***Fresno State (2/9) and @ UNI (2/10) Duals***

[VirginSturgeon]

I do not disagree with some being perplexed at the situation of 165. All he had to is win a wrestle against a kid who he had majored. It is on him for not beating St. John, I personally like the philosophy that you have wrestle offs. Good for competition. Maybe they have another wrestle off this week, who knows?

 

[buf87]

I think we started this conversation thinking that the 8-0 major decision was the wrestle off.
I think we then thought they had 1 wrestle off and threw out the finals of Edmonds Open.
Then we find out it was a 2 out of 3 with Jennings getting the 1st win via the Edmonds Open.

It make it tough to get an accurate opinion when we don't have all the facts.

 

[SimpsonCyclone]

People better start getting used to wrestle offs...

For the record, I would rather have Jennings out there at 165. But I also think that he should beat St John in wrestle offs..as we continue to build talent and especially depth..this won't be the last time we have wrestle offs.

If the roles were reversed, we would have people freaking out if Jennings was getting the spot over St John?

 

[Bam bam]

I do not disagree with some being perplexed at the situation of 165. All he had to is win a wrestle against a kid who he had majored. It is on him for not beating St. John, I personally like the philosophy that you have wrestle offs. Good for competition. Maybe they have another wrestle off this week, who knows?

Agreed, all he had to do was win one match.

 

[csteve]

It's been mentioned before...wrestle-offs don't necessarily tell you who will be more successful in competition. When teammates wrestle each other daily, they get to know each other's offense and defense inside and out. I think the wrestle-offs mean less than their body of work outside the room. As Judoka pointed out, Jennings has obviously had the better results this season and seems to offer our team a better chance at success. I thought this is why Dresser mentioned early in the year that the open tournaments would be used to decide positions (which I think is the best approach). That said, if they are so close in the room, maybe other things factor into the equation. As Dresser pointed out in his interview, St. John's approach to practice is what he wants to see from all his wrestlers. If this is the case and he works harder and approaches practices and the lifestyle better than Jennings, maybe this is one of the other reasons St. John is offered more chances to earn the spot?

 

[Bam bam]

People better start getting used to wrestle offs...

For the record, I would rather have Jennings out there at 165. But I also think that he should beat St John in wrestle offs..as we continue to build talent and especially depth..this won't be the last time we have wrestle offs.

If the roles were reversed, we would have people freaking out if Jennings was getting the spot over St John?

I think so, but since you bring it up, one does have to question if the last name is a factor. Favoritism happens. I think wrestle offs are great and a way to keep things fair. In fact, I think they should have had more of them earlier in the season.

 

[Bam bam]

I think we started this conversation thinking that the 8-0 major decision was the wrestle off.
I think we then thought they had 1 wrestle off and threw out the finals of Edmonds Open.
Then we find out it was a 2 out of 3 with Jennings getting the 1st win via the Edmonds Open.

It make it tough to get an accurate opinion when we don't have all the facts.

The last and final scenario is what happened--2 out of 3 with the Edmonds open counting in Brady's favor.

 

[buf87]

Without knowing details, I think mentioning favoritism is a sketchy road to discuss. I would rather stick to the facts and have differences in opinions, than thinking the coaches are playing favorites

 

[buf87]

The last and final scenario is what happened--2 out of 3 with the Edmonds open counting in Brady's favor.

I agree, but the other 2 were discussed prior to knowing 3 was the fact.

So Breitenbach beat DiBlasi at Edmonds Open 5-4. Was that part of the wrestle off? Then did Breitenbach lose to St John last week? Then did St John win the 2 matches against Jennings?

or was the wrestle off just between St John and Jennings?

 

[Bam bam]

It's been mentioned before...wrestle-offs don't necessarily tell you who will be more successful in competition. When teammates wrestle each other daily, they get to know each other's offense and defense inside and out. I think the wrestle-offs mean less than their body of work outside the room. As Judoka pointed out, Jennings has obviously had the better results this season and seems to offer our team a better chance at success. I thought this is why Dresser mentioned early in the year that the open tournaments would be used to decide positions (which I think is the best approach). That said, if they are so close in the room, maybe other things factor into the equation. As Dresser pointed out in his interview, St. John's approach to practice is what he wants to see from all his wrestlers. If this is the case and he works harder and approaches practices and the lifestyle better than Jennings, maybe this is one of the other reasons St. John is offered more chances to earn the spot?

Excellent point, the fact that Dresser mentioned early in the season that the opens would determine the spot is definitely part of the confusion. He's the coach though and gets to change his mind or his policies at any time. I have concluded that there must be more that we aren't seeing--like work ethic in the room. I do know that part of the culture Dresser has been trying to change is that hard work gets rewarded, because he talks about it so often. If the reward is continued chances at the spot, then I support that.

