Thought about the series ending

[cyeah]

Listening to KXNO for a bit the other morning they were talking about the series ending and how that would hurt ISU's central Iowa "market share" with Nebraska going to the Big 10/11/12. Deace's point was without the yearly big game a portion of casual fans in central Iowa would start to follow Nebby instead of ISU.

I think he has it backwards. I think if the series ends, Nebraska picks up "share" from Iowa with the move. My reasoning is, there are a ton of "tavern hawks" with no real attachment to Iowa. There are not a lot of "tavern cyclones" to be a cyclone in you have to be one for a reason.

I think overtime with or without the ISU/Iowa game Iowa loses some of those tavern hawks to tavern huskers. Nebraska will have success in the Big 10 and they will consistently beat Iowa. They will likely beat Iowa about 60-70% of the time. They are a better program with a much deeper tradition and a much, much larger national recruiting base.

I think over the years that will result in tavern hawks becoming tavern huskers.

Thoughts?

 

[driegner]

Agreed to an extent. Most Cyclones are for a reason, I agree.

However, not playing the Cy-Hawk game will not be good for ISU. Ideally, we WOULD have "Tavern clones," or at least casual Cyclone fans, and playing Iowa is a good way to make that happen.

 

[cycloneG]

I think not playing the game will result in more tavern clawks. They'll cheer for both and not be forced to pick just one.

 

[CyDude16]

It wont end.

 

[Senolcyc]

Deace has no frame of reference. Take it from one of the oldest codgers who posts here: central Iowa was AT LEAST 80/20 Cyclone fans in the 70s before ISU and Iowa started playing again. It's about winning and losing, plain and simple. You couldn't find an Iowa fan in Des Moines in 1975 without an exhaustive search. I know, I was there. Deace was a fat little kid in Michigan.

 

[benjay]

I've decided deace has his head up his butt, just as a general rule. Why you guys keep listening to the radio clowns endlessly manufacture drama is beyond me.

 

[B.L.]

Deace has no frame of reference. Take it from one of the oldest codgers who posts here: central Iowa was AT LEAST 80/20 Cyclone fans in the 70s before ISU and Iowa started playing again. It's about winning and losing, plain and simple. You couldn't find an Iowa fan in Des Moines in 1975 without an exhaustive search. I know, I was there. Deace was a fat little kid in Michigan.

Another oldster here I can remember Jim Zabel trying to say something good on the Bob Cummings show, it was really sad. People forget IOWA had 19 losing seasons in a row before Hayden got here. Thats the Hawk fans who really get it the ones who were there those 19. One of my good friends went there in the 70s went to the games said they would cheer like hell when the team got a first down. Cheered so hard he broke his pint of booze. Go Clones

 

[CycloneJames]

Deace has no frame of reference. Take it from one of the oldest codgers who posts here: central Iowa was AT LEAST 80/20 Cyclone fans in the 70s before ISU and Iowa started playing again. It's about winning and losing, plain and simple. You couldn't find an Iowa fan in Des Moines in 1975 without an exhaustive search. I know, I was there. Deace was a fat little kid in Michigan.

This is exactly right. The reason there are so many more Iowa fans than Iowa State is because we could beat anyone for 20+ years. If the roles were reversed and Iowa State had that 15 year winning streak and overall football success, then ISU would be the much bigger brand.

All Iowa State needs to worry about is the Big 12. If they can start winning more and more Big 12 games, and go to better and better bowl games, the fans will come. If they cancelled the series and then ISU became a perenial top 3 Big 12 team, everyone would be dying to see the Iowa-ISU game again.

By the way, insiders told me that all of this will happen...and it will be awesome.
Seneca Wallace

 

[Klonz]

I doubt the series will end, but I could see Iowa putting some ultimatum(s) on the table that makes it more on their terms. Such as - having to play in IC more often, game moves to a different time of the season, play less often (every other year).

A big factor is if the little eleven twelve whatever they are - expands to 16 teams - that could potentially put a lot more pressure on playing more conference games.

Lots of scenarios that might happen - overall I like the series. It isn't my superbowl or the #1 game on the the schedule - I'd rather win a conference game over the Iowa game. Don't get me wrong, I LOVE to beat Iowa, it just isn't the end of the season/world if we don't.

Go Clones!

