Are we being to harsh

[CoKane]

Those teams all have more talent that ISU.

Which is another pretty big indictment of Prohm since he somehow saw a Big 12 player in Prentiss Nixon, who I'm not even sure is a quality Mountain West player. All these guys are here because of Prohm now

 

[Clonefan32]

Which is another pretty big indictment of Prohm since he somehow saw a Big 12 player in Prentiss Nixon, who I'm not even sure is a quality Mountain West player. All these guys are here because of Prohm now

Not only that, but he saw a guy that was worthy of burning two years of scholarship on one year of play.

 

[CyCloned]

Thinking about what we lost after last year? I think I might have just expected to much this season. We lost THT, Wigginton, Shayok. That’s is a ton of scoring and talent.

I think I am changing my thought process and want to see what we are
Like next season and the season after. Changing the coach does not always make things better. Prohm has had some good teams and we have won a lot of games with him.

I think Prohm could have done a much better job this year, but on the other hand, there was a lot of talent that left Ames last year, and some of it was not anticipated. Over the years ISU has been blessed with guys like Shayok, that come out of nowhere to be the scorer the team needs. Nixon was probably supposed to be that guy this year, but he has gone from a volume shooter that could score to a volume shooter that should stop shooting. The disappearance of Jacobson has not help this team either.

BTW, ISU also lost Lard, who was capable of being a real force inside on offense and defense. Super inconsistent, but the talent was there. This could have been Cam's year to shine.

So, while I think we are being a little hard on Prohm, he has to take some of the blame for this mess. Everyone just needs to get better.

 

[Cy$]

You are starting to see alot of good coaches around the NCAA who started off poorly figure out their personnel and find a way to win. Mick Cronin at UCLA lost to Hofstra and Cal State Fullerton and now has them atop the Pac 10 and on the bubble. Ed Cooley at Providence lost to Northwestern, Penn, Long Beach State and Charleston. They beat 5 ranked teams in February. Greg Gard at Wisconsin lost to Richmond and New Mexico and have won 6 straight. Good coaches that figured out their teams and how to maximize their potential.

I just don't see that with Steve. Just the same old stuff, game after game.

Those coaches got lucky.

 

[Halincandenza]

Which is another pretty big indictment of Prohm since he somehow saw a Big 12 player in Prentiss Nixon, who I'm not even sure is a quality Mountain West player. All these guys are here because of Prohm now

Yeah the Nixon signing is a huge swing and miss.

 

[Statefan10]

I realize at some point you have to have the horses. But I still see issues that I think are a result of being poorly coached. Defense and shot selection to name a few.

But to your point I agree it will all come down to how the young guys are able to develop.

Defense has definitely been an issue and I don't think Prohm's a good defensive coach, but defense isn't all about coaching. Our defensive inabilities haven't been all schematic issues. Guys are getting back doored left and right or losing a shooter because they're not paying attention to man and ball, guys are messing up ball screen defense because they're forgetting whether they're icing it, double teaming it, or hedging it. I've listened to Steve's post game press conferences where he literally goes over what they're suppose to do on defense and then the first possession of the game, we'll mess it up. That's not on Steve.

As far as shot selection goes, I honestly believe 75% of the worst shots taken this entire year have came by Nixon. Just getting him off the team is going to make next year's team much better as far as ball movement / shot selection goes. Getting Rasir off the point will also help a ton because he's not a great ball handler.

 

[Clonefan32]

Defense has definitely been an issue and I don't think Prohm's a good defensive coach, but defense isn't all about coaching. Our defensive inabilities haven't been all schematic issues. Guys are getting back doored left and right or losing a shooter because they're not paying attention to man and ball, guys are messing up ball screen defense because they're forgetting whether they're icing it, double teaming it, or hedging it. I've listened to Steve's post game press conferences where he literally goes over what they're suppose to do on defense and then the first possession of the game, we'll mess it up. That's not on Steve.

As far as shot selection goes, I honestly believe 75% of the worst shots taken this entire year have came by Nixon. Just getting him off the team is going to make next year's team much better as far as ball movement / shot selection goes. Getting Rasir off the point will also help a ton because he's not a great ball handler.

