WhI have player is under the radar?

[clonedude]

The thing I don't get about the 3-4 is that why would we want to run a defense that magnifies the spot where we have the least depth or talent. I don't see any OLB on our squad that fit the 3-4 mold. Are we expecting position changes? I think we will see times with 3 DL on the field but it won't be a true 3-4 it'll be more like a nickel hybrid with a DB playing one of the OLB spots and our starting LB's playing the others. Wally did the same thing in the 4-3 when we didn't have LB depth a few years ago, we played undersized LB's (more or less a DB) at WLB to match the spread offenses we see week in/week out.

It's obvious that the coaching staff LOVES what Jay Jones brings as a pass rushing blitzer as an OLB in a 3-4, but I'm not sure you change your entire defensive scheme around one guy that hasn't even played a down for you yet, would you?

As I said in the post above, Wally has forgotten more about football than I'll ever know, so I trust him. Plus, part of me thinks, yeah why not mix it up a bit from the past years where we've been one of the worst defenses in college football. So whatever Wally decides is good with me.

I was just looking forward to seeing Pierson and Taylor this year as DE's in a 4-3 getting good pressure on the QB, but now they are going to be asked to just hold the line and let the LB's do the job basically. Not sure if that's the best strategy or not?

 

[oldwiseman]

Demond Tucker - 6'0 296
Casey Hampton - 6'1 325
Vince Wilfork - 6'2 325

I think we finally have that low center of gravity player to anchor the line in a 3-4 that we haven't had in the past. Can't run a 3-4 effectively without that player. Not sure what happens if he's not in the game though.

 

[clonedude]

Demond Tucker - 6'0 296
Casey Hampton - 6'1 325
Vince Wilfork - 6'2 325

I think we finally have that low center of gravity player to anchor the line in a 3-4 that we haven't had in the past. Can't run a 3-4 effectively without that player. Not sure what happens if he's not in the game though.

I'm guessing Cousin would be the next guy in? I just wonder if 296 lbs is big enough for the NT position in a 3-4? I feel like Demond Tucker is just going to be double teamed to death in a 3-4 especially. Which should open up something for someone else, but who knows?

 

[BWRhasnoAC]

Jhaustin is probably that down OLB fit. Big, strong, fast. I can see lots of ways to mix up the line and still be effective. Cousins has a NG body. Piersen is really small so I think it maybe be better for Jhaustin to play the 5 tech and make Piersen a OLB. Idk though, I haven't seen them practice but its very exciting.

 

[cyfanatic13]

Starting 1's right now...Harris, Harvey, Jones, Levi.

That might be the case on September 5th but as of right now is not the case

 

[DuckDynastyCy]

That's my thought as well, that's why it doesn't seem like a base defense. Most teams wouldn't use those three as DL in the 3-4... Most would have Tucker as a DE(but maybe not because of how short he is) and Pierson as a pass rushing OLB.

I'm wondering if they are moving Thomas to the middle on 3-4? I have seen him in video playing NT basically, so maybe he is part of that package?

 

[DuckDynastyCy]

And my under the radar guy would be Q Floyd at S.

 

[Beyerball]

I'm wondering if they are moving Thomas to the middle on 3-4? I have seen him in video playing NT basically, so maybe he is part of that package?

Nah. 2nd string Dline would be Cousins at Nt, Aka and Jhausten at the DEs. Not a bad 2nd string IMO. JH isn't big enough to play NT.

 

[RustShack]

I am LOVING this discussion! This is the kind of thing I really enjoy talking about on here.... X's and O's, strategy, etc.

I'm thinking Beyer is on to something here. Most people that have seen some practices, scrimmages, etc have all stated that we're in the 3-4 a LOT. And I don't think it's plausible that we'll be playing the 3-4 one play and then jump into the 4-3 the next play, or even switching it up on different series. I suppose we could go to the 3-4 in obvious passing situations or something, I don't know?

I feel like I have a pretty good basic understanding of football, maybe not, but if Pierson and Taylor are put on the line in a 3-4, doesn't that limit their pass rushing abilities to basically nothing? So your'e taking their best strengths away from them, correct? The OLB's become your pass rushers now, correct?

