Could Otz be the end of Hoiberg's coaching career?

[clonedude]

Can we all just admit that Fred isn't a very good x's and o's basketball coach?

He was a great recruiter, but actually underperformed at ISU with all the talent he had. In the NBA, every team is loaded with talent, so the coaching is all that matters.... which is why he got the results he did. And at Nebby, he just hasn't gotten as lucky with his recruiting yet... and if he doesn't have talent.... he's screwed.

Love Hoiberg for everything he's done for ISU.... but he's is SO overrated as a basketball coach. His philosophy is to shoot 3's and not care much about defense.... always has been. If the shots fall, you win.... if not.... you're screwed.

 

[Thomasrickj]

The Hoiball legacy is over. Why are some of you still obsessed with him six years later?

 

[cyatheart]

My feeling is, and this could be totally wrong, Fred just lost a lot of passion for coaching. Made a ton of money, had some serious health problems, nobody really cares at Nebraska, he doesn’t like recruiting which is half the job anyway….it’s not hard to imagine having less passion and fight to succeed for it if you are him. I think his passion and fight for the job maybe stayed in Ames when he left.

 

[jsb]

Hoiberg will be the end of Hoiberg's coaching career.

 

[madguy30]

The Hoiball legacy is over. Why are some of you still obsessed with him six years later?

Because it's easy to speculate on things that didn't happen.

 

[DSM4Cy]

Two things can be true:

- Fred resurrected Cyclone basketball and Hilton Magic and gave us some incredible memories.
- In the end, given the talent he recruited, Fred underachieved at ISU.

I’m grateful to him for what he did for our program and don’t like to see him struggling so much, but the adage about the grass not always being greener seems to apply here. When he’s fired from Nebraska it will be interesting to see where he goes. Fred’s a guy who obviously believes in himself and isn’t afraid to take risks. His dream of coaching an NBA franchise might not be something most Cyclone fans understand, but he was willing to leave a good situation to try it because he thought he could be successful. Sometimes, those risks don’t pay off as far as achieving success and that’s what we’re seeing with Fred.

 

[heitclone]

As bad as they are, they still get 15k fans every night. No one seems to care that they are losing

 

[bozclone]

Fred’s success at Iowa State was based on his ability to get highly talented players to come play at Iowa State. It wasn’t a program built on toughness or discipline. His success wasn’t based on X’s and O’s. It was the players. He hasn’t been able to duplicate that with the Bulls or Huskers. In my opinion, he picked wrong places to coach for his talents. He needed to go where talented kids would want to play. Some place like USC, Arizona, Texas, or UCLA.

 

[CycloneVet]

Iowa State has a legacy of winning basketball. A better comparison to Nebraska basketball is old Iowa State football and the time it took Campbell to build a program.

So 2 years?

 

[inCyteful]

By this I mean, I have to think that after this season is over, influential people at Nebraska are going to ask what took Hoiberg so long at Nebraska when Otzelberger could turn Iowa State around in less than one season.

Optimistic to think folks at kNebraska would ever ask a reasonable question.

 

[Cyched]

Seems like he thought he could walk into Nebraska and win with his formula from ISU. But the college game has changed and he hasn't adapted, which explains not just the failures, but the fact he's failing at such a spectacular level even for Nebraska.

I think his success at ISU helped us forget his lack of coaching experience. He ultimately won here not only because he tried something that was unique at the time, but he had a fairly intimate knowledge of ISU, what it takes to be successful here, get players here, get ISU fans engaged, and so on.

Now going to a couple places where he doesn't have the same history and equity, and his lack of experience is catching up to him.

I'm a little disappointed we couldn't see how much more success he could bring ISU. But I also look at his recent failures, and part of me is glad he was able to leave his ISU legacy intact. He'll only be remembered here for the good things he did as a player and then coach.

 

[cyIclSoneU]

It only takes one bad game to get bounced from the NCAA Tournament. Even Duke loses early at times. IMO, making it to the Sweet 16 is an incredible accomplishment for ANY Basketball Team and making it past the Sweet 16 is so super hard no matter what name is on the jersey. There is a long line of GREAT teams to get bounced without making it to the Elite 8 or beyond. So, not making it past the Sweet 16 is not something that concerns me as a fan. When it happens (like 2000), it's fantastic (I was at the UCLA game @ Auburn Hills!), but it was only a one game difference than the other Sweet 16 teams in ISU history. I'm not that spoiled.

