Time to Start Wigg
- Thread starter Psiclone
- Start date
You may want to actually check the stats before making some of these claims:
Assists/Turnovers:
LW: 25/14 = 1.79
NWB: 76/27 = 2.81
Haliburton: 77/14 = 5.5
THT: 53/28 = 1.89
Shayok: 36/54 = 0.66
Other than Shayok he is no better than anyone else starting and I do realize it's a small sample size but last year when he was the volume shooter like Shayok is this year he was 88/92. You can look past Shayok's because he/s averaging nearly 20 ppg while shooting .507 FG% .861% FT%, .391 3pt% while also hauling in 5.3rpg (2nd on the team) and 1.0 spg which is 4th best and the top 3 in that stat just happen to be the other 3 guards starting right now.
The numbers don't lie right now. I'm not trying to bag on Wiggy, I want him to succeed and play like we know he can but your analysis and defense of his play just don't hold water at the moment both statistically and watching the games he's played in. The one thing he was really good at last year was 3pt% and he's barely about THT there right now .319 to .292. Hopefully as he gets more comfortable with his role he shoots it closer to the 40% he did last year but when his shot is not falling he's got to contribute in other areas too because the 4 guys starting ahead of him right now all are able to do things besides score when their shot is not falling on a given night - especially on the defensive end of the floor.
I think they were in terms of expectations for this year. He scored a bunch of points on a lot of shots. Huge usage with a small amount of that coming via assists and a high amount of TOs. PER will also reward high volume shooters. That's been a consistent critique of the stat.
Have any fans said that? There's a big difference between saying he hasn't earned his starting spot and maybe shouldn't be playing 35 minutes a game and saying that he shouldn't play ever.
You're not using the right stats. He's using possession usage percentages. You're using stuff that doesn't matter.
Even if Halliburton was not in the right position, LW still threw a pass straight out of bounds.
Oh yeah, I think some thought he was going to be an all american type player this year when that wasn't likely. I think 1) he would probably be playing better without the injury setback but 2) a lot of kids struggle the most with improving from Freshman to Sophomore because the teams have tape on you now and can take away what you do best unless you really improve the flaws in your game which it usually takes more than one off season to fix and 3) this team just has far more talent and scoring options to expect him to be a huge scorer every night out.
Please enlighten us all on what stats "matter" then. You can spin the PER stats and whatever other formulas how you want but it still doesn't make his shooting inefficiencies and other areas he isn't performing as well in look any better nor what we are actually seeing of him when he is on the floor too.
Go checkout the Facebook pages, there are literally people posting who would rather see him not play at all.
I agree with most of your post and think LW will get better with more time. But the above comment had me scratching my head. He is much better than Shayok, but not sure about your comparison with NWB. CSP talked about how he is trying to drive this point home for Shayok.
Shayok - 36 assists, 54 turnovers. = -.67 ATO
Wiggonton - 25 assists, 14 turnovers = 1.79 ATO
Weiler-Babb - 76 assists, 27 turnovers = 2.82 ATO
While I was at it I looked at the other guards' ATOs.
Haliburton - 77 assists, 14 turnovers = 5.5 ATO. (Crazy that he plays the most minutes and has the least turnovers and the most assists as a true freshman)
Horton-Tucker - 53 assists, 18 turnovers = 2.94 ATO.
I think most of us feel NWB, MS and TH are no-brainers to start and get the most minutes. MJ has to play the most until Cam or George can play effectively, so there are four major contributors/starters. The question is who do you play more THT, or LW?
I compared LW and THT as they seem to replace each other the most:
LW - THT
FG% .345 - .388
3PT% .319 - .292
FT% .697 - .650
Scoring 10.9 - 11.9
Rebound 4.3 - 5.3
Steals .89 - 1.32
Blocks .22 - .68
Of course THT has the benefit of inflated numbers from non-con, but this is not as easy as many of us like to make it. Personally I think that you ride either one of these guys that are hot, but they both need a lot of minutes for us to be good down the stretch. My hope is that we can see Lewis, Talley, and even Zion getting a few minutes so they are ready for injuries or slumps, but that's not easy to do when you are battling in the Big XII.
I avoid that cess pool like the plague. There are enough idiots on here.
Every fan base has its stupid fringe element, starting vs coming off the bench is a reasonable debate. Saying never playing another game for ISU, is just ignorant fans well being ignorant.
I knew this was coming. People think that there is all this time to look and make sure someone is standing still and then throw it. That's not how that sequence works. That sequence works very quickly and people are expected to be in certain spots. Haliburton has to get his head to the him meaning he gets to where that ball is thrown. That's coached in low level high school ball.
TO% and Assist % are not related to A/T ratio. They measure how often a player does those things not how many of those things a player does. So, A/T is useful but it doesn't always tell the story. For instance, lets say I want to set the record for assists and I'm a good passer. Well, if that's my goal, it's likely I'm going to assist at a higher rate but I'm also going to take chances and have a higher turnover rate. So, we can use the Kenpom % numbers to measure each individual area. We are seeing kind of what we want to see in those areas from Lindell.
The problem is that in your defense of LW you are focusing on 1 or 2 stats and essentially ignoring all the other efficiencies in his game at the moment. What's his PERs in other areas - specifically the ones related to scoring which is supposed to be his biggest strength compared to the rest of the team? Wonder if Stansbury is able to pull some of this stuff with whatever program it is that CW mentioned he has access to and give us some breakdown for this discussion.
If you want to do a per 40 comparison here is a site I cam across: https://www.sports-reference.com/cbb/schools/iowa-state/2019.html#all_per_game
Of the starters only Shayok has a higher turnovers per 40 than LW right now, and he's only a half assist better than THT on assists too so that kind of shoots a hole in some of your argument. If you want to see a real interesting stat on that site check out the Advanced section and sort by Win Shares per 40 and Lard actually leads the team (not counting Steyer since he doesn't play) at .256. Been some heated discussion on Lard's impact when he is in the game and there is some ammo right there for those who have been wanting to see him play more. LW is way down the list and only has a higher WS/40 than Lewis, Griffin, Boothe, and Schuster. They do have a box +/- stat on that site, LW ranks 10th right now in Big 12 play, even sorting it by offensive and defensive you can't make much of a case either. He's slightly better than THT there but THT is significantly better when you sort by defensive. There is break down by conference stats too that maybe is a better way to break it down but even Win Share there LW is only beating out THT and Lewis in that metric.
FYI. He is just pointing you to some more useful numbers he wasn't defending Wigginton's poor shooting and efficiency in scoring.
