Team recruiting ranking..

[cyhiphopp]

For comparison purposes here are some recruiting stats from the past few years. (keep in mind these are full recruiting classes)

2002: Team Rank 30th best class; 8th best in B12; 26 total commits 6 four star; 8 three star (key players Stevie Hicks, Austin Flynn)

2003: Team Rank 46th best class; 10th best in B12; 26 total commits 0 four star; 12 three star (key players Jason Berryman, Todd Blyth, Bret Meyer, Deandre Jackson)

2004: Team Rank 42nd best class; 9th best in B12; 28 total commits 1 four star; 10 three star (key players Jason Scales, RJ Sumrall, Tim Dobbins)

2005: Team Rank 58th best class; 11th best in B12; 25 total commits 2 four star; 9 three star (key players Alvin Bowen, Reggie Stephens)

2006: Team Rank 63rd best class; 11th best in B12; 30 total commits 0 four star; 15 three star (key players Austen Arnaud, Ahtyba Rubin, Alexander Robinson)

2007: Team Rank 60th best class; 11th best in B12; 25 total commits 1 four star; 9 three star (key players Phillip Bates, Collin Franklin, J.J. Bass)

2008: Team Rank 62nd best class; last in B12; 24 total commits 1 four star; 6 three star (key players Sedrick Johnson, Jerome Tiller, Leonard Johnson, Darius Darks)

2009: Team Rank 73rd best class; 11th in B12; 23 total commits 1 four star; 10 three star (key players Darius Reynolds, AJ Klein, David Sims)

2010 (not yet complete): Team Rank 46th best class; 9th in B12; 22 total commits 2 four star 14 three star


To sum this all up we have definitely had good classes (better than this year at least by ratings). However, I'd say some of our recent classes have been proven better than some of the earlier good classes yet have been ranked far lower (further evidence that rankings are not the end all tell all).

The one thing I think stands out the most with this year's class is the amount of 3 star guys we are bringing in. Compared to previous years, we haven't even come close to landing that many 3 star athletes.

Nice compilation.
One thing that makes some of the recent classes better is that less guys are disapearing come fall. A lot of the top guys in 02 and 04 never showed up or barely played. I think 03 was actually better than 02 and 04 because there ended up being more starters from that class. That was a big problem with DMacs recruiting classes. A lot of guys never made it to campus or greatly underperformed. If I had time, I would list out all of the recruits since 2002 and try and find out which ones actually started at some point.

 

[mizouse87]

Very good point my man. I actually meant to add that in my synopsis. Danny Mac recruited quite a few "studs" that either never made it to campus or were simply a bust.

 

[jaretac]

To sum this all up we have definitely had good classes (better than this year at least by ratings). However, I'd say some of our recent classes have been proven better than some of the earlier good classes yet have been ranked far lower (further evidence that rankings are not the end all tell all).

The one thing I think stands out the most with this year's class is the amount of 3 star guys we are bringing in. Compared to previous years, we haven't even come close to landing that many 3 star athletes.

I disagree, and if you don't believe me you can look at our records since 2005. You listed off some of the key recruits, but it is easy to tell that you are going off memory. Ten years from now, do you really think anyone is going to remember Bass or Bates as a key additions? For that matter, even S Johnson, Tiller, or Klein based on what they have done so far. Tiller would be the most likely of all those simply because of his play at Nebraska, but if he doesn't ever start, his name will likely go down like some of the other well know backups at ISU (um...let me think).

Don't get me wrong, all of those guys can still make their name known, but you are forgetting a lot of players that helped us win games in those key additions. If you look at the recruit rankings and the actual standings, it explains a lot.

2002: Team Rank 30th (2003 standing 2-10, 0-8, the anomaly year)
2003: Team Rank 46th (2004 standing 7-5, 4-4 with a bowl win)
2004: Team Rank 42nd (2005 standing 7-5, 4-4 with 3 OT loses)
2005: Team Rank 58th (2006 standing 4-8, 1-7 MAC's last year)
2006: Team Rank 63rd (2007 standing 3-9, 2-6 stronger late in the year)
2007: Team Rank 60th (2008 standing 2-10, 0-8 1 OT loss and a few more close games)
2008: Team Rank 62nd (2009 standing 6-6, 3-4 in the weakest Big 12 in a long time)
2009: Team Rank 73rd (2010 standing we'll see, doubt we will go to a bowl)

 

[mizouse87]

I disagree, and if you don't believe me you can look at our records since 2005. You listed off some of the key recruits, but it is easy to tell that you are going off memory. Ten years from now, do you really think anyone is going to remember Bass or Bates as a key additions? For that matter, even S Johnson, Tiller, or Klein based on what they have done so far. Tiller would be the most likely of all those simply because of his play at Nebraska, but if he doesn't ever start, his name will likely go down like some of the other well know backups at ISU (um...let me think).

