NO FANS AT CYCLONE GAMES?

[yowza]

According to IDPH website as of this morning:

0 deaths under 18 -- death rate 0%
15 deaths for 19 - 40 years old -- death rate around 0.1%
73 deaths for 41 - 60 years old -- death rate just over 0.8%

of the above 88 deaths all but 8 had a preexisting condition. The 8 who had no preexisting condition were in the 41 - 60 age range.

So far for anyone at 40 and below this has a rate right around normal flu and so far even less so for under 18. No one under 40 died without some sort of preexisting condition.

So we abandon life because of this. This data includes months when the medical field was still trying to figure out how to diagnose and treat, etc. And these rates do not factor in all those asymptomatic persons not figured into the denominators.

 

[Angie]

well they make a pretty good profit on residence halls I would imagine, most facilities have been paid for long ago. So not having bodies there would hurt

Most of the Cal State schools do not have large on campus residence, most are commuter schools. So for them there is not a huge loss when it comes to residency fee's.
Moving to online is not as big of a deal for them.

I absolutely agree, but they were the only one specifically mentioned in the Times article, so I called them out. They also are spread out over something like 23 campuses and the students largely already live in the community, so the impact percentage-wise on the population of an outbreak in the individual dorms or on-campus living halls would be almost negligible. It's not like ISU, that has all of their eggs in one basket in terms of repercussions - if Maple-Willow-Larch commons had an outbreak, it in a bubble would affect 1600+ residents (not factoring in employees), which is about 5% of the entire student population. Cal State looks to maybe have one dorm that holds 1500 people, but with a student base of 400k, that's roughly a .3% effect. However, they still found it safer to suspend on-site courses, even with the greater ability to mitigate issues. Yes, that is easier for them to do as far as residency fees, but it's also a larger scope to pivot in terms of the technical changes.

 

[Jer]

Infections lead positive test cases by a couple weeks. Positive test cases lead deaths by a couple weeks. The death rate could be decreasing but we will still start seeing deaths increase in the next couple weeks.

For all of those that want to open up and go to games, maybe spend your time arguing for people to start wearing their ******* masks now or we’re going to keep going down this long slow path.

There is a reason most countries that started when we did are back to a semi new normal with less than 5% of the deaths we have... they weren’t a bunch of ignorant, stubborn SOBs that refuse science.

 

[cyfan92]

Fun Fact. Post 24 of this thread has around 10 negative reactions. Those same 10 posters are almost all of the people that are constantly saying things against the idea of some form of fans in the stadium for football.

While I've counted at least 36 different accounts have reacted positively towards my posts or posted support themselves about some or limited fans at JTS this fall. Not a single person has said we should fill JTS with 62K or whatever capacity is.

A vocal minority is just as loud as the more silent majority. Why is that?

I'd wager that none of those 10 or very few actually have season tickets in a normal season to football games

 

[BoxsterCy]

you are a master of false equivalency. Grocery stores are required. Football is optional, maybe not optional from a revenue standpoint, I’ll give you that point, but definitely from a health perspective. Plus you are not acknowledging degrees of risk. Yes, being outside helps but limited contact with others FROM YOUR COMMUNITY for the most part for a 20 minute shopping trip is a lot different than sustained contact with people from all over the state. Yes, people make their own decisions but those decisions affect lots of others. By providing a venue for people from all over the state to make bad social contact decisions while tailgating and attending games ISU would be complicit with any health consequences.

Football doesn't have anything much to do with Iowa having women's rowing and field hockey. The fact that they carry "extra" men's sports like tennis, swimming & diving and gymnastics that ISU does not is why they also have more women's sports. Their more moneyed football program may help them afford those five non-revenue sports but the Big 10, the NCAA, and Title IX compliance don't say they have to. Iowa carries 24 sports, they could get by with 14 per NCAA Div I minimum.

 

[SEIOWA CLONE]

Infections lead positive test cases by a couple weeks. Positive test cases lead deaths by a couple weeks. The death rate could be decreasing but we will still start seeing deaths increase in the next couple weeks.

For all of those that want to open up and go to games, maybe spend your time arguing for people to start wearing their ******* masks now or we’re going to keep going down this long slow path.

There is a reason most countries that started when we did are back to a semi new normal with less than 5% of the deaths we have... they weren’t a bunch of ignorant, stubborn SOBs that refuse science.

True, last week here in town a gal tested positive for the virus that morning, she was feeling fine, and since it was woman's league that night at the golf course, she decided to go and play as always. I guess about halfway through her round, someone noticed her on the course, and knew that she had tested positive earlier in the day. The local pharmacist, who happened to be on the course, had to go out and tell her, since she had tested positive, she had to leave the course immediately. She had not bothered to tell anyone about the test or its results.
How many people did she expose to the virus, just on those few hours on the course.

 

[jsb]

Fun Fact. Post 24 of this thread has around 10 negative reactions. Those same 10 posters are almost all of the people that are constantly saying things against the idea of some form of fans in the stadium for football.

