It would be pretty hard to hold TH accountable when he has already accepted another job. PR lets his coordinators do their job. Based on TH's comments it was pretty obvious he was not giving 100% of himself to preparing ISU for the Rutgers game.
MESS named OC
- Thread starter Mycology
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It would be pretty hard to hold TH accountable when he has already accepted another job. PR lets his coordinators do their job. Based on TH's comments it was pretty obvious he was not giving 100% of himself to preparing ISU for the Rutgers game.
I hate to say it, but I'm nervous. If this turns out great, feel free to quote this post and say I was just being a negative nancy.
Iowa State absolutely NEEDS to have improvement on offense the next few years. We have been scratching and clawing just to get 6 wins and we can't count on a huge upset every year. Yes, we have had a big win every year so far, but teams will start to figure us out. Noone is giong to overlook ISU anymore so we have to bring it and beat them head to head.
This hire will have a huge effect on the future of ISU football. CPR is not an offensive guy, so his OC HAS to know exactly what to do with the offense. On top of that, a school like ISU needs to have a really good gameplan/scheme, because we aren't going to "out talent" a lot of teams on our schedule.
If the offense get worse over the next few years ISU and CPR are screwed. We finally have some forward momentum as a program and setbacks are really going to hurt that.
I'm also worried about the QBs. We have a solid group of young QBs coming up in JB, Richardson, and Rohach. I would be much more comfortable with them having a QB coach who has successfully developed FBS talent.
Messingham seems like a good guy and a very good coach. He has held a lot of different positions in his career, but almost all of those were at a much lower level.
I trust CPR, don't get me wrong. I think he has a vision of where he wants to take the ISU program. He obviously has a lot of trust in Messingham and it's obvious that he gets allong with Mess WAY better than he got along with Herman. This just seems like a situation where CPR decided to value stability over actual coaching success and it's scary. It also makes me think that CPR took a shot at a couple coaches and was rejected. If Messingham was going to be the guy all along, why wait till now? Why not have him Co-OC with Herman for the bowl game?
A lot of people seem like they are happy that Messingham has Iowa roots. That's nice and all, but I don't personally subscribe to having to have most of our coaches be Iowa boys. The state of Iowa is NOT a good high school football state. It never has been and never will be. I think it is way more important to bring in coaches with connections to the football hotbeds like TX, , FL, CA... Look how much more exposure and success we are having in FL with the Burnham boys leading the way. I hope our new WR coach has some TX ties.
Others have touted that they like the fact that Messingham will be more likely to stick around. Personally, I would rather have someone who is so good that other schools want them. Upward mobility is usually a huge motivator for assistant coaches. We should want guys who's goals are to get a better job and get a promotion. Not guys who are content to just be the OC at ISU regardless. A lot of really good programs were built with assistant coaches that moved on. The key is to have them accomplish enough while they are here that the next hire is event better. Then finally, they end up staying at your program because it is the best job available, not because they have Iowa roots and just don't want to leave.
There's just a LOT riding on the shoulders of someone who's highest coaching achievements are coaching one really good TE with NFL talent and having the WRs show some improvement in his first year coaching them.
I don't know. I really hope this works out and hopefully Messingham is that perfect fit as an OC that CPR was as HC. We will certainly find out soon.
Iowa State absolutely NEEDS to have improvement on offense the next few years. We have been scratching and clawing just to get 6 wins and we can't count on a huge upset every year. Yes, we have had a big win every year so far, but teams will start to figure us out. Noone is giong to overlook ISU anymore so we have to bring it and beat them head to head.
This hire will have a huge effect on the future of ISU football. CPR is not an offensive guy, so his OC HAS to know exactly what to do with the offense. On top of that, a school like ISU needs to have a really good gameplan/scheme, because we aren't going to "out talent" a lot of teams on our schedule.
If the offense get worse over the next few years ISU and CPR are screwed. We finally have some forward momentum as a program and setbacks are really going to hurt that.
I'm also worried about the QBs. We have a solid group of young QBs coming up in JB, Richardson, and Rohach. I would be much more comfortable with them having a QB coach who has successfully developed FBS talent.
Messingham seems like a good guy and a very good coach. He has held a lot of different positions in his career, but almost all of those were at a much lower level.
I trust CPR, don't get me wrong. I think he has a vision of where he wants to take the ISU program. He obviously has a lot of trust in Messingham and it's obvious that he gets allong with Mess WAY better than he got along with Herman. This just seems like a situation where CPR decided to value stability over actual coaching success and it's scary. It also makes me think that CPR took a shot at a couple coaches and was rejected. If Messingham was going to be the guy all along, why wait till now? Why not have him Co-OC with Herman for the bowl game?
A lot of people seem like they are happy that Messingham has Iowa roots. That's nice and all, but I don't personally subscribe to having to have most of our coaches be Iowa boys. The state of Iowa is NOT a good high school football state. It never has been and never will be. I think it is way more important to bring in coaches with connections to the football hotbeds like TX, , FL, CA... Look how much more exposure and success we are having in FL with the Burnham boys leading the way. I hope our new WR coach has some TX ties.