 

[VeloClone]

Deace has no frame of reference. Take it from one of the oldest codgers who posts here: central Iowa was AT LEAST 80/20 Cyclone fans in the 70s before ISU and Iowa started playing again. It's about winning and losing, plain and simple. You couldn't find an Iowa fan in Des Moines in 1975 without an exhaustive search. I know, I was there. Deace was a fat little kid in Michigan.

:laugh:I was going to give +1000 for this, but as it is definitely not PC to point out his weakness for food, you are going to have to settle for a...

+1

 

[CarolinaCy]

Deace couldn't be more wrong on this, for a couple of reasons.

1) As many have pointed out, there aren't that many "casual fans" of ISU. That's why we have mini-packs and night games and other promo stuff going on, to attract casual fans. Can't be hurt by losing something you don't have.

2) Playing (and beating) Iowa does absolutely nothing for ISU's football program. We've proven that over the past 12 years. What has our 7-5 record against Iowa gotten us? More national recognition? Hardly. More casual fans? Maybe, but we've also won more games in general in that time period, so it's hard to say. Better in-state recruits? Not really.

There is only one thing that benefits the ISU football program. WINNING. We need to win more games. Period. If we drop the Iowa series, but we start winning 8 games every year, are in the conversation regarding the Big 12 race, and go to some good bowl games, we'll get more recognition, more fans, and better recruits. Iowa has nothing to do with any of those things.

 

[3GenClone]

Listening to KXNO for a bit the other morning they were talking about the series ending and how that would hurt ISU's central Iowa "market share" with Nebraska going to the Big 10/11/12. Deace's point was without the yearly big game a portion of casual fans in central Iowa would start to follow Nebby instead of ISU.

I think he has it backwards. I think if the series ends, Nebraska picks up "share" from Iowa with the move. My reasoning is, there are a ton of "tavern hawks" with no real attachment to Iowa. There are not a lot of "tavern cyclones" to be a cyclone in you have to be one for a reason.

I think overtime with or without the ISU/Iowa game Iowa loses some of those tavern hawks to tavern huskers. Nebraska will have success in the Big 10 and they will consistently beat Iowa. They will likely beat Iowa about 60-70% of the time. They are a better program with a much deeper tradition and a much, much larger national recruiting base.

I think over the years that will result in tavern hawks becoming tavern huskers.

Thoughts?

I agree with you, and I think Iowa actually has a lot more to lose than ISU. Nebraska has the same "humble, mid-western tradition" that a lot of Hawkeye/Iowa State fans have, but Nebraska also brings a program with a history of winning Championships. I think there is a good portion of Hawkeyes (mostly in the Western part of the State) that chose Iowa as their "in-state school" and Nebraska as their Big 12 school - now that Nebraska is a member of the Big 10, prepare to see a small, but distinguishable number of Hawkeye fans become Husker fans. Now, Deace saying that Iowa State would lose media coverage is just crazy. ISU is still (for now) a BCS school and is the closest to the metro, so media coverage will not decrease.

 

[VeloClone]

I doubt the series will end, but I could see Iowa putting some ultimatum(s) on the table that makes it more on their terms. Such as - having to play in IC more often, game moves to a different time of the season, play less often (every other year).

A big factor is if the little eleven twelve whatever they are - expands to 16 teams - that could potentially put a lot more pressure on playing more conference games.

Lots of scenarios that might happen - overall I like the series. It isn't my superbowl or the #1 game on the the schedule - I'd rather win a conference game over the Iowa game. Don't get me wrong, I LOVE to beat Iowa, it just isn't the end of the season/world if we don't.

Go Clones!

I think the rivalry game should stay, but I would rather see it go away than give in to that ****. 35 games played in IC to 23 in Ames is ridiculous enough as it is without having the series become more lopsided.

Just because ISU holds its ground against that crap doesn't mean that the game goes away for good; it could go on haitus until calmer heads prevail.

 

[LoewDog]

Well said CarolinaCy!

Also, I understand the thought that these Tavern Hawks are obnoxious...I'd say bash any kind of obnoxious fan. I do not understand what is so bad about cheering for a school if you did not go there.

I asked in a different thread but got no answer...in cyclone nation is their a caste system where you take your Tavern Clones and treat them like they are lesser fans? Or is their application to cyclone nation rejected unless they can provide a copy of an isu diploma?

I mean a fan is a fan.

(LoewDog...UI class of '95)

 

[edr247]

I doubt the series will end, but I could see Iowa putting some ultimatum(s) on the table that makes it more on their terms. Such as - having to play in IC more often, game moves to a different time of the season, play less often (every other year).

