At this point the more the show is different than the books the better. It will make reading them in 2020 and 2030 much more enjoyable.
Game of Thrones Season 5
- Thread starter Daserop
- Start date
At this point the more the show is different than the books the better. It will make reading them in 2020 and 2030 much more enjoyable.
Sounds interesting. It would depend on what Martin has planned for Sansa in the books, I presume. Since her story line in the show has deviated from the books, it is hard for anyone to know what will happen to her.
But, I will be honest in saying that I haven't missed Lady Stonehart. I don't see why everyone is up in arms that she isn’t in the show. All her story line is, is killing and revenge. While some people may like that, since she is getting revenge on those that wronged the Starks, I don't see it as really adding anything to the story.
- Mar 27, 2006
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Well, the Riverlands have basically been ignored in the series. GRRM goes into a lot fo detail on the area and the aftermath of the war. The land is just devastated. There's still plenty of violence and animosity. Jaime, Brienne, the Brotherhood without Banners, the Hound, Rorge, Biter, etc. are all roaming around. Lady Stoneheart is an interesting character because while Jaime is the redemption tale, she's kind of the opposite, starting as an incredibly sympathetic character, whose path has her become a force of evil. The Brotherhood, initially get the Robin Hood treatment, but become corrupted because of her. I agree that with the way the show has gone with other characters (Jaime, Brienne, the minimalization of the Black Fish, Freys etc.) that it would be hard to have a Lady Stoneheart character, simply because there wouldn't be much for her to do. But, she's definitely an important character in the books, one that appears to have a large part to play going forward, given where the books leave off.
4 supposed still shots from Episode 10 have leaked for those that are into that kind of thing. Major spoilers for non-book readers and one major spoiler for book readers (though long-rumored).
Gonna be a great episode!
Gonna be a great episode!
As a book reader it isn't too stunning, but if you don't know what is coming I wouldn't click.
I'll just leave this here and let you fight that internal battle.
http://winteriscoming.net/2015/06/12/possible-game-of-thrones-season-finale-spoilers-leaked/
I'll give you credit with a truly interesting idea, State43, but for me it falls short for a few reasons. Lady Stoneheart's resurrection differs from Beric Dondarrion's (seven, I believe?) resurrections. Thoros of Myr was able to was able to resurrect Beric Dondarrion rather quickly each time, thereby preserving both Beric's body and spirit, although it is mentioned that Thoros is having a more difficult time resurrecting him as his body is continually getting worse and he's leaving more of his spirit behind each time (in fact, when Melisandre meets Thoros and Beric in the TV series, she's stunned that Beric has been resurrected that many times, stating that it's impossible). Compare that to Catelyn Stark, whose throat was slit and was left to rot floating naked down the Trident River for three days until Beric Dondarrion, of all people, finds her and resurrects her (at great expense to him - it kills him for good in the process). Physically she's in terrible shape - she has no color left in her skin, half of her hair has fallen out and what hair does remain is white and brittle, because her throat was slit so deeply her vocal chords were severely damaged, and what speaking she does comes out as barely intelligible grunts. Spiritually, she's even worse. People say that she is the way she is because she's lost everything - to her knowledge her entire family is dead (when in reality it's just Eddard and Robb and some of her family on the Tully side), she and her family has been betrayed left and right - first by her own sister Lysa, who wouldn't let the Vale join the North and Riverlands in their war against the Lannisters, then Theon Greyjoy which led to the sacking of her home at Winterfell, then the Karstarks whom up and left, then ultimately betrayed by the Freys and Boltons, who mass-murdered the North army, and her and Robb (and in the TV show, her son's wife and first and only grandchild) in the process. I agree - any and all of that would make anybody bitter, but I think it goes even deeper than that. Remember how every time Beric was resurrected a bit of his soul was left behind? Catelyn was dead for 3 days before she was resurrected - I'd say much of her soul, perhaps the best part of it, was left behind, and all that was returned in the resurrection was the bit that knows nothing but misery and wants nothing more than revenge, even if it ultimately means her death. For all intents and purposes, the resurrected Catelyn Stark, aka Lady Stoneheart, is nothing more than a zombie, or, to keep it within the theme of the show, she is nothing more than an Other.