Don't get me wrong, all of those guys can still make their name known, but you are forgetting a lot of players that helped us win games in those key additions. If you look at the recruit rankings and the actual standings, it explains a lot.

2002: Team Rank 30th (2003 standing 2-10, 0-8, the anomaly year)
2003: Team Rank 46th (2004 standing 7-5, 4-4 with a bowl win)
2004: Team Rank 42nd (2005 standing 7-5, 4-4 with 3 OT loses)
2005: Team Rank 58th (2006 standing 4-8, 1-7 MAC's last year)
2006: Team Rank 63rd (2007 standing 3-9, 2-6 stronger late in the year)
2007: Team Rank 60th (2008 standing 2-10, 0-8 1 OT loss and a few more close games)
2008: Team Rank 62nd (2009 standing 6-6, 3-4 in the weakest Big 12 in a long time)
2009: Team Rank 73rd (2010 standing we'll see, doubt we will go to a bowl)

Keep in mind a 2009 recruiting class does not directly correlate with the success or lack of success in a 2009 season. I'm also sure you are aware that just because you have a decent recruiting class does not automatically constitute a successful season. Coaching/development plays just as much a part as recruiting.
I stand by original assessment in that the past 2-3 recruiting classes (including the current class) are actually better than most dating back to 2002. We are actually having more of the recruits show up on campus and also contribute compared to those other higher rated classes.

Side note, I actually listed Phillip Bates, and JJ Bass on purpose for that class, as that was pretty much some of the best we got out of that class and clearly didn't amount to much for us. I was not listing those from memory, I simply picked and chose some of the bigger names from the classes, intentionally not listing any and all names that may have contributed (or not). Furthermore, from last year's class I think AJ Klein will eventually be 1st team all B12 at some point in his career.

 

[WalkingCY]

I have a feeling we are going to win the freaking National Championship. Oh man......And, Soon.:idea:

 

[cyhiphopp]

Well I didn't have the time to do so, but I did it anyway. (Correct me if I am wrong.)

Here are all of the recruiting classes from 2002 and what I could find on who showed up and stuck around. There is a huge amount of no shows and attrition from those earlier classes. A lot of the success we had with Mac was because of pre-2002 recruits, the few recruits who stuck around, and walk-ons (which I didn't list).

Honestly, I believe we will eventually have many more starters and contributors from the last two classes than we had in some of the best DMac classes COMBINED.

2002
4 stars
Austin Flynn QB
Stevie Hicks RB
Curtis James JuCo OL Gone by 2003
Collin Menard JuCo OL
Federico Samuel JuCO DT Gone by 2003
Max Steward JuCo LB Gone by 2003
3 stars
Amecus Daniels DB Gone by 2003
Mike Hmoud OL No show
Jimmy Morris LB Gone by 2005
Saheed Richardson JuCo DE Gone by 2003
Korey Smith DE
Kyle Smith LB
Waye Terry QB Injury/Illness and left team
Emmanuel Valcourt JuCo OL Gone by 2003
2 stars
Jon Davis WR
Christopher Jones DB Gone by 2004
Beau Klaffke LB Gone by 2004
Ryan Kock LB
Craig Kuhrt OL Gone by 2004
Nick Leaders DT
Kory Pence OL
Matt Robertson LB
Klayton Shoals DT Gone by 2004
Kyle Van Winkle ATH
Cory Wierson OL Gone by 2004
Seth Zehr OL
Scott Stephenson DE Ended up at Minnesota then transfered back as a Center

2003
4 stars
NONE
3 stars
Ben Barkema TE
Jason Berryman LB
Todd Blythe WR
Aaron Brant OL
Brandon Cook OL Gone by 2006
Josh Griebahn K
DeAndre Jackson ATH
Bret Meyer QB
Milan Moses WR
Taylor Schrage LB Gone by 2006
John Tjaden OL
Mike West ATH No show
2 stars
Steve Allen LB Gone by 2004
Caleb Berg DB
Brent Curvey DT
Nick Davidson DT Gone by 2005
Dominique Flower DB Gone by 2004
Nate Mechaelsen QB No show
Ron Prelow DB Gone by 2006
Matt Scherbring DT Gone by 2005
Tom Schmeling OL
Bastian Schober OL
Kurtis Taylor ATH
Brandon Tinlin DE
Anthony Walker OL
James Wright JuCo TE Gone by 2004

