Cryptocurrency

[Cyclone.TV]

How about the spinoff Bitcoin Cash. How are the fees with that spin off. I know that was a main reason for the spin off.

They are lower and transactions are faster. The fork was trying to accomplish such things, and increasing block sizes was how it was supposed to do that. It doesn't have the bulk that Bitcoin does so its tough to say if it will continue that way if it gets as big, but that was the idea.

 

[deadeyededric]

Sure it can, Bitcoin started with very low fees. Now they have gotten out of hand.

That's why I trade ethereum.

 

[deadeyededric]

Total market cap is at 524 billion right now. At noon it was 488 billion.

 

[BCClone]

I just saw I have over 500k in CF cash. Wonder if I can cash that in?

 

[SoapyCy]

I just saw I have over 500k in CF cash. Wonder if I can cash that in?

I'l wait and hold. there are kids in south korea mining more as we speak.

 

[deadeyededric]

Over the last week or so, bitcoin people have been bent over and rode hard by the looks of it. Saw it was around 15-16k for bitcoin on the CME a week or so ago and today it was just over 10k.

It will be back to 15k very soon.

 

[deadeyededric]

It's that option. Very, very, very few retailers/websites accept crypto as payment for stuff. Right now, it's basically people converting USD into BTC, waiting a while/mining more, and selling it back to others for USD.

You would think after explaining this at least one post per page that people would quit asking "what can you actually do with this stuff" or "is it really worth anything.".

 

[Playboi Carti]

Lol my mom text me saying Bitcoin is a scam “they were talking about the price on the news”

 

[TykeClone]

There is a difference between bank transaction fees and the bitcoin network fee ( it would cost me $19 to move $77 worth of bitcoin), other coins doesn't have nearly as high transaction fee.

Because there is not the volume of transactions in them that bitcoin has.

My understanding is that the bitcoin (and other?) block chain ledgers are inherently inefficient and because of their design there is a cap on the number of transactions that can be processed worldwide per second. That scarcity of processing transactions is what is leading to the high cost of transactions.

 

[Cyclone.TV]

Because there is not the volume of transactions in them that bitcoin has.

My understanding is that the bitcoin (and other?) block chain ledgers are inherently inefficient and because of their design there is a cap on the number of transactions that can be processed worldwide per second. That scarcity of processing transactions is what is leading to the high cost of transactions.

I'm not sure what would be efficient with that many transactions happening at one time, though. Companies like Visa have been updating their software for years and years to help with volume.

 

[TykeClone]

I'm not sure what would be efficient with that many transactions happening at one time, though. Companies like Visa have been updating their software for years and years to help with volume.

Isn't bitcoin supposed to be scalable? The inability to clear transactions quickly for a reasonable cost seems to be a major issue...

 

[aeroclone]

There is a difference between bank transaction fees and the bitcoin network fee ( it would cost me $19 to move $77 worth of bitcoin), other coins doesn't have nearly as high transaction fee.

But why as a user do I care? A fee to use my money is a fee to use my money. I really don't care what you choose to call it or what it actually pays for. $19 to move $77 is a huge fee compared to most financial instruments.

 

[Clonefan94]

You would think after explaining this at least one post per page that people would quit asking "what can you actually do with this stuff" or "is it really worth anything.".

I’ve read through a lot of this thread, I guess I missed the part on how you could actually use this as a currency right now with the value going up and down as much as it does on a minute to minute basis. Sorry.

 

[packattack425]

Sank some money into Aion. They are pretty much leading the way on 3rd generation block chain basically letting all blockchains communicate.

 

[deadeyededric]

Sank some money into Aion. They are pretty much leading the way on 3rd generation block chain basically letting all blockchains communicate.

I bought 100 AION recently also. I have heard a lot of good things about them and ICON. Some people think that ICON may turn into the Ethereum of South Korea. I don't believe that it is trading on any exchanges over there yet. I bought like 20 on Binance last week.

 

[Cyclone.TV]

Isn't bitcoin supposed to be scalable? The inability to clear transactions quickly for a reasonable cost seems to be a major issue...

