2018 Taxes

jdcyclone19

Well-Known Member
Apr 14, 2017
3,496
4,810
113
Iowa
Budget is done. Once they get the final # someone will go in and adjust some driver they sandbagged on to get it to where they need to be.

I can tell you right now that on the academic side, it is not done as central administration is making some changes.
 

CycloneDaddy

Well-Known Member
Sep 24, 2006
7,257
6,084
113
Johnston
I can tell you right now that on the academic side, it is not done as central administration is making some changes.
So Im interested in this as I only know budgets on the private sector side. When I was in charge of a $120 million budget 80% was people expense, 10% was facilities and the rest made up the last 10%.

So I knew Corporate was always going to ask for a trim so I juiced FTE #s and bonus %. Corporate would always come back asking for savings so I adjusted FTE #s down and maybe bonus to get to my #.

On the academic side my asumption is that until they know the final budget # it is hard for them to input a FTE #?
 

capitalcityguy

Well-Known Member
Jun 14, 2007
8,332
2,124
113
Des Moines
Defrauding the IRS and being aggressive with the tax code are 2 different things. If you're audited there may be an adjustment for past tax due, but you shouldn't NOT do something out of fear of an audit unless it is illegal or fraud.

Of course. My point was that if you're going to take a deduction that historically creates a higher likelihood for audit, be sure you understand it and are using it correctly.

The landscape is littered with examples of taxpayers unknowingly causing themselves all kinds of headache$ due to some level of ignorance with the IRS tax Code.
 
  • Agree
Reactions: SpokaneCY

capitalcityguy

Well-Known Member
Jun 14, 2007
8,332
2,124
113
Des Moines
Apologies if this has already been posted. It is a nice summary of how many benefited, were hurt, or the Tax Cuts were neutral to their situation.

2018 Tax Cuts:

65% benefited
6% paid more
29% neutral/no significant difference.


From NY Times/Tax Policy Center:
. https://www.nytimes.com/2019/04/14/business/economy/income-tax-cut.html

It has been painful more than once witnessing people I like and generally respect (but differ politically) complaining on Facebook that they received less of a refund this year. Because these are FB friends, I've tried to gently point out that refund amount tells them nothing and instead they need to compare their Effective Tax Rate from 2017 vs 2018 to see if they actually paid more or less in taxes. I have yet to have one respond back with this number...some have actually doubled-down....at which point I just walk away so my wife doesn't hammer me about "being political" on FB. ;)
 
Last edited:

CascadeClone

Well-Known Member
Oct 24, 2009
9,162
11,094
113
I've tried to gently point out that refund amount tells them nothing and instead they need to compare their Effective Tax Rate from 2017 vs 2018 to see if they actually paid more or less in taxes. .

I'd guess 80% of people don't get this at all, since they don't see the withholding as "tax" exactly. Just see the payment/refund as the tax, which is of course horribly wrong. Gee Barbie, math is hard!

Someone once said, without withholding, if you had to pay the whole tax bill at once, we'd have another revolution in about 6 hours after April 15th...
 

capitalcityguy

Well-Known Member
Jun 14, 2007
8,332
2,124
113
Des Moines
I'd guess 80% of people don't get this at all, since they don't see the withholding as "tax" exactly. Just see the payment/refund as the tax, which is of course horribly wrong. Gee Barbie, math is hard!

Someone once said, without withholding, if you had to pay the whole tax bill at once, we'd have another revolution in about 6 hours after April 15th...

I guess I wouldn't care so much if I didn't see politicians feed off this ignorance and try to use it to their advantage. Both sides do it. They thrive on the average American not understanding this stuff and thus spin their narrative in an attempt to help themselves.
 

khardbored

Well-Known Member
Oct 20, 2012
9,793
7,107
113
Middle of the Midwest
This first year was essentially a wash for the middle class. It was good, if not great, for the wealthy and for corporations. It was also very good for anyone who won't ever have to think about dealing with the national debt.

Isn't this a bit premature? Would not we need to wait until all 2018 collections are done to determine how it's impacting all the money Feds take in? That figure likely won't be available for a long time.

What I'm saying is tax rate =/= tax money taken in.
 

IcSyU

Well-Known Member
Nov 27, 2007
27,767
5,963
113
Rochester, MN
Apologies if this has already been posted. It is a nice summary of how many benefited, were hurt, or the Tax Cuts were neutral to their situation.

2018 Tax Cuts:

65% benefited
6% paid more
29% neutral/no significant difference.