2004
4 stars
Webster Patrick RB No show
3 stars
Brandon Gunn RB Transfered
Greg Coleman RB Bad when starting - then transfered
Tyease Thompson RB Gone by 2005
Adam Carper DB
Bobby Chalk DB Gone by 2005
Travis Ferguson DE
Jason Scales RB
Fabian Dodd JuCo DT
Josh Hargis JuCo DB Gone by 2005
Terrance Highsmith JuCo QB Played at WR
2 stars
Jordan Goos OL
Will Lewis DB Gone by 2005
Kody Kuehl OL Gone by 2005
Landon Streit OL No show
Nick Frere LB
Mack Kimble ATH Gone by 2005
Jason McGinty DT Gone by 2006
Chris Brown ATH
Brandon Hunley DB
Brandon Johnson OL
R.J. Sumrall WR
Collins Eboh DE Gone by 2005
Mike Main WR Gone by 2005
Joe Vanstrom OL
Tim Dobbins JuCo LB
Jerry Gair DB Gone by 2005
LaMarcus Hicks JuCo DB
1 star
Tony Johnson RB No Show

2005
4 stars
Paul Fisher JuCo OL Never played like a 4 star
Walter Nickel JuCo TE Ditto
3 stars
Trent Flander TE Transferred to play QB at UCONN
A.J. Haase TE Gone by 2006
Houston Jones QB Backup WR
Dominique Rocker RB Gone by 2006
Chris Singleton DB
Reggie Stephens OL
Alvin Bowen Soph LB
Scott Fisher JuCo OL
Thomas Patton JuCo DE Gone by 2006
Reggie Rock ATH No show
2 stars
Derrick Catlett TE
Jason Fiacco OL Transfered to UNI I think
Marquis Hamilton WR
Brice Beck QB Gone by 2006
Eric Schultz DE Gone by 2007
Steve Johnson DB
Josh Raven LB
James Smith ATH
Jason Harris RB Very little PT at RB played some DB
Stephon Dale DE Gone by 2007
Durrell Williams ATH Gone by 2007
Chris Mahoski K
Levi Kanwischer WR No show
John Machado JuCo DE
Jon Banks Soph DB

2006
4 stars
NONE
3 stars
Austen Arnaud QB
Fred Garrin LB
Matt Hulbert OL
Bailey Johnson DT
Josh Johnson RB Gone by 2007
Kris Means LB No show
Derron Montgomery WR
Mitchell Moore ATH Gone by 2007
Rashawn Parker ATH
Alexander Robinson RB
Derrick Russell WR No Show
Zac Sandvig ATH
Jose Vargas OL No Show
Ahtyba Rubin JuCo OL
Lee Tibbs JuCo OL
2 stars
Austin Alburtis DE
Nate Frere DT
Devin McDowell DB
Prince McKinney DB No Show
Patrick Neal DE
Randy Palmer ATH No Show
Drenard Williams ATH
John Richardson DT No Show
Ben Lamaak TE
Justin Robertson DB No Show
Kellen White DB Gone by 2007
Harry Scott RB No Show
Matt Leaders LB Gone by 2007
Matt Purvis JuCo ATH
Collins Eboh DE No Show

2007
4 stars
J.J. Bass RB
3 stars
Phillip Bates QB No comment
Allen Bell DB
Joe Blaes OL Never really played
Christopher Lyle DE
Fabian Brown LB No show
Wallace Franklin JuCo WR
Joe McMahon OL No Show
Kelechi Osemele OL
Michael Tate JuCo DT
2 stars
Alex Alvarez OL
Cameron Bell RB Transfered
Doug Dedrick OL
Joseph Klerekoper OL
Alex Sandvig WR Injured and left football
Chris Weir JuCo DT
Michael Bibbs JuCo LB
Jerrod Black DT
Anthony Green LB No show
A.J. Matthews DB No Show
Trey Baysinger OL
Curtiz Mathis LB Gone by 2008
Randy Kellman DE Gone by 2008
James Carpenter OL No Show
Collin Franklin TE

2008
4 stars
Sedrick Johnson WR
3 stars
Kennard Banks JuCo ATH
Ter'Ran Benton DB
Jason Carlson JuCo WR
Darius Darks ATH
Leonard Johnson ATH
Jake McDonough DE
2 stars
Jerome Tiller QB
Brayden Burris OL
Lonzie Range WR
Jeremiah Schwartz RB
Ethan Tuftee OL
Ernest Ferguson LB Gone by 2009
Chase Harper ATH No show
Judah Linder DB Left program
Roosevelt Maggitt DE
Zach Guyer K
Adrin Haughton OL
Cleyon Laing DE
Carter Bykowski TE
Dustin Land DB Left program
Stephen Ruempolhamer DT
Kevin Hamlin LB
Kurt Hammerschmidt TE
Grant Mahoney K