 

[Judoka]

Did Breitenbach also get a wrestle off?

 

[Bam bam]

I agree, but the other 2 were discussed prior to knowing 3 was the fact.

So Breitenbach beat DiBlasi at Edmonds Open 5-4. Was that part of the wrestle off? Then did Breitenbach lose to St John last week? Then did St John win the 2 matches against Jennings?

or was the wrestle off just between St John and Jennings?

Just Jennings and St. John. I believe Logan has a skin infection or was sick or something, but the wrestle off between Jennings and St.John was slated before that. Breitenbach was not part of the mix, which is something else I found strange. If a wrestle off was going to happen, I would have predicted it would be between Logan and Brady because both of them had one dual win. I am inclined to think it is nepotism or work ethic in the room/attitude etc. or both.

 

[Bam bam]

Did Breitenbach also get a wrestle off?

No wrestle off involving Logan.

 

[Bam bam]

Without knowing details, I think mentioning favoritism is a sketchy road to discuss. I would rather stick to the facts and have differences in opinions, than thinking the coaches are playing favorites

Fair enough and the facts speak for themselves.

 

[Bam bam]

Fair enough and the facts speak for themselves.

I do have to say though, that if I am a kid in the room and one of the kids vying for the 165 spot I would be wondering. I can guarantee you they are talking about it and that kind of thing can be very damaging to morale. Neither of these kids is tearing up the mat or dazzling us with talent and performance, let's face it. I hope all three guys that are vying for that spot finish of the season strong whether that is in the room or in competition. We all want success for the team and this staff.

 

[jkbuff98]

DId Swalla and Bush also have a wrestle off last week ?

 

[ca4cy]

People better start getting used to wrestle offs...

For the record, I would rather have Jennings out there at 165. But I also think that he should beat St John in wrestle offs..as we continue to build talent and especially depth..this won't be the last time we have wrestle offs.

If the roles were reversed, we would have people freaking out if Jennings was getting the spot over St John?

Two things on the bolded...

1. Freaking out is too strong. I see pretty rational discussion about a controversial topic and I'll take that. At least ISU wrestling is intriguing and fun to follow again.

2. I can't speak for anyone else, but I'd be questioning it all the same if the roles were reversed. I don't care about last names. I want the best kid on the mat when the lights are on. Maybe the coaches think St. John was close to a break through, but the rough thing for him is that his last name, coupled with his results lead to questioning of this decision as to what part nepotism plays in it. As csteve states a few posts up, it's hard, especially at this point in the season, to put a ton of stock in a wrestle off when guys have so much familiarity with each other's styles.

 

[buf87]

I do have to say though, that if I am a kid in the room and one of the kids vying for the 165 spot I would be wondering. I can guarantee you they are talking about it and that kind of thing can be very damaging to morale. Neither of these kids is tearing up the mat or dazzling us with talent and performance, let's face it. I hope all three guys that are vying for that spot finish of the season strong whether that is in the room or in competition. We all want success for the team and this staff.

I understand. Especially tough on the kid and family. It is hard to examine the whole body of work and decide. The "body of work" might be different for the coaches, each wrestler and family. Especially in this situation where none have lit the world on fire.

It kind of goes back to the saying, "Don't let the ref be able to decide outcome"

I feel bad that Jennings hasn't got more time to prove himself at 165. Iowa against "The Bull" is probably not going to tell us much.

I hope Jennings commits to 165 and works hard. He is young and could prove to be a pretty good 165 pounder yet, whether it is yet this year or next.

The plus side is, none of us were talking about Jennings to be a starter until recently. Cudos to him, because he must be making strides to now being a potential starter.

 

[Judoka]

DId Swalla and Bush also have a wrestle off last week ?

I believe Dresser said they were going to. But in that case their records are pretty similar and neither of them has really grabbed ahold of the weight (Simmons and Parker were like that at 133 too until Storr took care of that problem). Bush has a slight edge in results but not a drastic one.


Does Dante get a wrestle off against Degen any time he wants one?

 

[SimpsonCyclone]

I believe Dresser said they were going to. But in that case their records are pretty similar and neither of them has really grabbed ahold of the weight (Simmons and Parker were like that at 133 too until Storr took care of that problem). Bush has a slight edge in results but not a drastic one.


Does Dante get a wrestle off against Degen any time he wants one?

I'm sure Degen would welcome that, since he isn't a complainer and just competes. He would also take care of business. If he is the best at the weight, he would prove it in practice and in wrestle offs - like he has done all year. Degen has been the man all year at 149 for good reason. HE PROVES IT.

And to insinuate that St John gets to wrestle off against Jennings any time he wants is ridiculous. It's not like Jennings has been the starter all year..that weight class has been a revolving door all year. Get it done in practice and during the wrestle offs, end of story.