This is why Prohm must go........

IASTATE07

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Yeah, that's what I said.



Not true, once again for those who don't understand English, I heard things about how he was running practice the first month he was on campus which made me question if he's a good fit, I dont form an official opinion until I have a big enough sample size.

The 2016 season got me off to a a bad start with him, the next year I was pretty pleased with how the program performed, the last 3 years since Hoiberg's players are officially gone have been underwhelming to say the least.

This is absolutely a lie. Monte's senior year you wanted him fired.
 

NoCreativity

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So one bad practice report makes you hate the guy.

Anyone with any sort of brain function realized he tried a little too hard that first year. That’s why guys like Georges didn’t love playing for him for a while. He figured it out and obviously had a great relationship with Monte.

Lol, one bad practice? Thats not what I mean at all but you made me laugh.
 

jsb

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Lol, one bad practice? Thats not what I mean at all but you made me laugh.

well I have no idea. But there weren’t a lot of practices from June 7 when he was hired until June 30.

He was trying to be accepted by players who thought TJ was getting hired. They didn’t want to like him. He tried too hard. The fact that June 2015 was bad isn’t some big shock. What’s shocking is people are still holding it against him.
 
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NoCreativity

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This is absolutely a lie. Monte's senior year you wanted him fired.

Lol, yeah, me along with thousands of other people on January 31st, 2017. The just got destroyed in Hilton by West Virginia and making the tourney seemed sketchy at that point.

Then Kansas happened, followed by winning 7 out of 9 and winning the Big 12 tourney. I thought they did a good job that year when you look at the entire season objectively.
 
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CycloneVet

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I agree with you, those wins are fantastic, but what good does it do when you turn right back around and lose to them in Hilton? All you end up with is a .500 program in the Big 12 which is exactly what we've seen the last 5 years.

I mean, I was excited when they ran K-State out of the gym in Manhattan, but then I remembered they lost to them early in the season because nobody could make a simple free throw.

Didn't Mcdermott win once in Manhattan when they were ranked 4th or something? While thats certainly one of the better wins in college basketball that year it doesnt mean anything in the grand scheme of that season when the program is a complete dumpster fire.

Seriously stop
 

mdk2isu

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Lol, yeah, me along with thousands of other people on January 31st, 2017. The just got destroyed in Hilton by West Virginia and making the tourney seemed sketchy at that point.

Then Kansas happened, followed by winning 7 out of 9 and winning the Big 12 tourney. I thought they did a good job that year when you look at the entire season objectively.

Not your strong suit. Probably shouldn't lecture people about it. Pot and Kettle type stuff.
 

Sigmapolis

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I was referencing other teams in 2019.

Does which year in which that talent was wasted really matter?

Seems like an arbitrary boundary on your potential sample.

You think Prohm is bad...? You should meet my Wookie friend.

My prediction is this thread continues to go strong all season.

And for the record, I dont want Prohm fired, if he gets fired next year you run the risk of losing Foster to Iowa. He needs to start producing though, as this program has taken a dramatic downturn in the last 3 years once Hoiberg's guys were officially out of the program.


I quite literally lol'd.

iowa-state-big-12-finals.png


Incredible wins in Lubbock and Manhattan.

Highest rating of the past decade on Bart Torvik.

"Dramatic downturn."

This is why the haters have clown noses.

* * *​

There are legitimate concerns to be had. This year is probably going to be frustrating, and next year has lots of uncertainties, especially if Haliburton is leaving. This kind of hyperbole, expressed in your exasperated tone, has no reasonable foundation whatsoever. There has been way more good than bad. Any season where we cut down the nets in Kansas City is by definition one of the best seasons in school history.
 
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IASTATE07

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Lol, yeah, me along with thousands of other people on January 31st, 2017. The just got destroyed in Hilton by West Virginia and making the tourney seemed sketchy at that point.

Then Kansas happened, followed by winning 7 out of 9 and winning the Big 12 tourney. I thought they did a good job that year when you look at the entire season objectively.

That's new. When did you start looking at things objectively?
 

ClonesFTW

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We had two guys taken 46th and 54th.

Where were the rest of those guys...?

Michigan: 28th and 47th pick - 15 conference wins
Washington: 20th and 43rd pick - 15 conference wins
Florida St: 27th and 48th pick - 13 conference wins

Those aren't exactly lottery picks.

Listen, I'm not saying Prohm sucks but he underperformed in comparison to coaches who had similar talent levels last year.
 

FinalFourCy

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If past recruiting is the biggest issue, then an optimistic view going forward is reasonable. Fred greatly helped to **** Prohm’s first class, and Prohm made some missteps in executing the transition plan. Somewhat of a cascading effect followed.

