I suppose you agree that the B12 just wasn't all that this year ...

Discussion in 'Big XII Conference' started by surly, Mar 25, 2019.

  1. weR138

    weR138 Well-Known Member

    Feb 20, 2008
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    If you're invited to participate in a tournament; you're "worthy" of that tournament.

    If you win a game in said tournament your "worthiness" is beyond question.

    Pretty basic logic.
     
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  2. randomfan44

    randomfan44 Well-Known Member

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    Tech has 250 pound Odiase to match up with UMs Teske. He had 14 points and 15 boards vs. Buffalo and will be just fine.

    Owens will match up with Brazdeikis, who is 215 pounds and shoots 35% of his shots from beyond the three point line.

    But cool theory.
     
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  3. JP4CY

    JP4CY Well-Known Member
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    I would not want to play TT at all.
     
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  4. surly

    surly Well-Known Member

    May 16, 2013
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    My premise is that the conference is not at all strong this year, like last when it put 3 in the E8. You dispute that?
     
  5. ClonesFTW

    ClonesFTW Well-Known Member
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    Show me another conference that was decimated by injuries to their stars more than the B12 this season:

    ISU - Wigginton
    KU - Azubuikie
    KSt- Wade
    WVU - Konate
    Baylor - Tristan Clark
    TCU - Jaylen Fisher
     
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  6. guacamole7

    guacamole7 Member

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    While i agree the big12 didn't have many "great" teams, it is beyond asinine to judge a conference purely based on results in a single elimination tournament with random match ups. Let's throw out the 30+ data points we have on each team prior and then use the smallest sample size possible and just go with that as fact. If we want to use similar logic, let's discard the regular season big12 and just use the big12 tournament to assess the teams. That means Tech isn't even a top 4 team in the conference. Clearly I'm not advocating that, I'm just saying it's the same criteria.
     
  7. surly

    surly Well-Known Member

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    You can rationalize that way if you choose. But for me, it's how the league does in the tournament that determines it's overall strength. Last year 3 went to the E8. This year, I'll be surprised if any make it. By my standard, whether you agree or not, the B12 is not as good this year as last and is 4th overall as a conference, if that. Hold out for TxT though. :cool:
     
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  8. guacamole7

    guacamole7 Member

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    That's what I'm disagreeing with you, assessing league strength purely based on the NCAA makes little sense. The fact UCF had a few unlucky breaks doesn't mean that the ACC is now that much better since they have an additional team in the Sweet 16. Also, why are you using the Elite 8 as the barometer? That seems completely arbitrary. Why not overall record? Why not Sweet 16 or Final 4?
     
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  9. CloniesForLife

    CloniesForLife Well-Known Member

    Apr 22, 2015
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    Big12 is solid top to bottom but I honestly only had 2 teams in the Sweet 16. One of those was ISU so it might have been a homer pick but K-State w/o Wade wasn't making it and KU against Auburn wasn't a good match up. I am not shocked at all with the performance so far. Hoping Tech can get past Michigan and represent.
     
  10. surly

    surly Well-Known Member

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    What the hell, the NCAA makes little sense? Why do we watch if that's true? Right now, teams should be at their prime, playing their collective best, sans injuries that derail some along the way. And it's not one team, that's the whole point of making an overall conference assessment. The tournament allows us to judge how a conference is doing, not the single upset winner or loser like UCF. Interestingly, there's a lot of chalk this year.
     
  11. kcbob79clone

    kcbob79clone Active Member

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    March Madness is all about the matchups and if a player gets hot that you don't expect. For example 2nd best Ohio State player we held to 2 points but others shot lights out. Then that player was good against Houston, and oh by the way the officials were calling the moving screens against Ohio State but maybe that belongs in a different thread :)

    Can't base league strength on March Madness but the body of work.
     
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  12. awd4cy

    awd4cy Well-Known Member

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    I really don’t understand the thinking that TCU should have been in the tourney. Their non conference was weak and the went 7-11 in the Big 12. Their resume stunk.
     
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  13. BillBrasky4Cy

    BillBrasky4Cy Well-Known Member

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    Just like bowl games but using tournament performance to determine conference strength is freakin lazy. The big dance is all about match ups and who catches the breaks. I know it's crazy but sometimes teams just have a bad game and poof they've been eliminated.
     
  14. BillBrasky4Cy

    BillBrasky4Cy Well-Known Member

    Dec 10, 2013
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    He's not wrong though. Go back 15-20 years and tell me how many times the perceived #1 team won the championship?. How many of those years was the elite 8 or final 4 anywhere close to being chalk? Weird **** happens in the tournament but that's what makes it appointment television.
     
  15. CyCrazy

    CyCrazy Well-Known Member

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    What does 3 elite 8 teams have to do with anything. It's mostly about matchups.
     
  16. surly

    surly Well-Known Member

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    That's one of the worst/lazy comparisons ever. Bowl games are so meaningless that players now aren't even participating. While the dance is an absolute gut-wrenching play for every team, player and fan. Give me a break, please.

     
  17. cycart

    cycart Active Member

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    So hypothetically, say TTU wins the title. Does that make the Big 12 the best conference this year? 2nd best ? 3rd? or 4th regardless of whether the "Best" team in the country was in the league?
     
  18. alarson

    alarson Well-Known Member

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    Actually its probably even less of a quality metric than bowl games.

    Bowl games usually at least match up top vs top, middle vs middle, whereas in the first couple rounds you're often matching up the best teams vs more middle-ground ones.

    Of the 6 teams the big 12 got in:
    2 (OU, Baylor)- lost to the 1 seed in their region after beating more comparably seeded teams in an 8\9 game
    1 (Kansas)- lost to a better seeded team after beating a lesser seeded team
    1 (ISU) lost to a lower seeded team.
    1 (KSU)- lost after having its best player unavailable
    1 (Tech) is still playing

    Aside from ISU\KSU basically everyone performed 'to seed'. And as a the 24th overall seeded team, even ISU only really missed their seed expected result, making it to the round of 32, by one round.
     
  19. surly

    surly Well-Known Member

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    That means TxT was the outlier because the conference overall never made it out of the first weekend, not a single member. But that's not happening anyway, rhetorical as it may be.
     
  20. BillBrasky4Cy

    BillBrasky4Cy Well-Known Member

    Dec 10, 2013
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    It wasn't a direct comparison dumb dumb. I used bowl game performance because people love to use that as some form of conference SOS justification, which is stupid. Just like using the NCAA tournament as a conference SOS stupid.
     

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