"World Champions" what is it? long

[HFCS]

I see a lot of debate lately about "World Champions" as it pertains to Olympic basketball and the NBA Championship. To me it seems radically different sport to sport. What does everyone else think?

Football - Seems cringe to say "world champions" because so few countries play. If you had to say it, it's Superbowl Champions who are "world champs" but I'd rather it wasn't a thing people said. It's just an American thing that's popular to watch some other places too.

Baseball - It is at least a widely played sport on three continents so I don't mind "World Series" as much since MLB is by far the best level of play. World Series champ is definitely the best pro baseball team that year and a decent % of MLB is international. The World Baseball Classic is cool and I don't have any problem calling that a world championship but it's not actually the highest level/achievement of baseball right?

Basketball - I think the Olympic champ can be called "World Champ" because most of the best players in the world try to qualify and play for their country. I have a REALLY hard time calling FIBA worlds "world champ" when so many of the best players don't even play. I'm totally fine calling NBA Champ "World Champ" when the top 4 MVP vote getters this year were not even American. This sets European sports fans into rage mode which is what sparked the whole topic for me. The NBA champ is very clearly the best pro team in the world and competing against global competition even if the games are all in US/Canada.

Hockey - know nothing about international hockey

Soccer - The World Cup champ is obviously a very pure "World Champion", Olympic soccer really is not for men for the same reasons I struggle with FIBA worlds. For women Olympic soccer does seem more like a true world champ. I see a lot of people arguing that being EPL champ isn't world champ because it's just one country, but to me Champion's League champion really is the best pro team in the world of a given year since Italy, Spain and Germany often have clubs that are just as good or better than top EPL clubs. I get that Europeans hate the idea of calling Champions's League Champ "World Champ" because of the World Cup, but hey, that's the "best pro team in the world" and the players are incredibly global.

Golf/Tennis - it's about the majors and maybe the world ranking?

Most other sports - seems like it's just the Olympics with their own annual "worlds" also being world champ once a year?

 

[Gunnerclone]

I see a lot of debate lately about "World Champions" as it pertains to Olympic basketball and the NBA Championship. To me it seems radically different sport to sport. What does everyone else think?

Football - Seems cringe to say "world champions" because so few countries play. If you had to say it, it's Superbowl Champions who are "world champs" but I'd rather it wasn't a thing people said. It's just an American thing that's popular to watch some other places too.

Baseball - It is at least a widely played sport on three continents so I don't mind "World Series" as much since MLB is by far the best level of play. World Series champ is definitely the best pro baseball team that year and a decent % of MLB is international. The World Baseball Classic is cool and I don't have any problem calling that a world championship but it's not actually the highest level/achievement of baseball right?

Basketball - I think the Olympic champ can be called "World Champ" because most of the best players in the world try to qualify and play for their country. I have a REALLY hard time calling FIBA worlds "world champ" when so many of the best players don't even play. I'm totally fine calling NBA Champ "World Champ" when the top 4 MVP vote getters this year were not even American. This sets European sports fans into rage mode which is what sparked the whole topic for me. The NBA champ is very clearly the best pro team in the world and competing against global competition even if the games are all in US/Canada.

Hockey - know nothing about international hockey

Soccer - The World Cup champ is obviously a very pure "World Champion", Olympic soccer really is not for men for the same reasons I struggle with FIBA worlds. For women Olympic soccer does seem more like a true world champ. I see a lot of people arguing that being EPL champ isn't world champ because it's just one country, but to me Champion's League champion really is the best pro team in the world of a given year since Italy, Spain and Germany often have clubs that are just as good or better than top EPL clubs. I get that Europeans hate the idea of calling Champions's League Champ "World Champ" because of the World Cup, but hey, that's the "best pro team in the world" and the players are incredibly global.

Golf/Tennis - it's about the majors and maybe the world ranking?

Most other sports - seems like it's just the Olympics with their own annual "worlds" also being world champ once a year?

Olympic sports have world championships as well. These are two separate things. That’s why you see OR & WR on most events.

The reigning world champion may not be the reigning Olympic champion.

 

[JM4CY]

 

[HFCS]

Olympic sports have world championships as well. These are two separate things. That’s why you see OR & WR on most events.

The reigning world champion may not be the reigning Olympic champion.

Yeah it's very clean in lots of Olympic sports.

The debate is basically that soccer/basketball fans in Europe get really upset if you call any pro team "world champs". To me I agree it's silly in American football/NFL, kind of makes sense in MLB but still a little weird, but in basketball I do kind of think the NBA champ really is a world champion, it just happens to be a very professional world championship and it's not tied to a nation. I wouldn't have a problem saying the same thing about Champions League but that's more messy because the World Cup competition level is more deep and intense than even Olympic basketball we just saw.

Like in the Jordan dynasty when they'd announce "your world champion Chicago Bulls"...it wasn't wrong. They're the best in the world. Now that the top 4 players in the NBA last year were all foreign it's even more true.

 

[Turn2]

I see a lot of debate lately about "World Champions" as it pertains to Olympic basketball and the NBA Championship. To me it seems radically different sport to sport. What does everyone else think?

Football - Seems cringe to say "world champions" because so few countries play. If you had to say it, it's Superbowl Champions who are "world champs" but I'd rather it wasn't a thing people said. It's just an American thing that's popular to watch some other places too.

Baseball - It is at least a widely played sport on three continents so I don't mind "World Series" as much since MLB is by far the best level of play. World Series champ is definitely the best pro baseball team that year and a decent % of MLB is international. The World Baseball Classic is cool and I don't have any problem calling that a world championship but it's not actually the highest level/achievement of baseball right?

