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Weakness of Fred?

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VAISUFAN

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Mar 13, 2012
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Before I get reamed by the board, let me begin with 2 caveats.

1. I think Fred is a great x's and o's coach.
2. The officiating did NOT lose the game for us last night...clearly shooting did.

However, one thing I have noticed over the past 4 years is that in big games we never get the benefit of close calls. They inevitably always seem to go against us. And unlike any college championship coach I have ever seen, Fred rarely works the officials. He is cool, calm, collected but rarely gets upset. And for a few games now I have seen this team's frustrations rising with no over-the-back calls, no calls on drives of ours, etc...

Finally I will lay down this marker and you guys can bring it back after 2 games. I see a competitiveness and frustration level with Kane, Ejim, and Hogue that if Fred doesn't begin to fight for this team with the officials, I predict some of these guys are going to go off and get technicals, and maybe even thrown out, in one of the next 2 games.
 
ISU4ME

ISU4ME

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Aug 26, 2007
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Did you see the game in person or on TV?

The reason I ask is if you saw the game in person and watched his interactions with the officials you would feel 180 degrees the opposite of what you posted. He was on them from the beginning both yelling and conversing during timeouts and dead balls situations.
 
bawbie

bawbie

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Fred yelled at the officials as much as I've ever seen last night.

At one point he was very close to a T.

Claiming that Fred isn't "fighting for his team" is a really really stupid thing to say.
 
D

dfwcy

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Oct 20, 2008
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Kansas was called for 9 more fouls than ISU. ISU shot 15 more free throws than Kansas.
 
brianhos

brianhos

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UGH, this is just all getting out of hand. If ISU had shot their normal percentage from outside the outcome would have been totally different. Just calm down, relax, and realize the team that beat ISU last night had the #1 and #2 draft choices, and only beat ISU by 7. Relax. Chill. Take a day off and rethink it.
 
fsanford

fsanford

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VAISUFAN said:
Before I get reamed by the board, let me begin with 2 caveats.

1. I think Fred is a great x's and o's coach.
2. The officiating did NOT lose the game for us last night...clearly shooting did.

However, one thing I have noticed over the past 4 years is that in big games we never get the benefit of close calls. They inevitably always seem to go against us. And unlike any college championship coach I have ever seen, Fred rarely works the officials. He is cool, calm, collected but rarely gets upset. And for a few games now I have seen this team's frustrations rising with no over-the-back calls, no calls on drives of ours, etc...

Finally I will lay down this marker and you guys can bring it back after 2 games. I see a competitiveness and frustration level with Kane, Ejim, and Hogue that if Fred doesn't begin to fight for this team with the officials, I predict some of these guys are going to go off and get technicals, and maybe even thrown out, in one of the next 2 games.
Click to expand...

ISU had a huge advantage in foul calls last night. With fouls at the end it seemed close but at one point in the 2nd half KU had like 14 fouls to our 5. If the kids still think they were not getting the calls, they need to go look at the tape and get some sense of reality.

I am of the opinion if you as a coach give the impression you are getting screwed on the calls it gives the kids the same excuse.

Personally I wish he would get in the players face a little bit more, and last night I think he did but that is not his normal approach. And lets be honest here, the results of his approach have been more than effective these past 4 years.
 
Last edited:
V

VAISUFAN

Active Member
Mar 13, 2012
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brianhos said:
UGH, this is just all getting out of hand. If ISU had shot their normal percentage from outside the outcome would have been totally different. Just calm down, relax, and realize the team that beat ISU last night had the #1 and #2 draft choices, and only beat ISU by 7. Relax. Chill. Take a day off and rethink it.
Click to expand...


This has nothing to do with the team winning last night. I agree. They shot above their average, we shot horrifically and only lost by 7. I actually think if we play a little better we can beat them in Kansas. But that does not change the fact that for 3 to 4 years, for me, we seem to never get the benefit of calls in big games. And while yes Fred says things to the refs, I don't equate that to how 90% of coaches work the refs. And do I think that is a disadvantage in big games...yes.
 
alarson

alarson

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dfwcy said:
Kansas was called for 9 more fouls than ISU. ISU shot 15 more free throws than Kansas.
Click to expand...

Regardless of the OP... you know that even fouls does not equal evenly called game, right?
 
BigBake

BigBake

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Mar 17, 2006
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Correct, he does not go "Mad Fran" or "Bobby Knight" but that's not how he operates and probably never will.
 
twistedredbird

twistedredbird

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Apr 26, 2008
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If anything needs to be addressed, Fred needs to get his players to stop worrying about the officiating, and play, and make sure they know it is his job to "work" the refs. Frankly, if anything, I am tired of seeing this team get beat on defense because they are too busy glaring at an official for a non call. This has been a pattern for a couple years now.
 
CtownCyclone

CtownCyclone

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Just because Fred's style does not match your preconcieved notion of the "right" way to "work" the officials doesn't mean it's not worth anything. You want him to act like Fran?
 
Clonefan32

Clonefan32

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Nov 19, 2008
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Explain to me at what point in the game would the team have benefited from giving Kansas two free throws and the ball?
 
V

VAISUFAN

Active Member
Mar 13, 2012
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Clonefan32 said:
Explain to me at what point in the game would the team have benefited from giving Kansas two free throws and the ball?
Click to expand...

Probably right before Ejim got fouled on his 3 pointer. But again, as I said we did not lose because of the officiating last night. But in this game, Ohio State, KU, KU, OKIe St, etc... we never seem to get the close calls in big close games. Coincidence? Maybe.
 
C

CYKOFAN

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Mar 27, 2006
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ISU4ME said:
Did you see the game in person or on TV?

The reason I ask is if you saw the game in person and watched his interactions with the officials you would feel 180 degrees the opposite of what you posted. He was on them from the beginning both yelling and conversing during timeouts and dead balls situations.
Click to expand...

I was there and yes he was.
 
CtownCyclone

CtownCyclone

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VAISUFAN said:
Probably right before Ejim got fouled on his 3 pointer. But again, as I said we did not lose because of the officiating last night. But in this game, Ohio State, KU, KU, OKIe St, etc... we never seem to get the close calls in big close games. Coincidence? Maybe.
Click to expand...

Wonder if we got any beneficial close calls during Michigan/Iowa/BYU?
 
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