From NY Times/Tax Policy Center:
. https://www.nytimes.com/2019/04/14/business/economy/income-tax-cut.html

It has been painful more than once witnessing people I like and generally respect (but differ politically) complaining on Facebook that they received less of a refund this year. Because these are FB friends, I've tried to gently point out that refund amount tells them nothing and instead they need to compare their Effective Tax Rate from 2017 vs 2018 to see if they actually paid more or less in taxes. I have yet to have one respond back with this number...some have actually doubled-down....at which point I just walk away so my wife doesn't hammer me about "betting political" on FB. ;)
This only works if income is fairly constant. If your income fell 25% your effective rate damn well better have fell. Similarly, you could've had a 25% increase and paid a higher effective rate but still been helped by the tax law.

Bottom line: Most people don't understand taxes well enough to make heads or tails of it.
 

capitalcityguy

Well-Known Member
Jun 14, 2007
8,332
2,124
113
Des Moines
This only works if income is fairly constant. If your income fell 25% your effective rate damn well better have fell. Similarly, you could've had a 25% increase and paid a higher effective rate but still been helped by the tax law.

Bottom line: Most people don't understand taxes well enough to make heads or tails of it.

Good point, but I imagine most taxpayers have a fairly consistent income year over year.
Personally, we had a big income change (decrease, actually) as we sold some stocks to pay off our mortgage in 2017. Because of this, we don't have a "normal" (for us) taxable income figure from 2017 to use as starting point for comparison purposes with 2018 so I actually am not sure if we were neutral, hurt, or helped. I'm sure I could figure it out...if I wanted to take the time.
 

ArgentCy

Well-Known Member
Jan 13, 2010
20,387
11,176
113
It was really a small change / decrease but it has some larger structurally changes that were very good, IMO.
 
  • Like
  • Agree
Reactions: flycy and bos

capitalcityguy

Well-Known Member
Jun 14, 2007
8,332
2,124
113
Des Moines
Also goes to show that they don't understand their own taxes but the media told the it was only for the rich. Only 12% believe they were lowered as compared to the actual ~65%.

https://www.cbsnews.com/news/poll-reveals-most-americans-dont-know-they-got-a-tax-cut/

That is what is so insidious about the Tax Code. The average American doesn't understand it even though we are all subject to it. Both sides use this to their advantage so neither party is pure on this one.
 

IcSyU

Well-Known Member
Nov 27, 2007
27,767
5,963
113
Rochester, MN
That is what is so insidious about the Tax Code. The average American doesn't understand it even though we are all subject to it. Both sides use this to their advantage so neither party is pure on this one.
In fairness the average American doesn't understand how to do an oil change either but we almost all have cars.
 

isufbcurt

Well-Known Member
Apr 21, 2006
25,729
39,376
113
45
Newton
That is what is so insidious about the Tax Code. The average American doesn't understand it even though we are all subject to it. Both sides use this to their advantage so neither party is pure on this one.

If the average American has a W2 job, a house and kid(s) the tax code is really pretty simple.

Yes it gets more complex as your income situation gets more complex, but that is how things go.

For example I can do repairs & maintenance racecar but there is no way I can do the same R&M on my Ford Explorer. Why? Because the Ford Explorer is more complicated (computers, A/C, cat converters, O2 sensors, etc.)
 
  • Agree
Reactions: wxman1

Trice

Well-Known Member
Apr 1, 2010
6,898
11,255
113
Also goes to show that they don't understand their own taxes but the media told the it was only for the rich. Only 12% believe they were lowered as compared to the actual ~65%.

https://www.cbsnews.com/news/poll-reveals-most-americans-dont-know-they-got-a-tax-cut/

Nobody reported it was only for the rich. They reported that it disproportionately favored the rich. Which it does.

And as for the 65% who got tax cuts, let's just say there was a reason Paul Ryan was laughed out of the room after that beauty of a tweet he posted in the weeks after the cut passed.
 

capitalcityguy

Well-Known Member
Jun 14, 2007
8,332
2,124
113
Des Moines
In fairness the average American doesn't understand how to do an oil change either but we almost all have cars.

We all own smart phones too, but we can't repair them. I'm not sure I get your point.

Don't you believe given how much of our lives are spent earning wages and how critical they are to our ability to successfully function in society, that ideally the amount we are forced to turn over to the gov't should be straightforward enough that the average American can understand?

Be design in order for them to function, cars (and phones) are complicated.

To make your "fairness point" work , please successfully make the link to why taxes by design must also complicated in order to work. That just doesn't make sense to me.
 
  • Winner
Reactions: flycy

stateofmind

Well-Known Member
Jul 16, 2007
6,488
3,955
113
Ankeny

stateofmind

Well-Known Member
Jul 16, 2007
6,488
3,955
113
Ankeny
Nobody reported it was only for the rich. They reported that it disproportionately favored the rich. Which it does.

And as for the 65% who got tax cuts, let's just say there was a reason Paul Ryan was laughed out of the room after that beauty of a tweet he posted in the weeks after the cut passed.
Was he tweeting on screen in front of a room?