Michigan

[cyclone1209]

Sources: U-M staffer bought tickets at 11 schools

Suspended Michigan staffer Connor Stalions, who is at the center of the NCAA's sign-stealing probe, purchased tickets in his own name for more than 30 games over the past three years at 11 different Big Ten schools, multiple sources told ESPN.

www.espn.com

Seems like an organized operation.

Fake news - you don't even need to steal signs to know what plays Iowa is calling.

 

[cyfanatic13]

Basketball coaches watch the other team in person at tournaments, are they breaking the rules?

Besides not being the same thing at all, good point

 

[Cmonwhatarewedoinghereman]

From the reporting it sounds like any team with half a brain already knew their signs were stolen while playing Michigan for a couple drives

 

[isucy86]

ESPN is reporting that in addition to Big10 games, the staffer also bought tickets to games involving possible BCS Playoff opponents.

They also reported there is proof he bought tickets for 37 games. Tough to believe he could "break the code" with a limited sample set per school.

But how many different signaling systems are out there? Guys from the same coaching tree, system has to be simple for QB & other offensive players in no huddle offenses, etc.

With enough video, it may not be hard to reverse engineer what signals mean. X play using Y signs/signals combination. At a minimum know if a play is a run or pass.

IMO there is a big difference between illegal recruiting and doing something in game that gives a team a win/loss advantage.

This type of cheating deserves playoff/bowl suspension because maybe it discourages a recruit from going to Michigan. Suspending a coach for non-con games or a few scholarships is not a deterrent. No Playoff/Bowl would be a deterrent.

 

[Drew0311]

ESPN is reporting that in addition to Big10 games, the staffer also bought tickets to games involving possible BCS Playoff opponents.

They also reported there is proof he bought tickets for 37 games. Tough to believe he could "break the code" with a limited sample set per school.

But how many different signaling systems are out there? Guys from the same coaching tree, system has to be simple for QB & other offensive players in no huddle offenses, etc.

With enough video, it may not be hard to reverse engineer what signals mean. X play using Y signs/signals combination. At a minimum know if a play is a run or pass.

IMO there is a big difference between illegal recruiting and doing something in game that gives a team a win/loss advantage.

This type of cheating deserves playoff/bowl suspension because maybe it discourages a recruit from going to Michigan. Suspending a coach for non-con games or a few scholarships is not a deterrent. No Playoff/Bowl would be a deterrent.

I have been to SEC stadiums, Big Ten Stadiums, Big 12 stadiums. A lot of the stadiums this guy went to, tickets are very expensive. No way he is buying tickets to all these games without Michigan funding it. He is a low level guy. Not making much money. He is going to all these stadiums, Traveling to them, hotels, tickets, plane tickets. No way Michigan wasn't funding all of this.

 

[CoachHines3]

ESPN is reporting that in addition to Big10 games, the staffer also bought tickets to games involving possible BCS Playoff opponents.

They also reported there is proof he bought tickets for 37 games. Tough to believe he could "break the code" with a limited sample set per school.

But how many different signaling systems are out there? Guys from the same coaching tree, system has to be simple for QB & other offensive players in no huddle offenses, etc.

With enough video, it may not be hard to reverse engineer what signals mean. X play using Y signs/signals combination. At a minimum know if a play is a run or pass.

IMO there is a big difference between illegal recruiting and doing something in game that gives a team a win/loss advantage.

This type of cheating deserves playoff/bowl suspension because maybe it discourages a recruit from going to Michigan. Suspending a coach for non-con games or a few scholarships is not a deterrent. No Playoff/Bowl would be a deterrent.

still dont see how its cheating

teams know if its a pass/run based off of how they line up. these coaches watch enough film as it is to understand what is coming or could be coming just based off of how they linup, the motion involved, whose on the field.. etc..

ive seen it a million times where a team on offense will change the play and you can see the defense change their call too because they know whats coming.

this is all over blown, imo.

 

[FriendlySpartan]

I have been to SEC stadiums, Big Ten Stadiums, Big 12 stadiums. A lot of the stadiums this guy went to, tickets are very expensive. No way he is buying tickets to all these games without Michigan funding it. He is a low level guy. Not making much money. He is going to all these stadiums, Traveling to them, hotels, tickets, plane tickets. No way Michigan wasn't funding all of this.

He’s been going to almost all Michigan games for years before this, major super fan, not saying your wrong but this isn’t new behavior for this guy.

 

[Drew0311]

He’s been going to almost all Michigan games for years before this, major super fan, not saying your wrong but this isn’t new behavior for this guy.

But I am saying he is going to a whole bunch of out of town games. That aint cheap. Unless his parents are rich and paying for all the trips and tickets.

 

[cycloneman003]

I don't really get why a lot of folks are thinking this isn't a big deal? Like in many sports, stealing signs is part of the game and I totally get that. If you can interpret it on the fly in game or pick up on it watching tape, sure go for it. And whether it's "wrong" or not, this seems pretty cut and dried as being explictly against NCAA rules. All you have to do is look to the NFL and spygate for how serious leagues would/should take videotaping of opposing team signals and that was just in game.