Others have touted that they like the fact that Messingham will be more likely to stick around. Personally, I would rather have someone who is so good that other schools want them. Upward mobility is usually a huge motivator for assistant coaches. We should want guys who's goals are to get a better job and get a promotion. Not guys who are content to just be the OC at ISU regardless. A lot of really good programs were built with assistant coaches that moved on. The key is to have them accomplish enough while they are here that the next hire is event better. Then finally, they end up staying at your program because it is the best job available, not because they have Iowa roots and just don't want to leave.
There's just a LOT riding on the shoulders of someone who's highest coaching achievements are coaching one really good TE with NFL talent and having the WRs show some improvement in his first year coaching them.
I don't know. I really hope this works out and hopefully Messingham is that perfect fit as an OC that CPR was as HC. We will certainly find out soon.
- Mar 27, 2006
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I'm sure he would defend himself, but I think he's still on timeout. Maybe one of the alter egos he's created in the last couple weeks will respond?
Have to kind of disagree...consistency isn't always a good thing, especially if the offense is going to be as "consistent" as it was...which wasn't very good...
I would say progress is more important...
I really hope Messingham brings some creativity...I was hoping Rhoads was going to bring someone in who would bring some new route packages to the offense...watching the bowl games there are some teams that run some pretty creative passing routes and get their WRs open in space...ISU doesn't seem to do that, at least not "consistently"...
Was also hoping for someone with a proven track record as an OC...and 1 year at an FCS school as an OC doesn't scream proven track record to me...granted he seems to have had success as a postion coach but that's a whole different animal...
Not real excited about this...hopefully Rhoads chose him because he has a gunslinger mentality (like Rhoads has) and has an innovative mind when it comes to offense...
PR has demonstrated his willingness to take risk without being reckless. Take a deep breath, and trust his leadership.
Hey Austen, can you give any insight as to why Rhoads didn't let Mess OC the bowl game? Seems like it might've been a good idea to get Mess' feet wet and to get a jumpstart on next year...plus, Herman was obviously a little distracted...
Or was it too late in the bowl prep to make a change like that?
Just curious as to what you think...
And he also coached the Special Teams. Courtney Messingham has done a great job at whatever he has been given. IMO, it is a great hire. What kind of message do you send when you refuse to promote good coaches who have done a good job?
Refusal to promote coaches gives our assistants the idea that they will NEVER be given a chance here at ISU. That someone from the outside will continually be brought in. Because if you are an ISU assistant coach, then you are not good enough. Otherwise why would you be here.
In many people's minds it is better to bring in someone from a Name School who has limited experience and give them an opportunity. I disagree. If we have talented assistants that CPR feels can do the job, then give them an opportunity. How would you feel if you worked at a job that continually would not promote from within when better opportunities within the company were open?
At a company like that, I would be looking to leave. Knowing that I would NEVER be promoted to a higher position than what I was currently in. Because someone from the outside would always be brought in.
Good hire...I'm happy with it. Messingham is an Iowa guy like CPR. We will have stability with him at the OC job and he won't go running away to another team.
He's a great coach and has the same values as CPR.
He's a great coach and has the same values as CPR.
Yeah, sorry for the rant. That ended up a lot longer post than intended.
I am just very anxious about this. Obviously.
The best case scenario is that Mess can take the best parts of our current offense, add some now wrinkles, and maybe bring some energy.
Other have stated it before, but the thing ISU needs most on offense is a real identity. We need to have a definite style and execute more consistently. Under Herman we looked like a different team week in and week out at times.
I hope Mess can do it.
Stability and consistancy are not words that really get me excited with a unit that has been pretty bad for three years.
No reason to think he can't. Look at our Special Teams. I thought they did great this year. Under the direction of Coach Messingham.
Unless it was the playcalling and not the system. I would like to think it was playcalling and now we will find out.
Knowing Herm, it was something he wanted to finish and IMO Coach Rhoads knew that the best chance for this team to win the game was to have Herm in the booth for this one. I know it would be distracting to be employed by two universities at once, however if there is anyone who can handle that on his plate it is TH. I don't believe there was any hesitation to letting Herm coach his last game as a Cyclone.
Anyone know how this might affect the QB battle for next year? I know Mess was a WR coach, but since AA said he was a guy that did spend some time with the QBs, does anyone know who he favors?
I know I am probably getting ahead of myself here and the earliest decision would probably not come until after the spring game. It still would be interesting to know if he favors one more at this point.
I know I am probably getting ahead of myself here and the earliest decision would probably not come until after the spring game. It still would be interesting to know if he favors one more at this point.
Great move. You build staff loyalty as well as get a guy who was really the star of the offensive staff as the OC. Mess is a great football mind who will build on the concepts in place, giving continuity, but add his own flavor. From what I know of Mess, I expect him to develop into a very smart, strategic play caller for ISU as well.
I really hope he doesn't pick favorites...I hope he picks whoever is the most accurate and makes the best decisions...
This offense needs an accurate QB and both JB and SJ need to improve greatly in that area...
I guess I took that to mean the actual plays would be similar but I could be wrong