And I think herein lies the difference of opinion. To me, everything you've discussed is a coaching issue. If you're coaching something and the guys aren't responding to it, that's a problem in itself.

 

[madguy30]

You are starting to see alot of good coaches around the NCAA who started off poorly figure out their personnel and find a way to win. Mick Cronin at UCLA lost to Hofstra and Cal State Fullerton and now has them atop the Pac 10 and on the bubble. Ed Cooley at Providence lost to Northwestern, Penn, Long Beach State and Charleston. They beat 5 ranked teams in February. Greg Gard at Wisconsin lost to Richmond and New Mexico and have won 6 straight. Good coaches that figured out their teams and how to maximize their potential.

I just don't see that with Steve. Just the same old stuff, game after game.

Those teams also have more talent than ISU.

Prohm hasn't done a good job but there's not a coach out there that would have done much with this ISU team.

 

[rochclone]

If you look up and down this roster of players though, you don't have much to work with. We had a PG in Halliburton whose game revolves around setting people up in great positions to score, but we lack the ability at those other guard positions, or at least we did. Bolton's shooting ability has come along nicely as the season has progressed, same with Jackson. How nice would it be if Tyrese were playing now with the way those guys shots have improved? Nixon would rarely see the floor if we had Tyrese right now too. No we wouldn't be a ton better, but I think we'd be on the cusp of the NIT.

The style of offense we run is predicated on moving the ball and finding open shooters, but our roster makeup doesn't allow us to do that, or really anything else. Solomon has been pretty good on the block but Conditt and Mike have struggled greatly in that area, so trying to force feed the post is not really an option. Lewis and Griffin would help in having a more versatile offense with mismatches but neither of them are consistent enough offensively and both are terrible on defense. So our most effective offense is hoping we knock down shots, but when Bolton is playing out of position, Nixon is overall awful, and two freshman are trying to figure everything out, it's not a good recipe.

And although Virginia lost a lot of talent from last year's team.. they're still Virginia, a team who has been consistently one of the best teams in the nation the past half decade or so. They have a ton of talent still and a coach who is probably the best defensive coach in the nation.

We would be on the cusp of the NIT if Tyrese wouldn’t have gotten hurt? We are currently 12-17 to be on the cusp of the NIT we would need to be 15-14 at a minimum. We have gone 3-4 since Tyrese’s injury including the KSU game. So in order to be on “the cusp” of the NIT we would have needed to go 6-1 since Tyrese’s injury. Which three of the following four games would we have won with Tyrese?
At Kansas lost by 20.
At Oklahoma lost by 29.
vs. Texas Tech lost by 30.
At Oklahoma State lost by 12.

We “might” be 13-16 with Tyrese had he not been injured versus KSU but saying we are on the cusp of the NIT when you are below .500 is just completely disingenuous.

 

[Billups06]

Defense has definitely been an issue and I don't think Prohm's a good defensive coach, but defense isn't all about coaching. Our defensive inabilities haven't been all schematic issues. Guys are getting back doored left and right or losing a shooter because they're not paying attention to man and ball, guys are messing up ball screen defense because they're forgetting whether they're icing it, double teaming it, or hedging it. I've listened to Steve's post game press conferences where he literally goes over what they're suppose to do on defense and then the first possession of the game, we'll mess it up. That's not on Steve.

As far as shot selection goes, I honestly believe 75% of the worst shots taken this entire year have came by Nixon. Just getting him off the team is going to make next year's team much better as far as ball movement / shot selection goes. Getting Rasir off the point will also help a ton because he's not a great ball handler.

I get players need to have some accountability in this, but isn't that what separates good coaches? Ultimately, it IS on Steve to get players to perform, or in this case, execute the game plan.

 

[Clonefan32]

We would be on the cusp of the NIT if Tyrese wouldn’t have gotten hurt? We are currently 12-17 to be on the cusp of the NIT we would need to be 15-14 at a minimum. We have gone 3-4 since Tyrese’s injury including the KSU game. So in order to be on “the cusp” of the NIT we would have needed to go 6-1 since Tyrese’s injury. Which three of the following four games would we have won with Tyrese?
At Kansas lost by 20.
At Oklahoma lost by 29.
vs. Texas Tech lost by 30.
At Oklahoma State lost by 12.