A big factor is if the little eleven twelve whatever they are - expands to 16 teams - that could potentially put a lot more pressure on playing more conference games.

Lots of scenarios that might happen - overall I like the series. It isn't my superbowl or the #1 game on the the schedule - I'd rather win a conference game over the Iowa game. Don't get me wrong, I LOVE to beat Iowa, it just isn't the end of the season/world if we don't.

Go Clones!

I don't know if Iowa would make ISU play at Kinnick each year, but I think it would require planning beyond just the two schools, to work out schedules so that each will have a respectable number of home games per year.

 

[synapticwave]

The series will almost certainly continue. The current administrations are all on public record saying they want to keep it, so in the short term (next ~8 years) the series will likely continue, and after that, we'll have 4, 16 team conferences with the top 2 or maybe 4 teams in each conference going to a tourney so out of conference games will have very little post-season impact. Out of conference games will only impact the bowls that we all consider minor bowl games currently and will be even more minor after the post-season tourney starts. So there'll be no post-season repercussions to playing the ISU-Iowa game once that transpires, only in-state bragging rights will be on the line.

 

[Redhawk94]

2) Playing (and beating) Iowa does absolutely nothing for ISU's football program. We've proven that over the past 12 years. What has our 7-5 record against Iowa gotten us? More national recognition? Hardly. More casual fans? Maybe, but we've also won more games in general in that time period, so it's hard to say. Better in-state recruits? Not really.

There is only one thing that benefits the ISU football program. WINNING. We need to win more games. Period. If we drop the Iowa series, but we start winning 8 games every year, are in the conversation regarding the Big 12 race, and go to some good bowl games, we'll get more recognition, more fans, and better recruits. Iowa has nothing to do with any of those things.

As a Hawkeye fan, I agree 100%.

 

[IowaSTATCyclone]

Dump Iowa and we'll pick up Minnesota or Nebraska instead. Minnesota is desperate for us, and Nebby likes the Ames game for a lot of reasons.

Having said that, the series isn't going anywhere because of two words:

Hy.
Vee.

Do you think there's a Cy-Hawk Challenge (all sports) without a Cy-Hawk Trophy (football)?

Follow the money. It is a winnable, lucrative game for both teams, with no reliable replacement, especially for Iowa. - At least ISU has two neighborly out-of-conference teams to work with: Minne and Nebby. Remember how well that series with Mizzou worked out for Iowa?

Yeah. Neither do they.

Deace is a Michigan State student who used to get paid by Iowa State to root for Michigan. He may understand the game (and he does) but he doesn't understand fandom.

 

[LoewDog]

I may have missed it, but don't think I have seen a clone fan that understands how the Big Ten could force the issue...like it or not.

It takes seven home games to sustain the budget.

In a nine game conference schedule with five Big Ten home games...we could play ISU at the jack and two cream puffs at home. With a four Big Ten home game schedule, we would need all three non-conference games to be at home.

If the Big Ten would give us a consistent rotation of 4...5...4...5...we could probably make the home/home rivalry with the clones work. The problem is that that will not happen. We may go something like 5...4...4...5, in which case in that third year the AD would lose the revenue of a whole game. Cannot do that.

So to keep the rivalry going the game would have to potentially be played in IC more than ames, or isu would have to be flexible with the Big Ten schedule.

Neither of those is fair to ask of isu, so the decision comes down to ending the rivalry.

* I could be way off base but that is the way I understand it.

 

[CycloneJames]

Well said CarolinaCy!

Also, I understand the thought that these Tavern Hawks are obnoxious...I'd say bash any kind of obnoxious fan. I do not understand what is so bad about cheering for a school if you did not go there.

I asked in a different thread but got no answer...in cyclone nation is their a caste system where you take your Tavern Clones and treat them like they are lesser fans? Or is their application to cyclone nation rejected unless they can provide a copy of an isu diploma?

I mean a fan is a fan.

(LoewDog...UI class of '95)

I think the reason it bothers Cyclone fans is because A: we don't have nearly as many, and B: they seem to be the most outrageous. Its one thing to be drinking the kool-aid, but when a non-informed idiot proclaims Iowa as the greatest thing on Earth, it gets a bit tiring.

Although it does seem like some fans (at least on here) do think that you need to graduate from the university in order to be a fan.