have four to five guys that would log meaningful minutes on a NCAA tournament team.

As for agendas, there will always be people that criticize the head coach and players because they are juvenile. There are others that bring up legitimate concerns and questions. There are others that emphasize the positives while acknowledging the concerns. And there are many that will defend a coach no matter the context. Both parties at the extremes have agendas and the two groups in the middle can have a meaningful basketball discussion.

I disagree on the talent, as most tournament teams will have at least a couple multiple year starters. It's more the roles that inexperienced players have had to assume than a talent problem. We don't have those two or three guys with a wealth of experience to lean on. They're just not there.

 

[VeloClone]

I wouldn't say forgot to play defense. TT runs constant motion. Guys get lost, hung up on screens, out of position. It happens. Sometimes due to fatigue. On offense, give TT some credit there too. Also, we are limited in what we can do with our lack of outside shooters. Just a tough opponent for a short handed team to have to play.

This is even more effective when the officials decide that only one team sets illegal screens. There were some brutal moving screens that were let go last night. As many screens as they set on every possession there is going to be whistle at least a couple of times a game but I don't recall even one.

To be clear: officiating not the difference in the game.

 

[CycloneVet]

There will be no conference championships or final fours under Prohm.

Can't coach team offense or defense.

Great recruiter.

You are still a dumb ****

 

[oldman]

So we lost to what -- #7 TT? Still a single digit game with 5 minutes left, before the wheels fell off. Being short handed does not help.

 

[Sigmapolis]

This is even more effective when the officials decide that only one team sets illegal screens. There were some brutal moving screens that were let go last night. As many screens as they set on every possession there is going to be whistle at least a couple of times a game but I don't recall even one.

To be clear: officiating not the difference in the game.

Lard on the court... we started winning.

Lard off the court... we started losing.

Those two moving screens on him were brutal.

 

[ISUCyclones2015]

How are you going to get tix, unless you're a big donor?

You can buy the package now which includes a hotel straight from the tourney website. Something like 2k a person. https://www.wynjade.com/mauiinvitational18/pricing.html Ticket only packages get released in August. I'm gonna take the gamble and wait until August since I have hotel points to pay for my hotel. If they are sold out then I will buy off stub hub or scalp. At the very worst I will be in Hawaii for a vacation. The horror....

 

[knowlesjam]

The line between the 5-6th place team and 9-10th is really not that big in a balanced league like the B12.

Our two best players are freshmen. I think we add more with Shayok/Jacobson than we lose with DJ/Brase/Beverly.

The wild card is how much we get out of THT and the other freshmen. If THT can contribute as much as Lard/Wigginton this year, we should be a tourney team.

This. Both the daughter and I piped up at the same time last night when they put the Big 12 standings up...with a win last night Iowa State would have been tied for 7th place in the conference...of course...we also would have been tied for last.

 

[isufbcurt]

Teams only need one?

He is, but I’d consider going into a season with NWB the only primary ball handler as not conducive towards making a big step forward.

Due to better depth and seasoning we should be improved. We’ll still have some of the same weaknesses though, unless we have a better spring than the past few years. Will we ever have a good defense again?

I thought Haliburton is supposed to be a big point guard like Babb?

 

[rochclone]

The line between the 5-6th place team and 9-10th is really not that big in a balanced league like the B12.

Our two best players are freshmen. I think we add more with Shayok/Jacobson than we lose with DJ/Brase/Beverly.

The wild card is how much we get out of THT and the other freshmen. If THT can contribute as much as Lard/Wigginton this year, we should be a tourney team.

There is a big difference between 5th and us. I agree that next year will be much improved but we will need it.

Games that teams have lost by 14+ this year:

Iowa State 8 (5 in conference)
Oklahoma State 2 (2)
Baylor 2 (1)
TCU 0
Texas 1 (1)
Oklahoma 1 (1)
Kansas State 3 (3)
West Virginia 2 (1)
Kansas 0
Texas Tech 1 (1)

Past teams with losses at 14+
2016-17 1 (0)
2015-16 0
2014-15 0
2013-14 1 (1)
2012-13 1 (1)
2011-12 2 (1)
2010-11 4 (4)
2009-10 5 (3)
2008-09 10 (9)
2007-08 5 (3)
2006-07 6 (4)
2005-06. 3 (2)
2004-05 3 (1)
2003-04 5 (5)
2002-03 6 (6)
2001-02 5 (4)
2000-01. 1. (1)
1999-00. 1 (0)
1998-99 6 (4)
1997-98. 9 (8)


This is the last 20 years and we have 8 games left in this season. If we have talent, we have great coaching and we have great effort then why are we not competitive in so many games.

We don't have great talent in the middle of our roster and we need better execution in the half-court. If we had talent, coaching and effort then we wouldn't see these results that haven't been witnessed since the Petey and Haluska backcourt years.

If you have seen bad years of coaching and lack of talent then please point out those years and those coaches.

 

[Cyforce]

Wow, I really don't know how to respond to this type of overreaction so I guess I'll just compare the two squads.

First look at the five guys we return in the rotation:
Lard, if he can stay on the floor he's all=conference level.
Young, he is so much better as the complimentary post and only a Soph.
Tally. now that he's healthy he's shown he's the perfect guy to play the four when we go small, plus he's long and athletic. He brought the ball up against Press VA. Nice upgrade from Beverly as a fourth big?
Wiggy, as one weakness I can see, pretty sure he'll improve his handle for next season.
NWB, w/ a year under his belt at the point we can only expect an even better version.

