Team analysis/observations after Hilton Madness

[brokenloginagain]

I think we struggle this year, but I'm ok with that. DJ will need to be hot if we want to beat good teams.

Given our recruiting class + two really good transfers, the future looks good, so I have zero concerns longer term.

 

[TomTreebow]

What I want to see:

DJ
Lindell
Talley
Lard
Young


What I think it'll be:
DJ
Lindell
Babb
Talley
Young

I like the first lineup and think it would be a great sign if Lard were good enough to start but that lineup would really lack outside shooters and teams would really pack it in. On the other hand it would be the best defensive and rebounding team we've put on the floor in a decade.....at least as well as I can remember.

 

[Frak]

As long as Wigginton doesn't go pro (and I think that he would really need to develop his outside shot to do that), 2018 looks like a really good year. I expect this season to go about like Hoiberg's first. They'll be in some games, maybe pull out a few at Hilton, hopefully be a bubble team by the end of the season. But next year, they get Shayock and Jacobson and add four (probably) really good FR. They're going to be tough. And they have a tourney site in DSM.

It's great that Prohm has figured out that you can get really good players in the Midwest and not have to pull them out of the South. ISU has everything to offer over most of those SEC schools, but those kids do not want to leave home.

 

[Thompsonclone]

I like the first lineup and think it would be a great sign if Lard were good enough to start but that lineup would really lack outside shooters and teams would really pack it in. On the other hand it would be the best defensive and rebounding team we've put on the floor in a decade.....at least as well as I can remember.

I think the outside shooting could be a problem with whatever starting lineup we go with. Babb isn't that big of a threat, Brase/Beverly are probably just okay from 3. Only person who could improve it is Terrence Lewis.

 

[Gunnerclone]

What I want to see:

DJ
Lindell
Talley
Lard
Young


What I think it'll be:
DJ
Lindell
Babb
Talley
Young

Not enough ball handling ability in that lineup.

 

[FinalFourCy]

I think we struggle this year, but I'm ok with that. DJ will need to be hot if we want to beat good teams.

Given our recruiting class + two really good transfers, the future looks good, so I have zero concerns longer term.

Agree. The spring didn't go as needed in terms of making it likely that the streak continues, but we should rebound quickly. However, if Prohm channels his inner Floyd, perhaps we can surprise and get there this year via defense and rebounding. It's been a long time since we've had this good of potential on those ends.

 

[Dandy]

"_______ looks good but needs to add muscle in order to contribute" is such an over-used and unnecessary attribute in basketball. Have you guys watched Kevin Durant? I don't think he could even bench 100 lbs. Steph Curry isn't exactly jacked either. These guys don't need to look like Russell Westbrook or LeBron James to contribute in college basketball.

 

[srjclone]

"_______ looks good but needs to add muscle in order to contribute" is such an over-used and unnecessary attribute in basketball. Have you guys watched Kevin Durant? I don't think he could even bench 100 lbs. Steph Curry isn't exactly jacked either. These guys don't need to look like Russell Westbrook or LeBron James to contribute in college basketball.

Okay, but there has never been anyone like Kevin Durant or Steph Curry before them. Saying they are comparable to HSers without muscle, is like saying, they can be Michael Jordan because they didn't make varsity their freshman year.

 

[FinalFourCy]

"_______ looks good but needs to add muscle in order to contribute" is such an over-used and unnecessary attribute in basketball. Have you guys watched Kevin Durant? I don't think he could even bench 100 lbs. Steph Curry isn't exactly jacked either. These guys don't need to look like Russell Westbrook or LeBron James to contribute in college basketball.

Yes, there are multiple ways to be good. But I think the default assumption is the said player doesn't have historically elite skill, so what works for Curry or Durant isn't a great model to replicate.

Lewis isn't that small though, so if he has the skill to be ready for the Big 12 he'll be fine. The physical part will require as much of a skill adjustment as it will muscle gains.

 

[The_Architect]

Lard and Talley really impressed me. Lard reminds me physically of a player you'd see on the KU roster, an effortless jumper. Talley looked much bigger than I expected, excited to watch him slash.

 

[srjclone]

Lard and Talley really impressed me. Lard reminds me physically of a player you'd see on the KU roster, an effortless jumper. Talley looked much bigger than I expected, excited to watch him slash.

Yeah, Talley just looks like a basketball player out there. Got a great body with solid skills, he was a huge get this off season.

 

[Goofyguy1]

I am getting tickets to the Final Four.

 

[cyclone101]

Something that has been bothering me...

I've seen many predictions of "I think we really struggle this year and probably miss the tournament but I think we are set up for a big run in '18-'19."

IMO it's either one or the other. A big run to me is getting past the sweet 16. I 95% don't believe that adding the production of Shayok, Jacobson, some freshman, and added experience for guys that will be back next year will be so much better than the production we'll get from DJ, Brase, and Beverly that we go from completely missing the tournament to an elite 8. I just don't see it.

