Is it time to move on from Manning??

[andybernard]

Overall I didn't think the play calling was too terrible, but there were 3 plays that I hated...
1. Not running a qb sneak for a td.
2. Wasting a 1st and goal with a wildcat play that everyone knew was going nowhere.
3. Running a qb sneak out of the endzone. I understand that many teams do it, but I think it is such a waste of a play. Any play you can run from the 2, you can run from the 1.

 

[NickTheGreat]

I thought the o-line was good. We ran the ball pretty well and Iowa had to blitz a lot to get pressure. That's one of the best front sevens we'll face all year and they held up well. Much better than last year.

I didn't think the pass protection was great. We started running the ball well, I'll admit that

 

[twincyties]

Red zone play calls were terrible. Game should have been 20-7 at worst. We were moving the ball well on the ground and Dekkers is really effective throwing slants and short patterns over the middle.

 

[ZuriCyclone]

Manning cannot recruit or develop a great offensive team. Which is going to keep this team from taking the next step.

Overwhelming majority of loses the last 5 years has been because of the offense screwing it up in crucial situations. The record stats and W results don't match up.

But the issue is which great offensive mind is going to come to ISU to be paid less then a Mil to be an OC.

Our hope is manning gets better with experience.

 

[Acylum]

Red zone/ goal line offense has got to be more inventive.

 

[stewart092284]

Turnovers against Iowa were from the offense. (Manning)
ISU will NEVER compete in September with TM as OC.
Spring/summer camp reps. Playcalling. QB development. Timeclock management. Pregame scouting. OL performance. All on Manning.
Mac and Chiz both used a buddy system for their coordinators and they both had problems. Look at the offensive talent that was under utilized this year- 2020 all big12 talent at almost every position.

Okay so this one is one insane post....

Did Manning tell Purdy and the receivers and Brock to turn the ball over last year? No. Did he tell Dekkers and Noel to not be not he same page? Or for Dekkers to force the ball into double coverage? Probably not.

Currently we are 2-0, 1-0 on the road in September with Tom Manning. We scored 42 points in September with Tom Manning and had a 99 yard drive and 300+ yards of offense and other than turnovers actually looked fairly competent under Tom Manning. We lead the Big 12 in passing offense last year. None of the turnovers are on Manning because the run was there, it was a fluke. Dekkers / Noel mix up isn't on the coach its on the players. If he had run a double reverse throw back to a eligible Tyler Miller and it was fumbled - THAT'D be on him.

Do I hate some of the play calls? Yes. Do I wish we played with tempo more and took more down field shots and were a tad more diverse in reacting to pressure and what the defense is doing? Yep. Sure do. The one area we were brutal at was 3rd down conversions last year and thus far this year

But for the love of puppy poop - can anyone tell me where exactly the offense has failed so drastically?
2021 Big 12 offensive stats
Pass offense - 1st
Scoring offense - 4th
Total Offense - 4th
Rushing offense - 7th (Disappointing but with 4 guards and a center... 160 yards a game ain't bad)

2020 Offense
Total Offense - 3rd
Scoring Offense - 3rd
Rushing Offense - 3rd
Passing Offense - 6th

2019 Offense
Total Offense - 5th
Scoring Offense - 5th
Rushing Offense - 9th
Passing Offense - 2nd

Yes, we're 8th right now in offense THIS year and 10th in scoring but some of the numbers are incredibly inflated this early on. And again - new QB, new running back, two new offensive tackles and essentially Remsburg will be new as he's been out so long with injuries and while Kansas looks good and played at West Virginia - I'm not sure anyone has faced a defense as good as Iowa's.


If anything we're a average to slightly below average running team would be the big criticism. But other than that - I fail to see where exactly Iowa State is supposed to finish in offense. We don't have at the moment the dudes that Oklahoma, Texas and what not can recruit.

We've finished 5th, 4th and 3rd in total offense and scoring offense the last 3 years. What more is he supposed to do realistically? Again - I have been critical of him for not adjusting quicker, for not being more diverse in getting people the ball - but his resume is pretty dang good when you actually look

 

[WhoISthis]

It’s been time.

Putting up points and yards against overwhelmed or teams that quit (like TCU last year) can result in okay averages, but it’s rare Manning gives us an advantage in contested games. It’s not often he creates value.

If anything, far too many games are close contests or losses because he’s wasted some of the best skill position players ever at ISU, while also making his OL worse. He’s also responsible for not yet developing OL’s with the talent of even Rhoads era

He has very little feel for setting things up. He’s the type that needs the opponent to be so outmatched (or bad) that we are able to just overwhelm with even banal ****

 

[Dopey]

The play calling was ok.

A few things for me:

Stanley needs to definitely earn back any playing time going forward.

I don't want any more designed runs from Hunter. He can do it if necessary, but not worth it otherwise.

I want to see us throw the ball down the field. OL did well and hunter has the arm. It should further help out Brock too if we can stretch things a bit

 

[madguy30]

Manning cannot recruit or develop a great offensive team. Which is going to keep this team from taking the next step.