2009
4 stars
Darius Reynolds ATH
3 stars
Joshua Bellamy WR No show
Aaron Moore OL
Beau Blankenship RB
Keith Blanton WR
Princeton Jackson LB No show
Donnie Jennert WR
A.J. Klein LB
Kyle Lichtenberg OL
Taylor Martin DE No show
James White RB
Jacob Lattimer LB
Matt Taufoou LB
Jon Watts LB No show
2 stars
Jake Knott LB
David Sims DB
Zack Spears OL
Walter Woods DT
Brandon Mims ATH
Jansen Watson DB
Deon Broomfield DB
James Capello QB
Josh Lenz WR
Willie Scott LB
Jacques Washington DB
Jeremy Reeves DB

 

[TheGovernator]

I don't think you can really count JUCO guys as a high-end recruit. Something someone else mentioned in a different thread is mentally take 1* off of their ranking if you want a more accurate barometer of where these guys stand. Additionally, they are guys that are supposed to be "quick fix" type of guys. However, looking through that list, the JUCO 4* guys going to ISU just haven't been dependable. They still have to make grades in order to show up on campus.

Team recruiting rankings are a funny thing. Just because someone has a higher ranked class doesn't mean they did better in recruiting. A team could pull in a 4 star FB (not sure if that's even a recruiting position) and a 5* WR and still be worse off than a team with a bunch of 3* athletes. The reason I say that is because recruiting is all about supplementing. You could have 4-5* WR, but if you don't have a QB worth a damn to throw them the ball, they aren't worth a whole heck of a lot. Same goes with a 5* RB to an extent. There aren't many guys who can make up for a complete lack of an OL push and still get their yardage.

So, IMO, college recruiting is all about how well you supplement your recruits.

 

[cyhiphopp]

I don't think you can really count JUCO guys as a high-end recruit. Something someone else mentioned in a different thread is mentally take 1* off of their ranking if you want a more accurate barometer of where these guys stand. Additionally, they are guys that are supposed to be "quick fix" type of guys. However, looking through that list, the JUCO 4* guys going to ISU just haven't been dependable. They still have to make grades in order to show up on campus.

Team recruiting rankings are a funny thing. Just because someone has a higher ranked class doesn't mean they did better in recruiting. A team could pull in a 4 star FB (not sure if that's even a recruiting position) and a 5* WR and still be worse off than a team with a bunch of 3* athletes. The reason I say that is because recruiting is all about supplementing. You could have 4-5* WR, but if you don't have a QB worth a damn to throw them the ball, they aren't worth a whole heck of a lot. Same goes with a 5* RB to an extent. There aren't many guys who can make up for a complete lack of an OL push and still get their yardage.

So, IMO, college recruiting is all about how well you supplement your recruits.

High ranking JuCo guys should be able to come in and contiribute/start immediately. That is why they get more credit than HS players who more often need to develop unless they are studs. While DMac succeeded in landing JuCo studs like Dobbins and LaMarcus Hicks, he also missed on a lot of JuCos who either never made it to campus, never started, or were mediacre as starters. That killed the future of the program and eventually contributed to DMac being canned.

 

[jaretac]

Keep in mind a 2009 recruiting class does not directly correlate with the success or lack of success in a 2009 season. I'm also sure you are aware that just because you have a decent recruiting class does not automatically constitute a successful season. Coaching/development plays just as much a part as recruiting.
I stand by original assessment in that the past 2-3 recruiting classes (including the current class) are actually better than most dating back to 2002. We are actually having more of the recruits show up on campus and also contribute compared to those other higher rated classes.

Side note, I actually listed Phillip Bates, and JJ Bass on purpose for that class, as that was pretty much some of the best we got out of that class and clearly didn't amount to much for us. I was not listing those from memory, I simply picked and chose some of the bigger names from the classes, intentionally not listing any and all names that may have contributed (or not). Furthermore, from last year's class I think AJ Klein will eventually be 1st team all B12 at some point in his career.

I know what you are saying, one does NOT = the other, I get that. My point is that though the above is true, there is also a correlation between bad recruiting classes and bad football seasons. Part of that also comes down to the coaches and how good of recruiters/coaches they are, but I don't think I would trade any of our recruiting 50+ classes for any of our 50- classes. Class rankings might not be completely accurate, but they are good indicators.

