***Official 2019-2020 Transfer Thread***

[isucy86]

Do you know what year it is and who our coach is?

I do and my hope CSP has taken this spring to change his approach. Historically, he approached offense and defense using a singular approach. Good coaches are flexible to play man or zone. They do different things on offense to leverage their talent and take advantage of mismatches.

I realize small ball is the rage in hoops, but so was the Mike Leach spread offense in FB. What was unique 2-3 years ago can become the commonplace and opposing coaches catch up. That was part of what doomed Paul Rhoads.

 

[isucy86]

When considering shooting the ball, ask yourself three questions...

Is it a dunk?
Is it a layup?
Is it an open corner three?

If you answered yes to any of these questions, then go ahead and shoot it.

If not -- don't.

That's true in ISU's offense because 4 guys are standing on the 3pt line waiting for the ballhandler to drive.

If a player can make around 50% on 10-15' jump shots, I'll take that everyday.

 

[CYEATHAWK]

What was unique 2-3 years ago can become the commonplace and opposing coaches catch up. That was part of what doomed Paul Rhoads.

That and the airport being so far away.

 

[NATEizKING]

Thread sucks now

 

[ruflosn]

Am I petty seeing 'there' instead of 'their'? Especially, as this should be something Michigan might want to 'advise' the wording on.

Your the only won so far.

 

[heitclone]

Don't get me wrong I'd love to have him next year but I might be more excited about Eastern a sit out than coming right in. An elite defender with a year to work on his offensive game thrown in the rotation we've potentially have coming back would be really nice. That said,even without a sit out year to improve, he's good enough to move the needle next year and I'm not really ready to give up on it just yet. He'd be a great get for this season.

 

[Hayes30]

You obviously have no idea how an offense works either. Try playing 4 on 5 on offense. They will sag off him clog the middle, if we set a screen they won't have to make decision they will hedge to the screener every time. Our best shooter or the ball handler will get doubled frequently because they don't have to guard him. You scream about our offense isn't the problem but you can't ruin your offense to fix your defense.

Did you ever play the game

You also don't win many games if you don't play defense.

 

[JCloned]

One bad or non-shooter does not ruin an offense. We played Nixon and Jacobson as starters most of last season, and teams’ responses to them was... sagging off and then daring them to shoot it. Heck, they begged those two to shoot it. They often obliged, and Nixon was Brick City most of the season. Jacobson was slightly better but still pretty ugly.

Eastern is wash with those guys as a shooter, presents an upgrade as a slasher, and is an incredible upgrade on defense. I appreciate your appreciation for spacing on offense, but you cannot be as impossibly absolutist about it as you are attempting to be right now. There are other phases to the game, and you can build a successful offense with somebody besides just having five crack shooters out there.

The problem with last season was not our 7th in the conference shooting. It was our historically bad defense. You can afford to trade a little on offense if it gets your defense out of whatever cavern that was a few hundred feet below the cellar last year. I doubt we end up with this guy in any event, but our roster last year had one elite two-way player in Tyrese, a bunch of guys okay on offense but bad at defense, and then a bunch of bad players. A guy who is negative on offense and elite on defense represents a substantial upgrade on virtually every one of our returners save probably Bolton and Young. We are nowhere near good enough to be as picky as what you are suggesting.

Michigan is way better than us and wanted him.

Ok I was going to let this drop, but there is one thing that I just have to respond to. When you say "We played Nixon and Jacobson as starters most of last season, and teams’ responses to them was... sagging off and then daring them to shoot it. Heck, they begged those two to shoot it. They often obliged, and Nixon was Brick City most of the season. Jacobson was slightly better but still pretty ugly." Let's compare the stats and see if they are a wash...

Nixon 2pt 45.5% 3 pt 26.3%, FT 67.9%
Jacobson 2pt 47.1% 3pt 30%, FT 69.0%
Eastern 2pt 42.7%, 3 pt % 0%, FT 48.5%

As bad as Nixon and Jacobson looked at times from 3, they are Matt Thomas compared to Eastern so not a wash. I will stop the back and forth now. Given how badly Nixon was crucified (deserved or not) can you imagine if he shot as bad as Eastern did this year.

 

[JCloned]

Your the only won so far.

I see what you did there

 

[JCloned]

I do and my hope CSP has taken this spring to change his approach. Historically, he approached offense and defense using a singular approach. Good coaches are flexible to play man or zone. They do different things on offense to leverage their talent and take advantage of mismatches.

I realize small ball is the rage in hoops, but so was the Mike Leach spread offense in FB. What was unique 2-3 years ago can become the commonplace and opposing coaches catch up. That was part of what doomed Paul Rhoads.

I think you make a good point, being flexible to your personnel is a must in college ball, even if you recruit to your "system", sometimes the guys just don't fit the way you thought they would and you need to be willing to adjust. I kind of thought Prohm did try to adjust at times, but we had a number of guys that just wouldn't execute regardless of the system. Hopefully, the incoming freshman and transfers work out better.