We “might” be 13-16 with Tyrese had he not been injured versus KSU but saying we are on the cusp of the NIT when you are below .500 is just completely disingenuous.

While losing Tyrese undoubtedly hurt, I think people are forgetting how truly bad we were even with him on the floor.

 

[rochclone]

Defense has definitely been an issue and I don't think Prohm's a good defensive coach, but defense isn't all about coaching. Our defensive inabilities haven't been all schematic issues. Guys are getting back doored left and right or losing a shooter because they're not paying attention to man and ball, guys are messing up ball screen defense because they're forgetting whether they're icing it, double teaming it, or hedging it. I've listened to Steve's post game press conferences where he literally goes over what they're suppose to do on defense and then the first possession of the game, we'll mess it up. That's not on Steve.

As far as shot selection goes, I honestly believe 75% of the worst shots taken this entire year have came by Nixon. Just getting him off the team is going to make next year's team much better as far as ball movement / shot selection goes. Getting Rasir off the point will also help a ton because he's not a great ball handler.

Can you believe that we really pursued Prentiss Nixon over making a full court press for Matt Mooney at South Dakota? Who would have thought that a player that was 115-356 (32%) his last two years at CSU from the 3 point wouldn’t be extremely efficient at 6”3 (185 pounds) in the Big 12 as an off-guard?

The best part is that Nixon shot .384 from the Field his Spoh year average over 11 shots a game.

His junior year he FG% fell to .356 while averaging nearly 14 shots a game. Who takes a player who shoots 37% from the field and 32% from 3 point range and his high volume? And before we start with the DeAndre Kane comparison note that DeAndre Kane shot over 47% from the field in his Soph and Junior years at Marshall.

 

[Statefan10]

We would be on the cusp of the NIT if Tyrese wouldn’t have gotten hurt? We are currently 12-17 to be on the cusp of the NIT we would need to be 15-14 at a minimum. We have gone 3-4 since Tyrese’s injury including the KSU game. So in order to be on “the cusp” of the NIT we would have needed to go 6-1 since Tyrese’s injury. Which three of the following four games would we have won with Tyrese?
At Kansas lost by 20.
At Oklahoma lost by 29.
vs. Texas Tech lost by 30.
At Oklahoma State lost by 12.

We “might” be 13-16 with Tyrese had he not been injured versus KSU but saying we are on the cusp of the NIT when you are below .500 is just completely disingenuous.

You need to win around 16 games to make the NIT right? Any of those games besides KU we might've picked up a win had Tyrese played. It's easy to sit here after the fact and say with Tyrese there was no chance of victory but had we had him, we have no idea how the games would've gone. Obviously right now we're below .500 but if you'd flip even two of those games, we'd be 14-15 with two games remaining against two teams we could beat with Tyrese (WVU only because we're at home). Hell, we might win one without him. So say we win both of those, now we're sitting at 16-15 and one win in the Big 12 tournament would put us at 17 wins.

It is not entirely improbable that with Tyrese, we wouldn't have been close to an NIT berth.

 

[Statefan10]

Can you believe that we really pursued Prentiss Nixon over making a full court press for Matt Mooney at South Dakota? Who would have thought that a player that was 115-356 (32%) his last two years at CSU from the 3 point wouldn’t be extremely efficient at 6”3 (185 pounds) in the Big 12 as an off-guard?

The best part is that Nixon shot .384 from the Field his Spoh year average over 11 shots a game.

His junior year he FG% fell to .356 while averaging nearly 14 shots a game. Who takes a player who shoots 37% from the field and 32% from 3 point range and his high volume? And before we start with the DeAndre Kane comparison note that DeAndre Kane shot over 47% from the field in his Soph and Junior years at Marshall.

I mean I'm not sure Matt Mooney wanted to come to ISU at all considering the depth we had at the guard position last year.. We wouldn't have had Matt Mooney this season so I'm not sure where that comes into play at. Prentiss Nixon has turned out to be a terrible get though, that's for sure.