Overwhelming majority of loses the last 5 years has been because of the offense screwing it up in crucial situations. The record stats and W results don't match up.

But the issue is which great offensive mind is going to come to ISU to be paid less then a Mil to be an OC.

Our hope is manning gets better with experience.

Special teams and things like 3rd down issues on defense have played a huge role.

 

[Frak]

It’s been time.

Putting up points and yards against overwhelmed or teams that quit (like TCU last year) can result in okay averages, but it’s rare Manning gives us an advantage in contested games. It’s not often he creates value.

If anything, far too many games are close contests or losses because he’s wasted some of the best skill position players ever at ISU, while also making his OL worse. He’s also responsible for not yet developing OL’s with the talent of even Rhoads era

He has very little feel for setting things up. He’s the type that needs the opponent to be so outmatched (or bad) that we are able to just overwhelm with even banal ****

I can’t believe how dumb this is. We just beat our rival off of a 99 yard drive while doubling their yardage and some of you want to fire the OC? I mean, maybe we can hire Tom Herman back after Campbell shitcans his buddy Manning. Heck, I bet Lane Kiffin would take a pay cut to come be an OC at ISU. JFC.

 

[Beyerball]

ISU offense has come a long way in past few years..

What becomes frustrating is key plays and you scratch your head..

Running QB sprint draw on 1st down inside Iowa 10 yard line vs one of best front 7 in college football...twice..is asinine play calling honestly.

ISU was so good last year in red zone...but it’s a lot new guys this year and maybe TM hasn’t adjusted yet either.

 

[DeereClone]

Besides continually running Dekkers in the red zone I thought Manning called a pretty good game. Did a good job of opening things up with the pass game, and still kept good balance with a solid running game to chew clock and control the ball, which is crucial on the road.

We were a few mistakes from winning that thing by a couple touchdowns.

 

[Frak]

There are maybe 2-3 teams left on the schedule that will rack up more yards than we did against that defense. And two of those are sitting in the top 10 right now. The other is Purdue and that’s just a matchup thing.

 

[bozclone]

This thread is disappointing. We beat Iowa. We moved the ball well against their all world defense. We were not conservative with our young inexperienced quarterback in his second start. Not every play call will work. Some will even look bad because they didn’t work. It is football.

 

[tzjung]

Can someone please explain to me why ISU is so averse to running a QB sneak at the goal line when you only need 3 inches?

 

[clonehome]

Overall I didn't think the play calling was too terrible, but there were 3 plays that I hated...
1. Not running a qb sneak for a td.
2. Wasting a 1st and goal with a wildcat play that everyone knew was going nowhere.
3. Running a qb sneak out of the endzone. I understand that many teams do it, but I think it is such a waste of a play. Any play you can run from the 2, you can run from the 1.

Points 1 and 3 contradict each other. There is a high probability of a safety if we run out of shotgun from inside the 1. That was a good call and with a stud like Downing you are correct that should have also been the call on 2nd and goal from the 1.

 

[cyclonehomer]

Can someone please explain to me why ISU is so averse to running a QB sneak at the goal line when you only need 3 inches?

The idea is that every other play is coming from shotgun and you risk the snap transition not being clean as guys don't really practice it much.

As a philosophy thing I don't mind it, generally speaking it's easier to run from a spread out formation than jumbo, but I do think you should have the ability to do it.

 

[clonehome]

Besides continually running Dekkers in the red zone I thought Manning called a pretty good game. Did a good job of opening things up with the pass game, and still kept good balance with a solid running game to chew clock and control the ball, which is crucial on the road.

We were a few mistakes from winning that thing by a couple touchdowns.

Agreed. Manning did what I’ve been suggesting as necessary to beat Iowa — spread them out with 3 and 4 WRs and throw to open up the run. Instead of the heavy TE sets like last year. Only issue I had was not going under center on the 2nd and goal from the 1 that ended up in a fumble. I think in both of these first 2 games Manning has done a good job of taking what the defense is giving. Thumbs up so far.

 

[ISUCubswin]

I am pro Tom Manning. I wasn’t at the start of last year.

Not sneaking in from the one was only poor decision that really kicked us in the nads.

Wasn’t a fan of the wildcat call, but maybe they had a plan to set up something else later down the road. Dekkers threw into double coverage and Brock fumbled at the one, I think he just wanted to try something different

 

[hoosman]

I have been one of Manning’s biggest critics. This year is better. There were some drops, missed blocks, missed targets ,and a pick in game 1 against a weak defense . I gave an A grade. Not terrible considering new QB, RB, TE. Yesterday was probably a B. We only scored 10 points and were weak in the deep red zone. 2 picks and a fumble, some more missed targets , but penalties, drops, missed blocks were manageable against a good defense. Lots of dink and dunk plays (like Purdy), but maybe their defense was protecting deep routes with their safeties - I couldn’t see their defensive formation very well on TV.