While I've counted at least 36 different accounts have reacted positively towards my posts or posted support themselves about some or limited fans at JTS this fall. Not a single person has said we should fill JTS with 62K or whatever capacity is.

A vocal minority is just as loud as the more silent majority. Why is that?

I'd wager that none of those 10 or very few actually have season tickets in a normal season to football games

So you think a fan message board is what should be used to decide whether fans should be at games? Pretty stupid.

I am a season ticket holder and have been since 2007. I will be very, very sad if I cannot go to games.

I don't think anyone who is saying that it seems a bit dangerous or unlikely that games with or without fans actually want that to happen. I certainly don't.

 

[jsb]

True, last week here in town a gal tested positive for the virus that morning, she was feeling fine, and since it was woman's league that night at the golf course, she decided to go and play as always. I guess about halfway through her round, someone noticed her on the course, and knew that she had tested positive earlier in the day. The local pharmacist, who happened to be on the course, had to go out and tell her, since she had tested positive, she had to leave the course immediately. She had not bothered to tell anyone about the test or its results.
How many people did she expose to the virus, just on those few hours on the course.

This is why we won't have football

 

[chuckd4735]

Well.... it sounds like Dr. Paschen has a axe to grind with ISU athletics from what I have heard. There is even talk of furloughing people in the athletic department now.

FYI - Dr. Paschen's wife Cynthia is running for election to the Iowa State Senate to represent District 24.

I do know that Paschen drafted these guidelines and the rest of the Board voted on them. Not sure that means anything, but worth adding to this discussion.

 

[Trice]

Fun Fact. Post 24 of this thread has around 10 negative reactions. Those same 10 posters are almost all of the people that are constantly saying things against the idea of some form of fans in the stadium for football.

While I've counted at least 36 different accounts have reacted positively towards my posts or posted support themselves about some or limited fans at JTS this fall. Not a single person has said we should fill JTS with 62K or whatever capacity is.

A vocal minority is just as loud as the more silent majority. Why is that?

I'd wager that none of those 10 or very few actually have season tickets in a normal season to football games

This post gets the patented passive-aggressive Urbandale2013 "creative" rating.

 

[nfrine]

Fun Fact. Post 24 of this thread has around 10 negative reactions. Those same 10 posters are almost all of the people that are constantly saying things against the idea of some form of fans in the stadium for football.

While I've counted at least 36 different accounts have reacted positively towards my posts or posted support themselves about some or limited fans at JTS this fall. Not a single person has said we should fill JTS with 62K or whatever capacity is.

A vocal minority is louder than the silent majority. Why is that?

I'd wager that none of those 10 or very few actually have season tickets in a normal season to football games

FIFY. And even louder than the 10 or so Hok trolls on CF too.

 

[SEIOWA CLONE]

Football doesn't have anything much to do with Iowa having women's rowing and field hockey. The fact that they carry "extra" men's sports like tennis, swimming & diving and gymnastics that ISU does not is why they also have more women's sports. Their more moneyed football program may help them afford those five non-revenue sports but the Big 10, the NCAA, and Title IX compliance don't say they have to. Iowa carries 24 sports, they could get by with 14 per NCAA Div I minimum.

Sure EIU could cut those men's sports, but if they want to have them, they have add woman's sports to equal out the numbers to stay compliant with Title 9.
No one is saying we have to shaft woman's sports, but how about taking football out of the picture, the one sport that brings in most of the money, and then make everything else equal.
Why do you think MBB only gets 13 scholarships but WBB gets 15? To bring the system more equal scholarship wise.

 

[Urbandale2013]

I can't imagine the level of delusion it requires to actually believe this.

I get that you want football. We all want football. But don't let your desire to have football make you dumb.

It's a non-binding recommendation which Jamie Pollard is free to ignore, and probably will. It'll be fine.

No, you do it now so that when Iowa State is making its decision it's already heard from the Health Department. You don't wait until they're already making the decision. You don't throw this at Iowa State when they're already starting to make their decision.

Also, what's really going to change between now and then? It's not like people are going to start social distancing and wearing masks.

Why the hell would I want to make a decision using an out of date recommendation. Like seriously. If I have an outdoor event and am concerned about rain. Am I going to want a recommendation two weeks in advance based on the forecast? No I will want a recommendation based on the forecast a couple of days before.

If your argument is you don’t think stuff will change that’s fine but why wouldn’t you want an update recommendation regardless of if it is the same recommendation. I’m trying my absolute hardest to understand why you think we need or want a recommendation at this point.

 

[Trice]

Why the hell would I want to make a decision using an out of date recommendation. Like seriously. If I have an outdoor event and am concerned about rain. Am I going to want a recommendation two weeks in advance based on the forecast? No I will want a recommendation based on the forecast a couple of days before.

If your argument is you don’t think stuff will change that’s fine but why wouldn’t you want an update recommendation regardless of if it is the same recommendation. I’m trying my absolute hardest to understand why you think we need or want a recommendation at this point.

It would help if you bothered to get the facts correct. The recommendation isn't for you. It's for ISU leadership to make the decision not to allow fans.