Now, let's bring Sansa into this. It is certainly possible for them to slit her throat and have her be dead for 3 days, although her floating down the river is not going to happen as first I don't think there are any major rivers like the Trident around Winterfell, and second all the smaller waterways would be frozen over in the North by now. In fact, it's so cold in the North right now that I don't think you'd get the physical decay out of Sansa that you got out of Catelyn. But the more I mull over your theory, the more I see merit to it. She doesn't necessarily need the total physical decay. And I don't think it'd be Stannis that murdered her, but Ramsay as a final insult to her, something along the lines of him killing her before the North can come rescue her.
Ultimately I don't think it happens because with Sansa dead, there's nobody out there to point out what kind of a guy Petyr Baelish really is (unless this becomes a part of her post-resurrection revenge parade). At the end of this, one way or the other, I really think Sansa loses all respect for Littlefinger and turns on him.
Personally, in spite of Jaime's redemption, I still hope Lady Stoneheart gets him and gives him a brutal death. After all, he did try and murder Bran when he caught him banging his sister and he didn't deliver neither Sansa nor Arya to safety (not that he ever had a chance, as Sansa was now "family" and Arya had long since disappeared from King's Landing), and while I've gained a lot of respect for him, especially in the skill of diplomacy that he's seemed to have developed, I'd still like to see him go. Yeah, I get it - how un-Christian of me. Unfortunately for Jaime, Christianity doesn't exist in Westeros...
Couldn't resist, so I clicked on it. I've never been afraid of spoilers, as it's reading the articles on Wikipedia and reading the ASoIaF Wiki that got me watching the show and reading the books in the first place. First one (after POTENTIAL SPOILERS BELOW heading) I absolutely knew was coming based on events from episode 5.9. Second one makes sense, also based on events from episode 5.9 (me further commenting on it would spoil). Third/Fourth isn't a big surprise to me either, and, based on the show overall, it wouldn't surprise me how it goes down.
Yeah I purposely didn't link so that you'd have to really want to see the spoilers to find them. Looks like someone else helped out though!
As you said, not a big spoiler if you've read the books and are up to date on the theories. Huge spoilers if you haven't though.
- Mar 27, 2006
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You might be surprised
you totally won't be surprised.
totally not
nothing actually in this one. Just seeing how far I can drill down
Agree completely - the "LS" storyline is like half of two chapters, and in my opinion it was one of, if not the biggest mistakes Martin made in the series. Cheapened the impact of her death, and it has gone nowhere so far. I am not a big fan of resurrections.
- Mar 27, 2006
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completely disagree. Nearly all of GRRM's POV characters go through a metamorphosis. Jaime from heel to hero. Arya from wild/raw emotion to cold/emotionless assassin, Deaneyrs from scared girl to confident queen, etc. Catelyn Stark is no different. Her love for her family, worry, and desire to protect them caused her heartache after heartache and misstep after misstep in the early books. Her metamorphosis into Lady Stoneheart, at first, is viewed as a good thing. After the Red Wedding, the reader is ready for revenge, and her appearance indicates that it is about to be served. But in a Feast for Crows, we see how much she's changed to the point of corruption and pure vengeance. She goes from being one of the more sympathetic characters to basically a villain. It's a fascinating character arc.
We see half a chapter of her in AFFC. She barely does or says anything.... its an interesting development, but not sure I'd call it a character arc. I am quite interested to see what happens in the next chapter, as it could be a very impressive job by Martin of changing who the reader will cheer for in the speculated confrontation. But on the whole, not a big fan of resurrections. I definitely expected them to leave that out of the show like they did.
Fair argument. Just trying to guess what they may do with Sansa since her storyline doesn't seem to have a purpose. The show creators said they only want to make at the most 3 more seasons. Doesn't seem like some storylines can be summed up without some major deviations.
There is a growing fan theory that LSH will actually make an appearance in the season finale this year, and be back for next season. The title of the episode is Mother's Mercy, causing you to think of Cersei confessing.
But GRRM referred to LSH as Mother Mercy, and apparently there is an IMDB entry for a "Hooded Woman" that appears in episode 10.
But GRRM referred to LSH as Mother Mercy, and apparently there is an IMDB entry for a "Hooded Woman" that appears in episode 10.
Rumors based on advanced IMDB entries have been wrong more often than not as it pertains to GoT. I would be shocked if LSH is in the finale if for no other reason there's no one even remotely close to where she should be showing up.
I think the rumors of some Iron Islanders showing up is far more likely given that we know they are casting for some of those parts for S6.