On a side note, take a look at 2003. WOW, I would take another class like that anytime:
Ben Barkema TE
Jason Berryman LB
Todd Blythe WR
Aaron Brant OL
Josh Griebahn K
DeAndre Jackson ATH
Bret Meyer QB
Milan Moses WR
Caleb Berg DB
Brent Curvey DT
Tom Schmeling OL
Kurtis Taylor ATH

 

[isufan]

Rivals just ranked Brandon Jensen earlier today and he now has two stars.

 

[cmoore_23]

Rivals just ranked Brandon Jensen earlier today and he now has two stars.

wow.. I actually thought for sure he would be a 3 star... owell

 

[cyhiphopp]

Rivals just ranked Brandon Jensen earlier today and he now has two stars.

wow.. I actually thought for sure he would be a 3 star... owell

He is a little known DT from Iowa. He may have 3 star skill and potential, but I doubt they would have given him that 3rd star.

If he was from Texas, it might be a different story.

I don't care how many stars he got though, I just want him to get on campus so we can develop him into a stud DT.

 

[sweaty7]

I know what you are saying, one does NOT = the other, I get that. My point is that though the above is true, there is also a correlation between bad recruiting classes and bad football seasons. Part of that also comes down to the coaches and how good of recruiters/coaches they are, but I don't think I would trade any of our recruiting 50+ classes for any of our 50- classes. Class rankings might not be completely accurate, but they are good indicators.

Yes and no. There was a an article in the most recent issue of the Journal of Quantitative Analysis in Sports (yes, it really exists & is peer-reviewed) showed that only about 45% of a team's performance can be explained by recruiting rankings, but 51% of recruiting rankings can be explained by the previous year's performance. So on-field performance generally explains (perceived) success in recruiting more than recruiting explains performance.

 

[bosco]

Looking at the national rankings closer shows that we are making strides at some positions especially if you take in account the company we are in. Rankings are according to Rivals:

WR: 26th, Clemson at 27th and Oklahoma, Texas Tech, Mississippi state tied at 23rd
TE: Tied for 17th with Pittsburgh and Miami.
OL: 42nd, Okie St and Texas Tech tied at 40th, Florida at 43rd
LB: 17th, Syracuse at 16th and Oregon St at 18th. Oregon, Michigan, Michigan St, UCLA are all ranked behind us
DB: tied for 20th with Notre Dame, Kentucky, Wake Forest, and Houston

 

[cystate925]

Move on up ISU Fans, just looked at the rivals.com update... has ISU now up to #46w/ Baylor and Kansas right ahead of us. Hopefully we can get one more 4* and 3* to finish off recruiting, I would like to see another DL. And by the time the signing period is done be ranked in Top 30-40. GO STATE!

 

[Stelrs1995]

Move on up ISU Fans, just looked at the rivals.com update... has ISU now up to #46w/ Baylor and Kansas right ahead of us. Hopefully we can get one more 4* and 3* to finish off recruiting, I would like to see another DL. And by the time the signing period is done be ranked in Top 30-40. GO STATE!

I don't want to burst your bubble but I would say we will drop when other schools sign more. We have 24 recruits listed and several schools below us have 15 or less, some as low as 5. Kinda looks like right now it is quantity over quality. Although I am excited for this class.

 

[benjay]

recruiting rankings are so stupid

 

[SCNCY]

If you look at previous rankings, with as many points we have, almost 600, it looks like we will be around the 50 mark.

 

[Bipolarcy]

recruiting rankings are so stupid

NOT stupid. If you look at rankings throughout the years, you'll probably find that the teams consistently ranked in the top 20 are the ones fighting for BCS conference titles and BCS bowl berths year in and year out. Sure, they could be way off in any given year, but taken as a whole, they are pretty predictive of who the good teams will be/are.

And yes, you can always find one or two teams who DON'T fit that summation.

 

[xboxfever]

NOT stupid. If you look at rankings throughout the years, you'll probably find that the teams consistently ranked in the top 20 are the ones fighting for BCS conference titles and BCS bowl berths year in and year out. Sure, they could be way off in any given year, but taken as a whole, they are pretty predictive of who the good teams will be/are.

And yes, you can always find one or two teams who DON'T fit that summation.

Exactly. There are always going to be players that are ranked as 2 stars or a low 3 star, that turn out to be great players. There are also going to be players that are 5 and 4 stars who don't pan out. It is not an accurate science, but the teams that are consistent, are the teams with the best recruiting classes.