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Pre-Memorial Day Hoiberg NBA Update

HoopsTournament said:
Really?
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Maybe 'nothing' is not the right word, I'll put it this way. I think most of us can agree that a lot of people look at sports as a "what have you done for me lately". If you look at Duke for the decade (70-80) prior coach K's arrival, their winning percentage was at .60, winning slightly above half of their games and had 3 NCAA appearances.

Compare that to the decade prior CFH (00-10) our winning percentage was .54 with 2 NCAA appearances. I think you would be hard pressed to find cyclone fans that wouldn't say that that decade of basketball stunk. Did it really matter that we had won two conference titles in 99 and 00? People were focused on the fact that we were in a hole that was lasting 10 years.

So although Duke has a richer tradition when you compare records back to the 20's, Duke's reality was no different when they hired coach K than ours was when we hired CFH. A decade of crappy basketball. Coach K resurrected Duke's glory although not nearly as quickly as CFH was raising ISU's stock. I think that is what some people were hoping that CFH could be to ISU what coach K is to Duke.

Maybe that clears up my point.
 
CyStalker said:
Maybe 'nothing' is not the right word, I'll put it this way. I think most of us can agree that a lot of people look at sports as a "what have you done for me lately". If you look at Duke for the decade (70-80) prior coach K's arrival, their winning percentage was at .60, winning slightly above half of their games and had 3 NCAA appearances.
Compare that to the decade prior CFH (00-10) our winning percentage was .54 with 2 NCAA appearances. I think you would be hard pressed to find cyclone fans that wouldn't say that that decade of basketball stunk. Did it really matter that we had won two conference titles in 99 and 00? People were focused on the fact that we were in a hole that was lasting 10 years.

So although Duke has a richer tradition when you compare records back to the 20's, Duke's reality was no different when they hired coach K than ours was when we hired CFH. A decade of crappy basketball. Coach K resurrected Duke's glory although not nearly as quickly as CFH was raising ISU's stock. I think that is what some people were hoping that CFH could be to ISU what coach K is to Duke.

Maybe that clears up my point.
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One again, really?

Coach K arrived at Duke at the start of the 1980-81 season. Before that Duke had been to 8 NCAA tournaments. This in an era when the NCAA Tournament had up to 32 teams (not 64-68 during most of Coach K's era). Their NCAA Tournament record was 17-8. They had been 6 Sweet Sixteens, 5 Elite Eights, 3 Final Fours and 2 National Championship Games. In that decade of crappy basketball before Coach K, they had played in the National Championship game 3 years before and were just coming off of a Sweet Sixteen appearance. Duke ranked 14th all-time in tournament wins at the close of the 1980 tournament. North Carolina had 23, Kansas had 20.

Compare the same stats to ISU today: We have been to 16 tournaments. Our record is 16-16. (Still fewer wins than pre-Coach K Duke). We have been to 4 Sweet Sixteens, 2 Elite Eights and 1 Final Four. We currently rank 58th all-time in tournament wins. And this is after five years of CFH. And we were coming off of the longest streak of any power conference teams with no postseason appearances at all.

I love Iowa State, but you are 100% dead wrong. If you want to compare Iowa State pre-CFH to UConn pre-Calhoun or Florida pre-Donovan then I would agree with you, but Duke pre-Coach K was a very, very successful program. He just made them an elite program.
 
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Dukes decade of crappy basketball:

1970: 17-9 (8-6)
1971: 20-10 (9-5)
1972: 14-12 (6-6)
1973: 12-14 (4-8)
1974: 10-16 (2-10)
1975: 13-13 (2-10)
1976: 13-14 (3-9)
1977: 14-13 (2-10)
1978: 27-7 (?-?) - National Runner-ups
1979: 22-8 (9-3) - Lost first round (32) as a #2 seed
1980: 24-9 (7-7) - Went to Sweet Sixteen

I will give you 6 years of crappy basketball, but they were still of very good program. They would have made the NCAA tournament in 1970 and 1971 under the current format so it is not an apples to apples comparison. All of the blue bloods have had a period where they had down times at some point in their history.
 