Taking a look at both of these guys' March performance:

Fred:
2011-12: 8 seed, beat the 9, lost to the 1. Chalk.

2012-13: 10 seed, beat the 7, lost to the 2. Overachieved, almost by a lot but for Aaron Craft.

2013-14: 3 seed, beat the 14 and the 6, lost to the 7 in Sweet 16. Think you gotta call this one chalk considering Niang injury and that the 7 seed ended up winning the natty.

2014-15: 3 seed, lost to the 14. Huge underachievement.

Prohm:
2015-16: 4 seed, beat the 13 and the 12, lost to the 1. Chalk.

2016-17: 5 seed, beat the 12, lost to the 4. Chalk.

2018-19: 6 seed, lost to the 11. Underachievement.

It's mostly what you would have expected based on seed. 2015 obviously sticks out like a sore thumb. 2019 was in hindsight the beginning of the end for Prohm as well. The only team that outplayed its seed at all was in 2013 and that team was inches away from a Sweet 16 as a 10 seed.

 

[CycloneVet]

Do not under rate the value of the level of play of a true freshman point guard. Otz, along with everybody else, had no way of predicting how seamless the transition from HS to the best conference in D1 level of play that Hunter has exhibited. IMO, it compares to walk-on Jeff Hornacek under Orr who could distribute, score & went on to a long successful NBA career. Hunter was a top rated recruit compared to JH. Morris was also a top rated recruit. I could care less about Fred, Nebraska and their mutual struggles but basketball is all about having a premier point guard. Our good ISU teams had and currently has one, Nebraska doesn’t.

It also helps to have 3 plus ball handlers on the floor at once. How many times have you seen teams have trouble with Iowas press? How many times did we? A couple yes but nothing major.

 

[mynameisjonas]

 

[salennon07]

I loved Fred and was honestly as bummed as I've ever been about what I thought our potential was that he was leaving when moving to the NBA. But with his post ISU coaching life thus far, and seeing what otz is doing I'm really wondering if we were way too high on what Fred really was capable of.

It's really hard to not watch isu play this year and think how much of Fred's success was really Fred vs otz as his right hand man.

However at the same point I also feel Green is an absolute critical piece of this year's success.. But I'm going to give otz that credit if landing him on the staff

 

[deadeyededric]

Can we all just admit that Fred isn't a very good x's and o's basketball coach?

He was a great recruiter, but actually underperformed at ISU with all the talent he had. In the NBA, every team is loaded with talent, so the coaching is all that matters.... which is why he got the results he did. And at Nebby, he just hasn't gotten as lucky with his recruiting yet... and if he doesn't have talent.... he's screwed.

Love Hoiberg for everything he's done for ISU.... but he's is SO overrated as a basketball coach. His philosophy is to shoot 3's and not care much about defense.... always has been. If the shots fall, you win.... if not.... you're screwed.

He doesn't seem to have much of a problem winning as long as he has good players.

 

[CYEATHAWK]

This is probably not a popular opinion but when I look back on the talent that Hoiberg and Prohm had, they completely underachieved. I know people love Fred for elevating the program but some of those teams had 5 NBA guys on it and couldn’t get past the Sweet 16.

Is it possible that Fred "overachieved" while at ISU.

 

[Blandboy]

Maybe Otz can find an assistant position for Hoiberg on his staff

won't happen; Fred doesn't like to recruit

 

[FallOf81]

I believe this is last season for Ames High coach. And they move into new school and amazing new basketball arena. What timing for Fred!

 

[Blandboy]

Two things can be true:

- Fred resurrected Cyclone basketball and Hilton Magic and gave us some incredible memories.
- In the end, given the talent he recruited, Fred underachieved at ISU.

I’m grateful to him for what he did for our program and don’t like to see him struggling so much, but the adage about the grass not always being greener seems to apply here. When he’s fired from Nebraska it will be interesting to see where he goes. Fred’s a guy who obviously believes in himself and isn’t afraid to take risks. His dream of coaching an NBA franchise might not be something most Cyclone fans understand, but he was willing to leave a good situation to try it because he thought he could be successful. Sometimes, those risks don’t pay off as far as achieving success and that’s what we’re seeing with Fred.

The UAB loss was the worst.