Have we gone to the tournament and 2 sweet 16s? you glass half empty people are the WORST
Dwayne Pierce Stepping Away From The Team
- Thread starter Cyclones8824
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Have we gone to the tournament and 2 sweet 16s? you glass half empty people are the WORST
Can't both things be true? Prohms big bust of a 2019 class came hot on the heels of a really good season too. The 2024 class for Iowa State is only 2 kids, so if you are only 50% successful on a class of two it doesn't hurt as bad. I was just drawing a comparison. I don't at all think we are about to enter the doldrums or anything. Just stating that a player exiting the program prior to the season and prior to ever actually putting on a jersey reminded me of the 2019 debacle.
Not after his injury which I miss stated earlier. But here is a comment from the Stansbury article on cyclone fanatic when TJ made Tamin his first offer as Cyclone head coach: “Once considered one of the top players in the class nationally, Lipsey’s recruiting metrics took a hit while he sat out most of last year due to an ACL tear suffered in June 2019 that forced him to miss his entire sophomore season.” My point is that while he has exceeded the expectations when he graduated, he was not an unknown via early rankings and his performance on the under 16 national team so didn’t so much fit the diamond in the rough description most commonly used. But we can all agree that he’s a great cyclone!
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CycloneErik
Well-Known Member
Cyclonepride
Thought Police
Tamin played on the U16 Team USA basketball squad. He wasn't a diamond in the rough.
His recruitment underscores how important the soph/jr years are for recruiting rankings but he was already back to form his senior year.
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A player who was going to Redshirt... this isn't like a high 4* or anything like that. This is no where remotely close to Prohm levels of ineptness. This stuff happens all the time.
just checking in...yep, my ignore list is up to date.
I think sarcastic speculation (nothing negative or personal) would be better than what this thread became.
It has happened once in recent memory - the Prohm class of 2019.
After that you have to go back a ways. I am fairly confident that all of Hoibergs HS recruits at least survived one season before transferring. He did have a JC guy never make it to the season, or maybe even to campus but I am pretty sure that was a deal where they rescinded the scholarship. Another JC guy left mid season -KJ Bluford. Not sure if McDermott had any guys sign but not make the opening day roster. I know Eustachy had a couple.
Dont have to be ranked high by rivals and 247 to be a "stud" freshman. Luka Garza, Georges Niang and Monte Morris were all pretty heralded recruits and all played four years in college because, again, they weren't high-profile NBA types. Going around in circles so much not even sure what your or my point is anymore haha. I think if Iowa State "hits" on 1 highschool recruit a year the rest is extra. The program depends on those core players. To suggest highschool recruiting isn't worth it or important anymore is pretty out there IMO.
The NBA is just crazy as well. 1st round picks typically all tend to be extremely young, potential high-end players. It is a couple times a decade we are losing a player early for the NBA draft. Momcilovic is a unicorn and one of our highest rated recruits ever and he still may very well be a 3-4 year player. If he blows up this year (which would be terrific) we will see where he lands on NBA boards. Really needs to improve his quickness/athleticism.
I wonder if there have been rule changes between 2019 and now? Hmmmm can think of a big one for sure
The transfer rules, sure. I don't believe Dwayne announced he was entering though. I am not familiar with all the rules though, maybe we are in a dead period for being able to enter.
I am not bringing this up as an indictment on TJ by the way. I think people are misinterpreting that. I think it is an important observation, as I truly believe that the misses in the 2019 class are what ultimately did Prohm in (he went 0/4 considering Caleb Grill and Tre Jackson both ended up transferring). This to me is different, because as I mentioned, it is just a 2 person class, and because TJ has shown that his teams will always compete due to his system, and his acumen to get guys out of the portal that fit what he wants to do when the high school kids don't pan out. Prohm had run out of luck in the HS ranks after the 2018 class and he ended up being fairly miserable in the portal as well. His program never had any sort of identity on either side of the ball. So by no means do I think TJ is heading down that path. Just making a simple observation that having a HS recruit fail to make the opening day roster is the first time it has happened since Prohm's 2019 class.
Not sure if he even has to enter the portal or if he can just reopen his recruitment. Not sure if he attended summer classes or not. Guessing he can just enroll to St Johns or something and be fine
Who knows what happens if the Temple transfer doesn't get hurt Lipsey's freshman year. I think Lipsey would've played and possibly beat him out during the year, but I don't think he was going to start from day one if Williams doesn't get hurt.
You listed players that played before transfer portal and NIL so not sure that correlates to today’s world. Also I’m not suggesting, and neither was the poster you originally disagreed with, hs recruiting doesn’t matter anymore.
I just think it todays landscape it’s very hard to predict a 4 year player anymore. You almost have to hit a sweet spot like the players you mentioned (Garza, Niang, monte). Decent hs recruits that develop into great college players but not quite good enough to get drafted high early on. Oh and now they have to be appropriately compensated and want to stay at the school they chose.
It’s just too easy to move around these days.
Some of the most beloved were 2 year guys like Tinsley and Dedric.
The absolute best is 'I miss when players were loyal to ISU and stayed 4 years' like they wouldn't likely bounce (as they should) for the NBA if they were first rounders.
I still don't remember who left the team in 2019 or when.
I guess I look at it on the whole for finding similarities. Someone who's barely even been there leaving vs. just before the season or whatever isn't that similar.
And, 2019 was coming off of a generally successful but turbulent '18-19 team that really felt like we were seeing CSP's lack of control of certain aspects out in the open, and whatever departures just kind of felt like more of the same weirdness.
Whereas, TJ is still building the program and someone leaving is very possibly because someone better is in line and they simply know it.
I think Garza, Niang and Morris correlates MORE in the NIL world today. You know how much money Niang could have made if NIL existed when he played? Why risk leaving early when it isn't a sure thing at the next level when you are making serious money in college guaranteed?
Also, in the rare occurrence a player leaves early (Haliburton, THT, Wigginton), who cares? They all were terrific while they were here. How is that any different than a 1 or 2 year transfer?