I think we have a solid team this year. I think we make the tournament. And I think we build the foundation for a big year in '18-'19 and '19-'20. I just don't see how we completely miss the tournament this year and then explode in '18-'19. We are bringing in talent but not that kind of talent. Mark me down for #7.

 

[isutrevman]

Okay, but there has never been anyone like Kevin Durant or Steph Curry before them. Saying they are comparable to HSers without muscle, is like saying, they can be Michael Jordan because they didn't make varsity their freshman year.

Monte Morris, Anthony Davis, Larry Bird, Kareem Abdul-jabbar, Jared Uthoff, Dirk Nowitzki, Manu Ginobili, etc. Also, players rarely bulk up that much. If they are skinny as a freshman, they likely be skinny as a senior, most of the time. It seems like some people think George Conditt can bulk up to 250lbs in 2 years with no adverse effects on his athleticism or health. I am also on the side of "strength/bulk is extremely overrated."

 

[FinalFourCy]

Something that has been bothering me...

I've seen many predictions of "I think we really struggle this year and probably miss the tournament but I think we are set up for a big run in '18-'19."

IMO it's either one or the other. A big run to me is getting past the sweet 16. I 95% don't believe that adding the production of Shayok, Jacobson, some freshman, and added experience for guys that will be back next year will be so much better than the production we'll get from DJ, Brase, and Beverly that we go from completely missing the tournament to an elite 8.

That's easy, you're assuming that trio will give a lot of production. If that assumption is incorrect, we very likely could struggle and replacing them with Shayok, Jacobson, and the 2018 class is a step forward. If it's just DJ production we lose, we'll still likely struggle some this year, but add more than enough to offset that for 18-19. The only way you're correct imo is if that trio represents three all-conference guys, when it's more likely DJ is the only one getting those accolades.

Also, it's not necessarily that big difference between a missing-the-tournament roster and making the Elite Eight roster. More experience and better luck alone could do it.

 

[cyclone101]

That's easy, you're assuming that trio will give a lot of production. If that assumption is incorrect, we very likely could struggle and replacing them with Shayok, Jacobson, and the 2018 class is a step forward. If it's just DJ production we lose, we'll still likely struggle some this year, but add more than enough to offset that for 18-19. The only way you're correct imo is if that trio represents three all-conference guys, when it's more likely DJ is the only one getting those accolades.

Also, it's not necessarily that big difference between a missing-the-tournament roster and making the Elite Eight roster. More experience and better luck alone could do it.

I'm not assuming that at all. I think DJ will give us 14 to 15 ppg or so. And if we get 10 ppg out of Brase and Beverly combined I'd be really happy.

My point is... I don't see how you can say "oh yeah I just think we're gonna struggle this year but we'll make a deep run next year." Shayok next year and DJ this year = push. Jacobson next year = Brase. Beverly will struggle to get time this year, I think. Anyone that thinks the addition of 2 ready to contribute freshman in Zion and (hopefully) THT and more experienced underclassmen will magically pull is from an NIT to an elite 8 is a nut.

We're good enough for the tournament if the cards fall right this year. And we'll be good enough for an elite 8 next year if the cards fall right. But to think we will miss the tournament this year AND go deep next year is setting yourself up for 2 years of disappointment if that's the timeline you think we're on.

 

[rholtgraves]

I'm not assuming that at all. I think DJ will give us 14 to 15 ppg or so. And if we get 10 ppg out of Brase and Beverly combined I'd be really happy.

My point is... I don't see how you can say "oh yeah I just think we're gonna struggle this year but we'll make a deep run next year." Shayok next year and DJ this year = push. Jacobson next year = Brase. Beverly will struggle to get time this year, I think. Anyone that thinks the addition of 2 ready to contribute freshman in Zion and (hopefully) THT and more experienced underclassmen will magically pull is from an NIT to an elite 8 is a nut.

We're good enough for the tournament if the cards fall right this year. And we'll be good enough for an elite 8 next year if the cards fall right. But to think we will miss the tournament this year AND go deep next year is setting yourself up for 2 years of disappointment if that's the timeline you think we're on.

I don't see anyone saying they will have a deep run but Shayok is better than Jackson. Jacobsen is better than Brase. Wigginton, Lewis, Lard, Babb, Young, Talley should all improve.

 

[jcyclonee]

Okay, but there has never been anyone like Kevin Durant or Steph Curry before them. Saying they are comparable to HSers without muscle, is like saying, they can be Michael Jordan because they didn't make varsity their freshman year.

So you're saying that I can be like Michael Jordan since I didn't make my high school varsity team as a freshman?

 

[cyclone101]

I don't see anyone saying they will have a deep run but Shayok is better than Jackson. Jacobsen is better than Brase. Wigginton, Lewis, Lard, Babb, Young, Talley should all improve.

You haven't been paying attention then. People have been talking about Des Moines and Minneapolis for a year.

 

[rholtgraves]

You haven't been paying attention then. People have been talking about Des Moines and Minneapolis for a year.

Just in general?