Non Rotation guys
Long, ton of growth still going to have difficulty breaking into the rotation
Lewis, I think he'll be the gunner coming off the bench but not until he's a junior.

The transfers
Jacobson, I hear he's gritty and the type of guy that fights for every play which his teammates should feed off. I like Brase as a third post but he just can't stay on the floor or give us the minutes we need. from our first post off the bench.
Shayok, best player in the gym at practice. That should help to fill DJax' spot.

Recruits
Griffin & Conditt are going to be great but may struggle to get minutes.
Haliburton, same as G&C above.
THT, if this was the only guy we added we be better.

 

[isufbcurt]

I like Brase as a third post but he just can't stay on the floor or give us the minutes we need.

I thought Brase was a grad transfer thus won't be here next year.

 

[Cyclonepride]

I thought Brase was a grad transfer thus won't be here next year.

Yeah, this is his only year with us.

 

[allfourcy]

Lard on the court... we started winning.

Lard off the court... we started losing.

Those two moving screens on him were brutal.

It seems like most of the moving screens are a result of the handoff plays. It happens to a lot of teams. I get its a point of emphasis by the league but good grief. If you (as a defender) see a handoff coming to the offensive player, you should just run right into the handoff guy and flail because they'll call a foul on the defense. Annoying to see it so often in a lot of games.

 

[Cyforce]

I thought Brase was a grad transfer thus won't be here next year.

Jacobson is his replacement as the third post. I was speaking as to how next year's transfers fit in.

Tally, fills Beverly's spot
Shayok for DJax
THT for Tally

 

[isu81]

You can buy the package now which includes a hotel straight from the tourney website. Something like 2k a person. https://www.wynjade.com/mauiinvitational18/pricing.html Ticket only packages get released in August. I'm gonna take the gamble and wait until August since I have hotel points to pay for my hotel. If they are sold out then I will buy off stub hub or scalp. At the very worst I will be in Hawaii for a vacation. The horror....

I've personally never attended an athletic event where I was unable to secure tickets by scalping. If your only concern about going on a vacation to Maui to watch the Cyclones play in this tournament is tickets, I'd pack your bags.

 

[Cyclonepride]

It seems like most of the moving screens are a result of the handoff plays. It happens to a lot of teams. I get its a point of emphasis by the league but good grief. If you (as a defender) see a handoff coming to the offensive player, you should just run right into the handoff guy and flail because they'll call a foul on the defense. Annoying to see it so often in a lot of games.

Yeah, on Lard's first one, from what I could tell, he was standing still, facing out toward our player at the three point line, and just tossed it to him. I suppose his arm maybe clipped a guy as he made the pass? No idea, but nothing on that play remotely looked like a foul.

 

[jmkc12]

I appreciate Brase and Beverly being Cyclones and trying their best but they just unfortunately aren't big 12 caliber guys. Would love to see Brase without all of his past unlucky injury problems I think he could have been serviceable. Without even mentioning the freshman coming in next year, a roster that doesn't include Beverly and Brase on it will be an upgrade it's as simple as that in my opinion.

 

[Clones32]

It's called playing on the road in college basketball. Home court advantage has a much bigger impact in basketball than in any other sport, especially for a young team like we have.

 

[CyTwins]

We're Oklahoma last year. OP should feel bad about starting this thread

 

[acgclone]

There is a big difference between 5th and us. I agree that next year will be much improved but we will need it.

Games that teams have lost by 14+ this year:

Iowa State 8 (5 in conference)
Oklahoma State 2 (2)
Baylor 2 (1)
TCU 0
Texas 1 (1)
Oklahoma 1 (1)
Kansas State 3 (3)
West Virginia 2 (1)
Kansas 0
Texas Tech 1 (1)

Past teams with losses at 14+
2016-17 1 (0)
2015-16 0
2014-15 0
2013-14 1 (1)
2012-13 1 (1)
2011-12 2 (1)
2010-11 4 (4)
2009-10 5 (3)
2008-09 10 (9)
2007-08 5 (3)
2006-07 6 (4)
2005-06. 3 (2)
2004-05 3 (1)
2003-04 5 (5)
2002-03 6 (6)
2001-02 5 (4)
2000-01. 1. (1)
1999-00. 1 (0)
1998-99 6 (4)
1997-98. 9 (8)


This is the last 20 years and we have 8 games left in this season. If we have talent, we have great coaching and we have great effort then why are we not competitive in so many games.

We don't have great talent in the middle of our roster and we need better execution in the half-court. If we had talent, coaching and effort then we wouldn't see these results that haven't been witnessed since the Petey and Haluska backcourt years.

If you have seen bad years of coaching and lack of talent then please point out those years and those coaches.

That stat doesn't look good, I'll give you that. But I think a lot of that can be attributed to how young we are overall. Our two best players are FR. DJ is really the only upperclassman right now of any real value (and his role is more suited to Tyrus McGee's off the bench). Beverly and Brase were stop-gap measures. They were a result of recruiting failures along the way by both Fred and Prohm. I agree that Prohm has his work cut out for him, but help is on the way.

This is a reset, and one that was probably needed. In fact, even if Fred had stayed, we were probably due for a reset year. The key is keeping it to a year, and getting back into the tourney next year.

Right now, I'd say we have a good shot at that. 50/50 is reasonable odds for getting back in, IMO.

It's on Prohm to get us across that line. If we can't get into 6th place or better next year, then I'll be worried.