 

[SEIACyclone]

Can you believe that we really pursued Prentiss Nixon over making a full court press for Matt Mooney at South Dakota? Who would have thought that a player that was 115-356 (32%) his last two years at CSU from the 3 point wouldn’t be extremely efficient at 6”3 (185 pounds) in the Big 12 as an off-guard?

The best part is that Nixon shot .384 from the Field his Spoh year average over 11 shots a game.

His junior year he FG% fell to .356 while averaging nearly 14 shots a game. Who takes a player who shoots 37% from the field and 32% from 3 point range and his high volume? And before we start with the DeAndre Kane comparison note that DeAndre Kane shot over 47% from the field in his Soph and Junior years at Marshall.

Who says we didn't make a full court press on Mooney? I mean maybe he had zero interest. After all Tech was clearly a better option for him.

 

[Statefan10]

While losing Tyrese undoubtedly hurt, I think people are forgetting how truly bad we were even with him on the floor.

Well no doubt we were bad, but I think people are missing the fact that we were bad against very good teams, all teams that are in the top 6 in the entire nation in defense (KU, BU, TTU, and WVU). Against the lower competition, we were competing and in every single game. We blew out OU, were a banked in 3 away from beating TCU, and we had a lead late against Texas when they had Jericho Sims.

 

[LanningIsBakersDaddy]

We would be on the cusp of the NIT if Tyrese wouldn’t have gotten hurt? We are currently 12-17 to be on the cusp of the NIT we would need to be 15-14 at a minimum. We have gone 3-4 since Tyrese’s injury including the KSU game. So in order to be on “the cusp” of the NIT we would have needed to go 6-1 since Tyrese’s injury. Which three of the following four games would we have won with Tyrese?
At Kansas lost by 20.
At Oklahoma lost by 29.
vs. Texas Tech lost by 30.
At Oklahoma State lost by 12.

We “might” be 13-16 with Tyrese had he not been injured versus KSU but saying we are on the cusp of the NIT when you are below .500 is just completely disingenuous.

Without any Tyrese Halliburton injury the guys almost certainly beat Florida A&M. We win one of those games above and we’re sitting at 14-15 with 2 winnable games coming up this week and a winnable game in the big 12 tourney. It’s Plausible they could have made the NIT, not probable.

 

[Statefan10]

I get players need to have some accountability in this, but isn't that what separates good coaches? Ultimately, it IS on Steve to get players to perform, or in this case, execute the game plan.

I'm not taking blame away from Prohm in regards to this season. Ultimately, it's on Steve for taking chances on guys like Nixon and taking Leech and Anderson who both ended up leaving. Both of those scholarships could've been used on guys to help the team this year but we also wouldn't have had open scholarships for two of the guys we picked up in the 2020 class.

There are times when you can coach players into being better, but if you just watch these guys singularly, some of them are just not cut out and it wouldn't matter who their coach was this year, they'd still be bad and fail to do things correctly.

 

[Drew0311]

Can you believe that we really pursued Prentiss Nixon over making a full court press for Matt Mooney at South Dakota? Who would have thought that a player that was 115-356 (32%) his last two years at CSU from the 3 point wouldn’t be extremely efficient at 6”3 (185 pounds) in the Big 12 as an off-guard?

The best part is that Nixon shot .384 from the Field his Spoh year average over 11 shots a game.

His junior year he FG% fell to .356 while averaging nearly 14 shots a game. Who takes a player who shoots 37% from the field and 32% from 3 point range and his high volume? And before we start with the DeAndre Kane comparison note that DeAndre Kane shot over 47% from the field in his Soph and Junior years at Marshall.

You are looking at it a little different that what coaches would look at this. Prohm is looking at having Lard, Solo, Haliburton, Horton-Tucker, and Jacobson in the starting lineup. Nixon can come off the bench and add some defensive minutes and fill a few rolls. However, that did not happen. Lard, THT,and Haliburton are all gone. So Nixon has to try and be the man like he had to try and be at CSU. It has not worked with him in that roll.

 

[clonehoodie]

How a coach handles high-talent players must be really tough.
Can you imagine a coach yelling at Burton ? Or even benching him ? The coach could not. We have to play our best players all the time to win. Difficult this year, as all 9 are equally bad.