They have work to do on the technology for sure. It’s an 8 year old technology that needs updated. We’ll see what happens.

 

[TykeClone]

They have work to do on the technology for sure. It’s an 8 year old technology that needs updated. We’ll see what happens.

The transaction logjam is baked into bitcoin

https://99bitcoins.com/unconfirmed-bitcoin-transaction-shorten-time/

Here’s the way Bitcoin works: a limited number of transactions can be confirmed in each block. As you probably know, miners produce a new block every 10 minutes or so, and transaction fees are the “bribes” that convince miners to include transactions in their new blocks. An included transaction is known as a confirmation. When the price is really volatile, many people frequently try to send transactions at the same time. So competition for this limited block space drives up fees. The higher the fee attached to a transaction, the greater the chance that it’ll be confirmed in the next block.

Each Bitcoin block can accommodate about 2,500 regular transactions, but around 8,000 SegWit transactions. Since they’re smaller, SegWit transactions have much lower fees.

So basically the entire bitcoin network is limited to clearing either 2500 or 8000 transactions, worldwide, every 10 minutes. By design. That's not a function of technology being thrown at the network. The computing power being thrown at processing bitcoin is astounding (https://motherboard.vice.com/en_us/...ty-consumption-ethereum-energy-climate-change

http://www.newsweek.com/bitcoin-mining-track-consume-worlds-energy-2020-744036)

The VISA network can clear 24,000 transactions each second. Efficiently. On legacy batch systems.

 

[Cyclone.TV]

The transaction logjam is baked into bitcoin

https://99bitcoins.com/unconfirmed-bitcoin-transaction-shorten-time/





So basically the entire bitcoin network is limited to clearing either 2500 or 8000 transactions, worldwide, every 10 minutes. By design. That's not a function of technology being thrown at the network. The computing power being thrown at processing bitcoin is astounding (https://motherboard.vice.com/en_us/...ty-consumption-ethereum-energy-climate-change

http://www.newsweek.com/bitcoin-mining-track-consume-worlds-energy-2020-744036)

The VISA network can clear 24,000 transactions each second. Efficiently. On legacy batch systems.

Visa has serious issues as well, not to mention the fees charged to businesses. But that’s a different conversation.

Bitcoin efficiency is definitely an issue. They need speed to go up and fees to drop - which bitcash was trying to do with the fork. So it will be interesting to see how it changes - if it does at all.

 

[TykeClone]

Visa has serious issues as well, not to mention the fees charged to businesses. But that’s a different conversation.

Bitcoin efficiency is definitely an issue. They need speed to go up and fees to drop - which bitcash was trying to do with the fork. So it will be interesting to see how it changes - if it does at all.

Visa fees average something around 2% for a credit card transaction and < $1/debit card transaction. They are routed and cleared 24,000 times/second.

As far as bitcoin cash...

https://www.investopedia.com/tech/bitcoin-vs-bitcoin-cash-whats-difference/

Improving cryptocurrency as a transaction medium will depend on maintaining the high level of security that Bitcoin has always ensured, while also improving transaction speeds. Bitcoin will continue to be highly secure, but how much its transaction speeds will improve is unclear. Bitcoin Cash, once its difficulty has adjusted, could have transactions processing in two minutes and 30 seconds. The security of the Bitcoin Cash blockchain, though, is unclear.

Yep. That will compete.

 

[Cyclone.TV]

Visa fees average something around 2% for a credit card transaction and < $1/debit card transaction. They are routed and cleared 24,000 times/second.

As far as bitcoin cash...

https://www.investopedia.com/tech/bitcoin-vs-bitcoin-cash-whats-difference/



Yep. That will compete.

Not sure when I said they would compete - I was saying that visa has changed multiple times over a long period of time. Bitcoin needs to change. Visa charges around 2% but there are multiple fees from the companies who do the interchanges as well. It’s going through about 3 different companies per transaction, then to the bank. Bitcoin will have to change to improve speed and fees, but there are definitely advantages to a peer to peer network.