Hey, can we stop arguing about something irrelevantly stupid like whether or not Duke was a good team in the 70's and get back to arguing about something relevantly stupid about Fred, please?
 
RustShack said:
If you know of good recruits who aren't taken you should let TJ know. Most of them are gone this time of year, and good transfers aren't coming to a stacked team.
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This is exactly right....right now were not being hurt with recruiting. We just would have a need to fill the bench with the likes of Beilfeldt. If we dont we'll be just fine. Fred will make a decision in the coming weeks good or bad and the the 2016 class we have plenty of time on.
 
chadly82 said:
This is exactly right....right now were not being hurt with recruiting. We just would have a need to fill the bench with the likes of Beilfeldt. If we dont we'll be just fine. Fred will make a decision in the coming weeks good or bad and the the 2016 class we have plenty of time on.
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2016 isn't going to go well for high school recruits. They are making their final lists right now and we have a total cluster **** going on where we don't know who will be our coach next year.

If Fred stays, they will assume he's gone to the Timbersolves next year.

TJ jumped in late in the game for the 2016 class and frankly what is he even supposed to talk to them about now? They're going to ask him if Fred is staying or not and there's not much he can really say.
 
HoopsTournament said:
Dukes decade of crappy basketball:

1970: 17-9 (8-6)
1971: 20-10 (9-5)
1972: 14-12 (6-6)
1973: 12-14 (4-8)
1974: 10-16 (2-10)
1975: 13-13 (2-10)
1976: 13-14 (3-9)
1977: 14-13 (2-10)
1978: 27-7 (?-?) - National Runner-ups
1979: 22-8 (9-3) - Lost first round (32) as a #2 seed
1980: 24-9 (7-7) - Went to Sweet Sixteen

I will give you 6 years of crappy basketball, but they were still of very good program. They would have made the NCAA tournament in 1970 and 1971 under the current format so it is not an apples to apples comparison. All of the blue bloods have had a period where they had down times at some point in their history.
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Both coaches came in with less than a stellar decade preceding them. Duke had tradition and three years of good bb prior coach K hire and yet CFH out coached coach K in their first 5 years .68/.57 receptively.

I totally agree that coach K brought Duke to the elite level. Given that CFH achieved more with less (not just talent, but the riches that comes with tradition), fans hoped that CFH would be to ISU what coach K did for Duke....bring us to an elite level. Given CFH success his first five years without any coaching experience, I don't think it's a stretch of the imagination that CFH could have been one of the coaching greats. That is my point and that is what I was responding to in my initial post to another poster.
 
ejcs said:
Nice summary. Lots of info with just enough disclaimer.

So do you have any guess as to when should we expect TJ's introductory press conference?
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This is something Jamie likes to do.

Hire some so-called hot-shot coach at bottom-basement prices : Chizik, GMAC, and now TJ
 
It's college basketball. Several teams change coaches, few coaches are locked to be at said school forever. Iowa State isn't the only school who can't guarantee their coach won't be there all four years.
 
Jambalaya said:
This is something Jamie likes to do.

Hire some so-called hot-shot coach at bottom-basement prices : Chizik, GMAC, and now TJ
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All three of those coaches are completely different.

-Top notch DC at a top program, heavily sought after
-Winning HC at a lower level program
-Great recruiter, and actually helped Fred with the a lot of the HC duties his first few years.
 
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RustShack said:
All three of those coaches are completely different.

-Top notch DC at a top program, heavily sought after
-Winning HC at a lower level program
-Great recruiter, and actually helped Fred with the a lot of the HC duties his first few years.
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Fred leaned on Lutz and Sadler far more than he ever did TJ.

Whether our coach is Fred, TJ, or xyz...being more consistent on the boards and defense should be priority number one. If that happens, the sky will be the limit.
 
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