It functions just a little differently than deciding whether to take an umbrella based on the weather forecast.

 

[isucy86]

The health board has bigger things to worry about than a series of events of the kind known to be the highest risk for community virus spread?

And no, we are 75 days out from the first game. We are about 40-45 days from when tix normally ship out. Look at every other event that's been cancelled this year. These decisions are usually made a couple months in advance due to vendors, ticket shipping, etc. The decision on fans at ISU football this fall will probably come within the next month i'd imagine.

Will the AD print paper tickets? With technology is it still necessary that fans provide a traditional printed ticket when entering the stadium. I would think people with cell phones could provide a ticket image. If they don't have a cell phone they could print a paper ticket from their Ticket Master account on the ISU website. I have used both in the past.

IMO the Health Department was creating an expectation based on current conditions and science for ISU and the Athletic Department regarding the return of students and athletic events. Giving ISU a couple months to create a plan based on their current guidance. Otherwise they wasn't a real need to provide this guidance 70 days out with the constant changes in our knowledge of this virus.

I don't see a decision to allow fans being necessary until mid-August based on a Sep 5 first game. Over the next 30-45 days there will need to be a plan for seating 20-30k fans and get fan agreement they still want to purchase tickets based on their seat assignments. I think ISU will have big decisions on concessions sales and tailgating at the same time they decide on fans in the seats.

That said, if people don't wear masks and practicing social distancing over the next 30 days to drive down #'s, I think sports could be an after thought because students won't be on campus.

 

[Angie]

I do know that Paschen drafted these guidelines and the rest of the Board voted on them. Not sure that means anything, but worth adding to this discussion.

That maths out, given his roles. I was pretty sure he'd been chief of staff before, so I googled quickly. He's been chief of staff at MGMC, chief of peds, and chief of perinatology. He's also been the chairman of the board of health. I would bet he's likely considered the most qualified of the group.

 

[fsanford]

I guess I'm failing to say I understand the is risk with having football. I'm using Hy-Vee as the example to say we take risks everyday. This virus is very aggressive and it can be transmitted easily. So you take risk even doing essential activities. No one is forcing anyone to go to games.

The real world has to get back to a NEW NORMAL. Having 20%-50%, whatever the number is at Jack Trice will help the community recover economically. The health risks of COVID are never going away. We can't sit in our privileged suburban homes and wait this virus out until a vaccine comes along because that may NEVER come to be. So start with small crowds and build from there. We have the hospital capacity. We know younger and healthy people don't really need to worry. We know the old and sick need to be protected. We know testing needs to be better. Let's work on all of those things.

Certainly from both a knowledge and ability to combat we are in a better place than when this cranked up in March.

From a university standpoint priorities need to be

1) Get kids back on campus. We all know that when that happens there will be a spike of cases, just expect it. Kids will miss class time, but should be able to weather the sickness based on stats due to young age The concern is more about teachers and those of longer planet dwell time and the contact with them.

2) How the University/County deal with the spike how it impacts local medical facilities needs to be felt. Ames is going to add 20,000+ people to its population in a short period of time.

Give it 30 days from start of class to see how the community/university is handling it.
Seems like a reasonable request.

If everything looks great next phase is add fans to games. First game or 2 might not have fans, but after that sure of things look good.

Do this whole thing the wrong way, and it could get shut down before it gets started.
Nobody wants that. We all want football.

 

[Urbandale2013]

G

It would help if you bothered to get the facts correct. The recommendation isn't for you. It's for ISU leadership to make the decision not to allow fans.

It functions just a little differently than deciding whether to take an umbrella based on the weather forecast.

I get that. Is Iowa State making a decision now? No they are not. I work with an organization that had to cancel an event this summer. When we made that decision we didn’t use out of date information. The same goes here. What part are you not getting that Iowa State isn’t currently making the decision? This doesn’t even need to be a public resolution it can be a behind the scenes conversation between Pollard and the board.

They should absolutely make a recommendation. No one says they shouldn’t. That wasn’t what this was. This was a PR hit job.

 

[WooBadger18]

Why the hell would I want to make a decision using an out of date recommendation. Like seriously. If I have an outdoor event and am concerned about rain. Am I going to want a recommendation two weeks in advance based on the forecast? No I will want a recommendation based on the forecast a couple of days before.

If your argument is you don’t think stuff will change that’s fine but why wouldn’t you want an update recommendation regardless of if it is the same recommendation. I’m trying my absolute hardest to understand why you think we need or want a recommendation at this point.

First, your weather example is just stupid.

Because I don't think we're that far out from making the decision. This isn't something that you can really decide in the last two weeks. I'd be shocked if Iowa State wasn't already discussing what to do. If Iowa State wants more advice later or wants to know if their recommendations have changed, I'm sure they can ask.

As for why did they do it publicly? Because they're concerned that Iowa State will do something that they disagree with and they think it's better for it to be public

 

[Cy$]

I'd wager that none of those 10 or very few actually have season tickets in a normal season to football games

I had popeyes for lunch today.