Also, it's clearly a coordinated effort that had to be funded/directed from up top in that program. Misconception it seems like that some have is that this guy was flying around to these games. They've said he was buying all the tickets and transferring to several different people who were then recording games. Not only are tickets to these types of games expensive, they're particularly expensive in the areas noted (mid-field just high enough up for a good sideline few). Plus flights, hotels, lodging, etc. for people across the country. Not going to buy into the "he's just a super fan trying to help" BS.

Harbaugh will just bounce to the NFL problem and never come back to the NCAA which is fine for him. I'd think NCAA comes down pretty signifcantly though from a sporting integrity standpoint, especially with Michigan already having recent NCAA issues.

 

[3TrueFans]

He’s been going to almost all Michigan games for years before this, major super fan, not saying your wrong but this isn’t new behavior for this guy.

He's also a UGA, Bama, Tennessee, Clemson and SEC Championship super fan?

 

[FriendlySpartan]

He's also a UGA, Bama, Tennessee, Clemson and SEC Championship super fan?

Hahaha totally agree on that point but he wasn’t the one attending those games which makes it look worse, not better but it does mitigate the cost to the guy from travel. That comment was more directed to the guy saying this was Michigan funded. He wasn’t even a Michigan employee for several of these.

 

[Gorm]

 

[legi]

still dont see how its cheating

teams know if its a pass/run based off of how they line up. these coaches watch enough film as it is to understand what is coming or could be coming just based off of how they linup, the motion involved, whose on the field.. etc..

ive seen it a million times where a team on offense will change the play and you can see the defense change their call too because they know whats coming.

this is all over blown, imo.

So then why even go through all this trouble if teams already know everything from just watching film? It's pretty obvious they gain significant advantage otherwise there is no logical reason to do it.

 

[CoachHines3]

So then why even go through all this trouble if teams already know everything from just watching film? It's pretty obvious they gain significant advantage otherwise there is no logical reason to do it.

What is the obvious, significant gain? I don't think they made back to back playoffs because they had some dude attending other games, Im sorry.

Michigan is good. They aren't blowing out teams because they know what they're doing every single play.

I said, Michigan clearly has gone to greater lengths than other schools to get an advantage and I get that per the NCAA it's illegal to scout this way.

I still don't buy this narrative that it gave them this huge advantage.

 

[CydeofFries]

What is the obvious, significant gain? I don't think they made back to back playoffs because they had some dude attending other games, Im sorry.

Michigan is good. They aren't blowing out teams because they know what they're doing every single play.

I said, Michigan clearly has gone to greater lengths than other schools to get an advantage and I get that per the NCAA it's illegal to scout this way.

I still don't buy this narrative that it gave them this huge advantage.

I don't buy the narrative that it didn't give them an advantage, because other wise it's a convoluted and expensive waste of money for something you are alleging you can apparently do for free from broadcasts.

 

[FriendlySpartan]

I don't buy the narrative that it didn't give them an advantage, because other wise it's a convoluted and expensive waste of money for something you are alleging you can apparently do for free from broadcasts.

But Michigan isn’t spending the money on it (that we know of) it’s on this guy. The idea in Michigan circles is this guy wanted into the program and did this process in order to prove value. Now if he mentioned this ticket scheme to coaches or just said he studied tape and had an understanding of it is up for debate.

 

[CoachHines3]

I don't buy the narrative that it didn't give them an advantage, because other wise it's a convoluted and expensive waste of money for something you are alleging you can apparently do for free from broadcasts.

this guy was buying the tickets, not Michigan.

maybe it comes out that michigan was funneling the money to him, i don't know but as it stands this guy was doing it on his own, basically.

 

[ZRF]

I have been to SEC stadiums, Big Ten Stadiums, Big 12 stadiums. A lot of the stadiums this guy went to, tickets are very expensive. No way he is buying tickets to all these games without Michigan funding it. He is a low level guy. Not making much money. He is going to all these stadiums, Traveling to them, hotels, tickets, plane tickets. No way Michigan wasn't funding all of this.

I doubt that "Michigan" was funding it, or knowing they are funding it, but when these guys make millions (head coaches, asst, coaches, ADs, etc) it's pretty easy to hand the guy a wad of cash or create virtual card numbers, that he could then use (but not have to pay the card off on) to pay for the tickets. But yeah, in some way, shape, or form Michigan was funding it. Either in use of CC usage (discretionary spending), using a coach's card (virtual CCs), or paying him directly in some other manner.

 

[3TrueFans]

Cheating is fine as long as it's just low level employees doing it.

 

[ZRF]

this guy was buying the tickets, not Michigan.

maybe it comes out that michigan was funneling the money to him, i don't know but as it stands this guy was doing it on his own, basically.

When you look at his salary, look at the cost of the tickets, and (possibly) look at what those people were getting paid (maybe a great ticket to a Michigan game was enough to get them to go and take/send video) there is no ******* way this tool was doing this all on his own. Like I said above, either Michigan funded directly or indirectly (via insane coaching salaries) the operation.