from the Memphis 247 site
3 fans and the Admins take on Tyler Harris when he announced ISU
***Official 2019-2020 Transfer Thread***
- Thread starter ruflosn
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from the Memphis 247 site
3 fans and the Admins take on Tyler Harris when he announced ISU
Harris coming off the bench at Memphis is like Wigginton or McGee coming off the bench for us. I’m sure plenty of teams would have taken either even if they “didn’t even start for Iowa State”.
I'll go with predicting he starts part time this year and instead of 7-8ppg more like 9-10ppg this year and 12-13 next year after JC-L leavesim on record 7-8 ppg.
will be happy if its higher and im wrong. please remember to call me out
Sounds like they think we're getting a less efficient and shorter version of Lindell Wigginton if I'm reading between the lines right
He's never going to be Wigginton's size (not that Wigginton was all that big really) but at least he has a similar vertical and fast twitch about him.
Maybe he can build up to similar efficiency as an upperclassmen, with or without a redshirt year to work on his game before he returns.
"Bench flamethrower" sixth man is an important role, even if he is never a starter.
Interesting that they don't think he'll receive the waiver. I still think he does, but we'll just have to see. Those posters did confirm what all of us thought though.. He's a talented player and can really shoot it, but he's most effective at the 2 position. A lot of us have said, including me, that next year we might have a PG by committee, with Bolton having the ball in his hands the most. Bolton actually did a pretty good job of finding guys for shots on the wings / corner, it was when he got too far under the basket is when he struggled to make decisions. His handle also needs to get better, however I'm sure Prohm knows that and he's been working on it.
I can see why people are worried about finding a formal PG to run the show when we have had the position manned by this lineage...
Lucious
Morris
Weiler-Babb
Haliburton
...the past eight seasons. Two of those guys are all-time Cyclones/NBA PGs, and the other two were above average high-major starters. You could say we had Royce White playing "PG"/point forward the season before, who is another all-timer talent.
I think they have been really obsessive about it, though. Like I posted earlier, our offensive efficiency did not decline without Haliburton. Our defensive efficiency sure did, but we made do on offense with low-post touches to Young and Bolton attacking the basket instead of relying on Tyrese to create off the P&R. And it still worked fine.
I have no doubt the offense is going to be fine with our present pieces. Still concerned about defense, but we know that we are just going to have to wait to see.
Yeah we have been blessed at the PG position ever since Fred took over. Even Fred's first year here, we had Diante Garrett running the show.
Wasn’t Weiler-Babb a SG out of HS and at Arkansas? He transitioned to PG pretty well.
Of course Memphis fans are going to say he’s a SG when that’s what he played there.
Of course Memphis fans are going to say he’s a SG when that’s what he played there.
you still have the ability to get young low post touches and have Bolton attacking the basket this year but now you add a good outside threat in Harris that will open both of those things up even more for young and Bolton. I see Harris being in the floor as a way to spread it out as a huge benefit offensively
There's a faction of anti-transfer people who think almost everyone should not receive a waiver. The leader of this group likens West Virginia basketball to a long weekend at your in-laws.
Yeah he was a SG. He rarely played though at Arkansas.. Saw 4.5 mpg. He's also never been a great shooter to be the two, but has had more of a slasher mentality. His sophomore year when he came off the bench, he did well at just that. Sprinting the wing on fast breaks, crashing the boards, and then guarding well on the defensive end and rebounding. When we got Wiggs the next year, Prohm was stuck between having to play Lindell or Donovan at the 1, however found Nick was able to do a pretty good job at running the show at his size, and that allowed Lindell and Donny to run off screens. He wasn't great at taking care of the ball, but he sure could facilitate, averaging 6.5 assists to 2.5 turnovers a game his junior year.
Next year we could see something similar. Someone could come out of no where and do a good job at getting the ball into scorer's hands. Here's the good thing about that.. if our waivers go through, we're going to have quite a few talented guys offensively. Prohm's a good enough offensive coach to be able to figure out how to get guys in positions to make plays.
The numbers there are those of a very good college PG.
He just was not very good at taking care of the ball compared to Monté Morris.
But who really is...?
At this point, I kind of assume if I'm reading a bad take, it's probably yours.
Of more relevance are the PGs that Prohm has had since he became HC:
Canaan
Payne
Morris
NWB
TH
4 of those 5 are/were NBA players. Prohm was fortunate that NWB emerged in 2017-18 after D.Jackson and LW both flamed out at PG. Is there another NWB type that will bail out Prohm next season? I have my doubts. If not, it will be the first time that Prohm has to manage co facilitators for a full season and I have my doubts he will be successful in doing so.
And for those saying the offense was "fine" after TH could no longer play last season, that's nonsense and the post TH record reflects that. Defense was the bigger issue but the offense certainly wasn't fine.
I have a feeling this whole Javan Johnson point forward thing is the real deal.
I guess I should not say he wasn't good at taking care of the ball. That's disrespectful. I think I said that because sometimes he turnovers were wtf moments lol.
How about we talk about that 1/3 of a season stretch at the end of last year when your list of Prohm PG runs out -- so he was down to a by committee system of Bolton, Nixon, and Jackson III running the nominal point for us.
I will keep my reply simple. Here are the average adjusted efficiency metrics on Bart Torvik last year for the season before and after Haliburton's injury...
AFTER includes all games after Kansas State in Hilton *and* the loss against Florida A&M when Tyrese did not play. BEFORE includes all the games earlier in the season save FAMU, and I threw K-State out because Tyrese played in one half of it.
OFFENSE
---
BEFORE = 107.26 (if a full season, roughly #80 nationally)
AFTER = 109.11 (roughly #52)
DEFENSE (remember that you want a low score here)
---
BEFORE = 97.34 (roughly #75)
AFTER = 104.37 (roughly #227)
We *gained* two points per 100 without Tyrese but lost about seven points per 100 on defense. Losing Tyrese Haliburton was losing five points per 100 (a very reasonably number for an excellent player like him) last year, but it was more on defense that we felt it. The offense is going to be fine next year -- really, it will.
I just wonder if we will be able to stop people. Having a guy with Tyrese's instincts and size out there to guard the opponents' best guard and steal the ball is really useful, and we missed that more than we missed his scoring.
Yes, I know this seems counter-intuitive or even insane, but the numbers are what they are. Bolton and Young can lead a good offense together.
I elaborate on this point here, if you would like to take a look...
https://cyclonefanatic.com/forum/th...ecruiting-thread.230362/page-113#post-7136203
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The offense WAS fine, we just couldn't make shots, and when it sort of seemed like things were clicking, Tyrese goes down. When you get wide open shots to guys and they can't make it, that's not bad offense. When you continuously give up back cut after back cut, don't talk on screens, are constantly in mismatches, can't defend the three well, and don't get back in transition.. your defense is awful.
I also don't know why you're blaming Prohm or trying to act like Prohm got lucky playing Nick at the PG. The job of the coach is to put players in the best positions for the team to succeed. That's what Prohm did with Nick. Prohm saw that his team would be better with the ball not in Lindell and Donovan's hands the whole time. That's good coaching.