Those are largely sunk costs imo. The next class looks promising, so hopefully lessons have been learned. Recruiting isn’t the primary concern, coaching and circumstances are imo.
 

Sigmapolis

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Michigan: 28th and 47th pick - 15 conference wins
Washington: 20th and 43rd pick - 15 conference wins
Florida St: 27th and 48th pick - 13 conference wins

Those aren't exactly lottery picks.

Listen, I'm not saying Prohm sucks but he underperformed in comparison to coaches who had similar talent levels last year.

Game scores for last year...

upload_2019-12-17_16-21-52.png

I completely agree with you that things got away from Prohm last February. We only have bits and pieces of what happened, but it sounded like the guys let some of the talk about their talent get to their heads and started playing for themselves instead of the team. The results on the court bore that out. After the practice fight and the WVU game where Shayok did not play, trust me, I was ready to abandon ship, too. I was blowing up an inflatable dragon pool toy and about to swing away from that sinking ship as quickly as I could. Then we played well against Texas Tech at home (even if we lost) and won it all in KC.

I went to the Tulsa game... They played hard and together. Ohio State was just slightly better that night, and we had no answer for Wesson pounding us.

If things do not get away from him in February, then we probably accomplish basically most of the things the crowd faults last year for for some reason.

My response to this...

-- Well, that month sucked, but we "got it back" and righted the ship somehow.
-- Prohm is still bringing on plenty of talent, and his next class might be his best.
-- Judge the season from preseason expectations and not expectations at the end of January, and I think last year was pretty successful.
-- I hope the program collectively learned something after that month from hell.

I think your analysis of the relative talent level of the program might be a little arbitrary. I would like to see something more systemic. Putting us on a list with somebody like Duke and the talent that they had/have is kind of silly, though.
 

ClonesFTW

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Game scores for last year...

View attachment 69285

I think your analysis of the relative talent level of the program might be a little arbitrary. I would like to see something more systemic. Putting us on a list with somebody like Duke and the talent that they had/have is kind of silly, though.

Ok but even if I remove all blue-blood schools and first round picks the results remain the same; Prohm had better talent with worse results.

Big 12 last year:

Baylor - 0 draft picks (10 conference wins)
Kansas State - 0 draft picks (14 conference wins)

B10 last year

Purdue - 1 2nd round draft pick (16 conference wins)
Wisconsin - 0 draft picks (14 conference wins)
Maryland - 1 2nd round draft pick (13 conference wins)
 
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Sigmapolis

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Ok but even if I remove all blue-blood schools and first round picks the results remain the same; Prohm had better talent with worse results.

Big 12 last year:

Baylor - 0 draft picks (10 conference wins)
Kansas State - 0 draft picks (14 conference wins)

B10 last year

Purdue - 1 2nd round draft pick (16 conference wins)
Wisconsin - 0 draft picks (14 conference wins)
Maryland - 1 2nd round draft pick (13 conference wins)

Baylor = Ro32, lost to Zaga
Kansas State = upset by UC-Irvine (maybe Wade was out?) in the first round
Purdue = had a great run to the Elite Eight, should have finished UVA off for a Final Four appearance, Carsen Edwards was playing out of his mind
Wisconsin = lost to #12 Oregon in the first round
Maryland = Ro32, lost to LSU

Besides Purdue, who had the proverbial hot streak that you need to have in the NCAA tournament, none of them went much further than we did. Of the remaining four, two were out without a win and the other two were out two days later.
 
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CycloneVet

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We were one of their two Quadrant I-A victories.

Ohio State wanted to play that slow, grinding, ugly sort of game.

Wesson and his 21 points and 12 rebounds looked like he wanted to be there.

We sure wanted to play a few days earlier in Kansas City. I watched Nick and Tyrese walk off the court crying after we lost. I am sure we wanted to play.

We just got into a junkyard brawl with a team that wanted to play like that.

Without our player that could have helped tremendously in that game.
 
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Sigmapolis

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Things to consider --

Every FB and MBB coach that Pollard has hired =

Chizik
Rhoads
Campbell
McDermott
Hoiberg
Prohm

Notice how many of them he has fired? Yes, he let McCarney and Morgan go, but those were not "his guys." Pollard is very loyal to his hires.

With Rhoads even, he only let him go when...

(1.) It was painfully obvious that it was not working.
(2.) The program had a specific moment of extreme embarrassment.
(3.) I think Pollard was locked onto Campbell (even long before the Kansas State debacle at the end of that year) and knew he had to move now to get him.

Prohm is going to have a long leash, like it or not. Pollard vociferously defended him on a podcast with CW/Hines this spring using many of the same arguments that we have (e.g., good recruiter, met preseason expectations, good representative of the university, etc.) on here. I imagine Prohm has at least two years on credit now, if not three.