Don't get me wrong, I'm up for trying ANYTHING at this point if I think it will help. Our defense has been so bad over the years that maybe we should try something different? I'm not sure? I just think we now have some decent DE's, but we're going to make them basically ineffective. And LB is really thin and inexperienced, but now we need to be 8 deep there instead of 6 deep basically?

Thoughts?

Typically quick pass rushing DE's in the 4-3 are OLB's in the 3-4.

 

[CycloneRoss]

A 3-4 defense basically neutralizes Tucker's strengths. He's so explosive and quick off the ball, but in a 3-4 he's basically there to anchor the front and is going to be double-teamed a lot. Really will waste his talents, IMO.

 

[RustShack]

In the 3-4 your DLs main priority is taking up blockers, and stopping the run. You're a really good DL if you can also collapse the pocket and get to the QB.

Typically you want the DE's to be at least 6'4" 300 Lb. and Normally 325-50 for NT, although there have been a few exceptions. That's the NFL norm, not sure about college.

 

[Wesley]

Levi Peters.

 

[CoKane]

Is there anyone on the team that isn't under the radar?

 

[DuckDynastyCy]

Nah. 2nd string Dline would be Cousins at Nt, Aka and Jhausten at the DEs. Not a bad 2nd string IMO. JH isn't big enough to play NT.

Well I did see Thomas lining up over center in practice. Maybe they are looking at him as a 3rd and Long DL to give Tucker a blow and use his height to batt down balls and disrupt the QB? I found it odd he was lining up there also but maybe they are trying to use him after seeing Irving flash at that position 2 years ago?

 

[oldwiseman]

A 3-4 defense basically neutralizes Tucker's strengths. He's so explosive and quick off the ball, but in a 3-4 he's basically there to anchor the front and is going to be double-teamed a lot. Really will waste his talents, IMO.

That's the whole point. If he requires a double team someone else is unblocked. Casey Hampton wasn't some sack machine. Why do you think the LB's were such stat machines in the Steelers Defense during Hampton's time there? Our linebackers just need to be able to make plays in a situation where Tucker is taking up 2 blockers. That's a question mark.

 

[KarlHungus]

If we run a 3-4 Base this year our DL is going to get eaten up. A good 3-4 needs depth, something we don't have. There is no way Pierson holds up all season trying to play against 600 pounds and we all know that. Don't get me wrong, I'm a big fan of the 3-4, especially against the Big12, but a 3-4 needs an offense that can hold the ball and drive, the DL guys Have to have rest if they are going to make it.

I don't see ISU running much, if any, 3-4 against teams that run the ball downhill like Iowa, K State and Oklahoma. It'll be good against teams that like to spread you out, however...which is most of the conference.

 

[cuphues]

I don't see ISU running much, if any, 3-4 against teams that run the ball downhill like Iowa, K State and Oklahoma. It'll be good against teams that like to spread you out, however...which is most of the conference.

In spite of having ground and pound RB's, Oklahoma just brought in a new offensive coordinator for this season and is installing a spread attack. Lincoln Riley, if I am not mistaken is a Mike Leach disciple and will be running the "air raid" offense that Texas Tech used to run under Leach. So the 3-4 really would be a better fit against 10 of our 12 games. I am all for it, although slightly skeptical of it making a substantial difference for us.

 

[clonedude]

Typically quick pass rushing DE's in the 4-3 are OLB's in the 3-4.

I understand that, but everyone on here so far has stated that our 4-3 DE's (Pierson and Taylor) would be the DE's in the 3-4 as well. IMO, they would make more sense as OLB's.

 

[CycloneCrazies]

That might be the case on September 5th but as of right now is not the case

According to Alex Halsted from Scout the starting LBs at the Girdiron Club scrimmage were Jones, Harris, Harvey, and Peters.

 

[clonedude]

According to Alex Halsted from Scout the starting LBs at the Girdiron Club scrimmage were Jones, Harris, Harvey, and Peters.

That would coincide then with what Beyer has been saying. Jones, Harris, Harvey, and Peters running as the ones. Probably means the twos are Northrup, Seeley, Mills, and Knott maybe?

Not sure I agree with the 3 man front though. I think it takes Pierson and Taylor's greatest strengths away from them..... rushing the QB.