Penn State University - The Freeh Report
- Thread starter CLONECONES
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Here's a good acticle from the KC Star on how our societies obsession with sports helped play a role in this. IMO that is the much deeper issue here that I hope gets discussed ad nausem. A football programs status should NEVER be elevated above the educational focus of a university (not to mention simple morality) but that is where we are in our society now.
I think the only way you get some kind of focus on this discussion is if Penn State is given a healthy death sentence. If we don't learn a lesson from sports "protecting" child rape, we are pretty much all going to hell.
"Because of sports, Sandusky was left free too long. Because of sports, grown men protected a child molester instead of children. Because of sports, many otherwise reasonable Penn State fans are still defending the indefensible."
Read more here: Sam Mellinger | At Penn State, sport itself was a co-conspirator - KansasCity.com
I think the only way you get some kind of focus on this discussion is if Penn State is given a healthy death sentence. If we don't learn a lesson from sports "protecting" child rape, we are pretty much all going to hell.
"Because of sports, Sandusky was left free too long. Because of sports, grown men protected a child molester instead of children. Because of sports, many otherwise reasonable Penn State fans are still defending the indefensible."
Read more here: Sam Mellinger | At Penn State, sport itself was a co-conspirator - KansasCity.com
Did anyone see that U of I won their appeal against Press Citizen with regards to turning over certain documents related to Everson/Satterfield rape incident. Court said that they had right not to turn over certain documents.
HILLCYD, now that I see your avatar on here I think you are the other one that I need to publicly apologize to regarding my insistence that Joe Paterno didn't have direct knowledge. You and Ribsnwhiskey were the two that I had stated I would publicly apologize to if it came out Paterno had knowledge. Sorry for leaving you out of the earlier post.
Ape **** huh? I wonder if ape **** has any correlation with a DA investigating a 1998 state college child molester that mysteriously went missing.
I havent read thru everything so I hope I'm not repeating, but it doesn't necessarily have to pertain to players. Or even coaches. The fail-safe the NCAA put in place is "lack of institutional control". They can penalize a school for that. And if Penn State does not demonstrate lack of institutional control, I dont know what does!
Its a big leap to assume, but are we sure about this? Weather the janitors were scared to lose their jobs or prehaps scared of something worse only they know, but the fact that they were scared is damning to Paterno.
But yes regardless of their fear they should have done something. Does law enforcement no longer accept annonymous tips? Certainly that would have been easy enough.
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- Mar 27, 2006
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You're making a mistake, there. "Lack of institutional control" is not a violation in and of itself. It's just not. It's not a catch all. There must be other NCAA violations present for Lack of Institutional Control to be charged.
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Interesting. I always just assumed it was the NCAA's broad brush in case they ran into something tricky. Like this.
How the NCAA is trying to find a way to punish them is too go to the Bylaws which they use as the basis for forming the rules. They say we have bylaws that require ethical conduct, and it describes insititutional control in broader terms. They are doing this because they know the rules as they are written don't cover this so they are looking at athe constitution of the NCAA and its by laws.
I don't think there really needs to be any precedent or violation written in the bilaws for the NCAA to take action.
Nothing of this severity has happened before. They will act accordingly
- Mar 27, 2006
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I thought so as well, as recently as yesterday. Then i started reading up on it. What it's all going to boil down to is whether or not the actions of Spanier, Curley, Paterno, and Schultz are determined to be in their own interest, or on behalf of Penn State University. Are they the institution? If they are, then the NCAA has the ability to gut the place.
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Think about that for a second. There doesn't need to be a violation of a bylaw for punishment to be taken? Is Ex Post Facto really the way this ought to be dealt with? That seems counter to the nation's laws. The fact is, Penn State's not going to get away with this. They are going to be punished. Being concerned about making sure some piddly athletic governing body gets a chance to dole out their punishment for this is like insisting that a traffic cop be able to issue a parking ticket to a bank robber.
As sports fans, we look to the punishers that we know (the NCAA) for their response, when in reality, this has gone far, far above them.
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It will defintely be interesting to see how the NCAA addresses the situation. I think it will be interesting as well if this opens the door the the NCAA getting involved in criminal law convictions of players and coaches.
Sure, in real society, yes.
in NCAA rulings on harboring a child molester - probably safe to play
- Mar 27, 2006
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I understand why, but it really hurts the credibility of their organization. They let others do the punishment for them, and if the others feel the punisment is adequate, then they will continue as if nothing happened with a big smile.
In my company if you commit a crime not only will you be punished by the law, but you will lose your job and affiliation with the organization. Disassociation is a big deterent that the NCAA fails to use because of well one thing, $.
Well that is just dumb. I'm guessing the Pennsylvania state legislature could inflict a heck of a lot more punishment in a month than the NCAA could in a lifetime. Forget about the football team, they could give the entire school the death penalty. The Big Ten has more power here than the NCAA also.
Yeah...that's likely to happen. Any legislator who even remotely supported such a plan would very likely be whipped come election time (probably wouldn't even survive the primaries).
The Big Ten has very little power. PSU can tell the Big Ten to take a hike. Without any NCAA sanctions, the Big East would take PSU in a heartbeat. PSU donors can make up any revenue loss.
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Do you really think it's a given that the Big East would take PSU. I'm not saying it's impossible, but would you really want to be the conference that took in the school that another conference let go due to a pedophilia scandal? I don't think even the Big East is that desperate.
If the Big Ten wanted to make Penn St. a pariah and decided that they wouldn't be included in the conference football schedule for say 3 years, they could do it.