 

[Clone95]

So, basically a 6’7” Nixon that doesn’t chuck 3s. I’ll take that all day long. Plus this guy can take people to the hole even if they sag off him, unlike Jacobsen so less need to be a 3 pt threat. Almost 3 assists per game so he can dish a bit, too.

I don’t think Michigan is thinking “phew, we dodged a bullet with this”.

 

[JP4CY]

DJ Carton get a waiver. Hopefully Harris does too.

Just coming here to say that.

 

[Sigmapolis]

Ok I was going to let this drop, but there is one thing that I just have to respond to. When you say "We played Nixon and Jacobson as starters most of last season, and teams’ responses to them was... sagging off and then daring them to shoot it. Heck, they begged those two to shoot it. They often obliged, and Nixon was Brick City most of the season. Jacobson was slightly better but still pretty ugly." Let's compare the stats and see if they are a wash...

Nixon 2pt 45.5% 3 pt 26.3%, FT 67.9%
Jacobson 2pt 47.1% 3pt 30%, FT 69.0%
Eastern 2pt 42.7%, 3 pt % 0%, FT 48.5%

As bad as Nixon and Jacobson looked at times from 3, they are Matt Thomas compared to Eastern so not a wash. I will stop the back and forth now. Given how badly Nixon was crucified (deserved or not) can you imagine if he shot as bad as Eastern did this year.

Our adjusted offensive efficiency last year was 109.3 per 100 possessions.

That is 1.093 per possession. Call it 1.1 points per possession.

Nixon shooting a three = 0.789 expected points
Jacobson shooting a three = 0.9 expected points

Both outcomes are inefficient plays for us. If an opposing defense is smart, it wants those two chuckin', and my oh my, they were happy to oblige.

True shooting % and usage last year...

Eastern = 42.8% @ 16.1% usage
Nixon = 44.6% @ 20.0% usage
Jacobson = 49.5% @ 17.9% usage

All three of them were bad on offense. You are right about that. Despite that, we had the #3 adjusted offensive efficiency in the Big 12 before Haliburton went down. We had the #10 adjusted defensive efficiency and were miles behind #9.

Eastern presents most of the same problems as those two when he is shooting the ball. Given that, however, he is better at basically everything else on the court. He actually seems to move the ball, too, given the assist rates last year...

Eastern = 20.3%
Nixon = 13.7%
Jacobson = 7.4%

Eastern's assist rate is higher than Bolton's (17.8%) from last year.

Eastern would not be a great player in a half-court offense, but we were, again, #3 in the conference despite having two bricktastic black holes out there in Nixon and Jacobson. Eastern is just as bricktastic (at a lower usage, which minimizes this problem) who actually offers some ball movement... he actually looks like a very good passer for his position, who can attack the rim, and would be a huge upgrade on defense.

I get the "spacing spacing spacing" mentality, but you can take it too far. Eastern is at worst a slight downgrade on offense compared to a couple of tomato cans and would be a huge upgrade on defense. That is a 100% take for us.

Not that we probably have a shot.

Michigan wanted him for a good set of reasons -- see above.

Nixon but 6'7", actually good at defense, and with a good combo guard's assist rate is a useful player. He would be an upgrade compared to other options.

Way more ways to run a basketball team than just putting five shooters out there.

 

[CyTwins]

Our adjusted offensive efficiency last year was 109.3 per 100 possessions.

That is 1.093 per possession. Call it 1.1 points per possession.

Nixon shooting a three = 0.789 expected points
Jacobson shooting a three = 0.9 expected points

Both outcomes are inefficient plays for us. If an opposing defense is smart, it wants those two chuckin', and my oh my, they were happy to oblige.

True shooting % and usage last year...

Eastern = 42.8% @ 16.1% usage
Nixon = 44.6% @ 20.0% usage
Jacobson = 49.5% @ 17.9% usage

All three of them were bad on offense. You are right about that. Despite that, we had the #3 adjusted offensive efficiency in the Big 12 before Haliburton went down. We had the #10 adjusted defensive efficiency and were miles behind #9.

Eastern presents most of the same problems as those two when he is shooting the ball. Given that, however, he is better at basically everything else on the court. He actually seems to move the ball, too, given the assist rates last year...

Eastern = 20.3%
Nixon = 13.7%
Jacobson = 7.4%

Eastern's assist rate is higher than Bolton's (17.8%) from last year.

Eastern would not be a great player in a half-court offense, but we were, again, #3 in the conference despite having two bricktastic black holes out there in Nixon and Jacobson. Eastern is just as bricktastic (at a lower usage, which minimizes this problem) who actually offers some ball movement... he actually looks like a very good passer for his position, who can attack the rim, and would be a huge upgrade on defense.

I get the "spacing spacing spacing" mentality, but you can take it too far. Eastern is at worst a slight downgrade on offense compared to a couple of tomato cans and would be a huge upgrade on defense. That is a 100% take for us.

Not that we probably have a shot.

Michigan wanted him for a good set of reasons -- see above.

Nixon but 6'7", actually good at defense, and with a good combo guard's assist rate is a useful player. He would be an upgrade compared to other options.