Basketball - I think the Olympic champ can be called "World Champ" because most of the best players in the world try to qualify and play for their country. I have a REALLY hard time calling FIBA worlds "world champ" when so many of the best players don't even play. I'm totally fine calling NBA Champ "World Champ" when the top 4 MVP vote getters this year were not even American. This sets European sports fans into rage mode which is what sparked the whole topic for me. The NBA champ is very clearly the best pro team in the world and competing against global competition even if the games are all in US/Canada.

Hockey - know nothing about international hockey

Soccer - The World Cup champ is obviously a very pure "World Champion", Olympic soccer really is not for men for the same reasons I struggle with FIBA worlds. For women Olympic soccer does seem more like a true world champ. I see a lot of people arguing that being EPL champ isn't world champ because it's just one country, but to me Champion's League champion really is the best pro team in the world of a given year since Italy, Spain and Germany often have clubs that are just as good or better than top EPL clubs. I get that Europeans hate the idea of calling Champions's League Champ "World Champ" because of the World Cup, but hey, that's the "best pro team in the world" and the players are incredibly global.

Golf/Tennis - it's about the majors and maybe the world ranking?

Most other sports - seems like it's just the Olympics with their own annual "worlds" also being world champ once a year?

Now do the shooting sports. How does 'merica only get one gold?!?

 

[cyfanbr]

A lot to unpack here. First I would start by differentiating between club tournaments and country tournaments. If you win the NBA (American club tournament ), no you should say that you are world champions. I get it that the best team in the NBA would likely smoke any other basketball clubs, but you got play the game to confirm it.

Soccer is the cleanest in my opinion. For countries there is the World Cup every 4 years. For clubs, we all know that UEFA champions league is the top cup in the world, but every year they still play the Clubs World Cup with all the continental champions.

 

[JM4CY]

Not do the shooting sports. How does 'merica only get one gold?!?

They need to better search Alabama trailer courts for talent we all know is there.

 

[Rabbuk]

Now do the shooting sports. How does 'merica only get one gold?!?

My friend who competition shoots says that some of the top shooters in America don't want to take a month off from teaching classes for like 500 bucks a head to go do the olympics. Not sure if true or not, but he said one guy in particular makes like 50k a seminar teaching police departments.

 

[madguy30]

Champion of the league or event/association you win should be what it's called.

Super Bowl Champs.
MLB Champs.
NBA Champs.
Olympic Champs.

 

[HFCS]

A lot to unpack here. First I would start by differentiating between club tournaments and country tournaments. If you win the NBA (American club tournament ), no you should say that you are world champions. I get it that the best team in the NBA would likely smoke any other basketball clubs, but you got play the game to confirm it.

Soccer is the cleanest in my opinion. For countries there is the World Cup every 4 years. For clubs, we all know that UEFA champions league is the top cup in the world, but every year they still play the Clubs World Cup with all the continental champions.

My thing is I don’t care if Europeans don’t like calling champion’s league winner “world champ” but if they did, I’d get it and it wouldn’t be irrational. They do so out of deference to World Cup and that’s understandable.

NBA is my main thing other than Cyclones all my life and it seems kind of weird for me to NOT call the winner the world champ. It seemed fine in the 90s but really fine now that half of the top ten players are foreign and the clear best four players were not American this year. I watched a majority of Olympic basketball, not just US, and I love it, but it still doesn’t seem as intense or high level as the nba playoffs to me. FIBA World Cup isn’t even remotely close sadly.

 

[HFCS]

Champion of the league or event/association you win should be what it's called.

Super Bowl Champs.
MLB Champs.
NBA Champs.
Olympic Champs.

so we should change name of World Series?

 

[madguy30]

so we should change name of World Series?

Sure.

Personally I hardly notice when it's on so would probably not really notice the change.

 

[AlaCyclone]

Real simple to me. Regardless of the sport, if it is not a Championship of Teams from all around the world, it is not a World Championship.

 

[cyfanbr]

My thing is I don’t care if Europeans don’t like calling champion’s league winner “world champ” but if they did, I’d get it and it wouldn’t be irrational. They do so out of deference to World Cup and that’s understandable.

NBA is my main thing other than Cyclones all my life and it seems kind of weird for me to NOT call the winner the world champ. It seemed fine in the 90s but really fine now that half of the top ten players are foreign and the clear best four players were not American this year. I watched a majority of Olympic basketball, not just US, and I love it, but it still doesn’t seem as intense or high level as the nba playoffs to me. FIBA World Cup isn’t even remotely close sadly.

In my opinion titles are won in the field/court. If you think you are the best in the world then play against the champions of other continents to prove it. For the NBA, the NBA champs would win 99% of the time, but you still got play the game to confirm it. To circle back to soccer, the champions league champion does not always win the club World Cup even though on paper they should.

List of world champion football clubs - Wikipedia

en.m.wikipedia.org

 

[CyGuy5]

If the best players play in the league (MLB, NFL, NBA, NHL, etc) then the winning team is world champions in my book. Probably need to differentiate world championships between individual teams/clubs and national tournaments like the Olympics though.

 

[every_yard]

This got me thinking, it would be cool (at least try it for a year) to have a tournament with the champions from multiple leagues.

Example:

Basketball: NBA, China Basketball Association, Spain Liga ACB, EuroLeague, etc.

Baseball: MLB, KBO, NPB