Way more ways to run a basketball team than just putting five shooters out there.

It's crazy some of our fans just look at 3 point percentage to judge a player. Eastern is so good we probably don't even have a shot at him and people are asking if he's a take lol

For the millionth time our offense will always be good under Prohm. Defense is what needs to be fixed

 

[ChickenNuggetMan]

So, basically a 6’7” Nixon that doesn’t chuck 3s. I’ll take that all day long. Plus this guy can take people to the hole even if they sag off him, unlike Jacobsen so less need to be a 3 pt threat. Almost 3 assists per game so he can dish a bit, too.

I don’t think Michigan is thinking “phew, we dodged a bullet with this”.

Actually, I did some digging on Reddit. Seems Eastern’s mom is a huge concern, classic “my kid will be drafted #1 overall” business but she constantly gets involved and is very vocal. There are definitely some that feel glad he’s leaving, FWIW.

 

[Sigmapolis]

It's crazy some of our fans just look at 3 point percentage to judge a player. Eastern is so good we probably don't even have a shot at him and people are asking if he's a take lol

For the millionth time our offense will always be good under Prohm. Defense is what needs to be fixed

Chicks dig the long-ball.

Plenty of people over-learned the Hoiberg "spacing spacing spacing" mentality.

People tend to forget those Hoiberg teams were very good but hardly dominant, and their main failings were they got killed on the boards and were bad at defense (though still much better than the goat rodeo it was last year) even if they scored.

Yes, teams like the Warriors' dynasty had great shooters as their foundation, but it also had excellent defensive players like Klay Thompson, Andre Iguodala, and Draymond Green as fixtures. I already brought up what the non-shooting Rodman meant to the Pistons and Bulls' dynasties. I do not get how people reject this reality.

 

[Messi]

Actually, I did some digging on Reddit. Seems Eastern’s mom is a huge concern, classic “my kid will be drafted #1 overall” business but she constantly gets involved and is very vocal. There are definitely some that feel glad he’s leaving, FWIW.

 

[TrianglePlace]

Actually, I did some digging on Reddit. Seems Eastern’s mom is a huge concern, classic “my kid will be drafted #1 overall” business but she constantly gets involved and is very vocal. There are definitely some that feel glad he’s leaving, FWIW.

I was going to post something similar. If Eastern comes here this board will become rather interesting. His mom was well known on the PU Rivals board and was not shy about sharing opinions on her son and the team.

 

[Messi]

I was going to post something similar. If Eastern comes here this board will become rather interesting. His mom was well known on the PU Rivals board and was not shy about sharing opinions on her son and the team.

lil' spice on the boards could be fun

 

[heitclone]

Our adjusted offensive efficiency last year was 109.3 per 100 possessions.

That is 1.093 per possession. Call it 1.1 points per possession.

Nixon shooting a three = 0.789 expected points
Jacobson shooting a three = 0.9 expected points

Both outcomes are inefficient plays for us. If an opposing defense is smart, it wants those two chuckin', and my oh my, they were happy to oblige.

True shooting % and usage last year...

Eastern = 42.8% @ 16.1% usage
Nixon = 44.6% @ 20.0% usage
Jacobson = 49.5% @ 17.9% usage

All three of them were bad on offense. You are right about that. Despite that, we had the #3 adjusted offensive efficiency in the Big 12 before Haliburton went down. We had the #10 adjusted defensive efficiency and were miles behind #9.

Eastern presents most of the same problems as those two when he is shooting the ball. Given that, however, he is better at basically everything else on the court. He actually seems to move the ball, too, given the assist rates last year...

Eastern = 20.3%
Nixon = 13.7%
Jacobson = 7.4%

Eastern's assist rate is higher than Bolton's (17.8%) from last year.

Eastern would not be a great player in a half-court offense, but we were, again, #3 in the conference despite having two bricktastic black holes out there in Nixon and Jacobson. Eastern is just as bricktastic (at a lower usage, which minimizes this problem) who actually offers some ball movement... he actually looks like a very good passer for his position, who can attack the rim, and would be a huge upgrade on defense.

I get the "spacing spacing spacing" mentality, but you can take it too far. Eastern is at worst a slight downgrade on offense compared to a couple of tomato cans and would be a huge upgrade on defense. That is a 100% take for us.

Not that we probably have a shot.

Michigan wanted him for a good set of reasons -- see above.

Nixon but 6'7", actually good at defense, and with a good combo guard's assist rate is a useful player. He would be an upgrade compared to other options.

Way more ways to run a basketball team than just putting five shooters out there.

The other thing is, it wasn't necessarily Nixon or MJ that were the problem. It was having to play them BOTH the entire game, plus having no PG the last half of the year, plus playing almost exclusively against a set defense because we couldn't get stops, plus being on the floor with fr like Jackson and Grill, two kids who were not only fr (inconsistent) but also in a bit over their heads offensively. Those factors combined magnified each players weaknesses. They were both asked to more than they should have been, this years roster wouldn't put that pressure on a guy like Eastern.