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Not a great clip for Fred...

MeowingCows said:
I was just listening to SportsCenter where they were debating about Wade's comments. I didn't pay close attention to who the hosts were, but one of them said flat-out that Hoiberg is not a NBA coach, citing that he's had so many trust/control issues with his players to believe that he is NBA-capable at this point. The other two hosts said they didn't totally agree, but didn't go into it in much detail.

I'm not totally sure who I agree with. I don't really feel confident in saying that placing Hoiberg somewhere else (say, the T-Wolves) would make him a better coach.
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It hasn't surprised me that the players don't have a ton of respect for Fred. He's not a guy who grinded his way up the NBA coaching ladder, his college resume is extremely light compared to most coaches who make the leap with a single sweet sixteen appearance being the high mark. He was replacing a guy who was regarded as one of the better coaches in the league and I'm sure it seems like he only got the job because he was friends with the GM to a lot of the players.
 
carvers4math said:
Seems like a time for a BS nose pick picture.
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giphy.gif
 
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runbikeswim said:
I don't think NBA players understand what a coach is, quite frankly. They think they are the star and everything revolves around themselves, if something isn't working, it is because 1. because management didn't bring the right players in to play with them, 2. the other players don't mesh with their "style," or 3. the coach.

Never do they fault their their own self-controlled issues such as shooting %, ft %, turnovers, etc. The culture of the NBA player is incredibly self-centered in general.

There was a saying/joke that ran around for quite a while that a smart women marries an NFL player, not an NBA player, because the only NBA player who doesn't cheat on his wife was Grant Hill.

The fact that Butler and other players used to run their mouths about Thibs being TOO demanding, them management hires a "players" player, now they complain he isn't demanding enough, tells me where the blame lies.
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The front office didn't have to listen to the players, but they did. Big mistake.
I doubt Butler, Wade, or Rondo pull this stuff if Popovich were their coach - or Budenholzer of the Hawks - or Thibodeau certainly. I also think the players are waiting for their HC to grab the team by the throat and coach it, demand things - Fred won't do it.
The dirty secret is that the intense Thibs actually overachieved with his roster; he made Noah a first Team all-NBA center. Think about that. The Bulls front office mistakenly thought his method stood in the way of even more victories, maybe even a title. Remember Fred has proclaimed before each season that he has a roster that could contend for an NBA title. Laid-back Fred, who looks invisible on the bench, doesn't appear to have a plan to me.
 
Velo (wearing blue): ...and that is why Bill Self has done such an impressive job at KU.

Carvers: Have a Bill Self booger picking gif. When you defend Bill Self you sound like a Jayhawk.

<Velo posts booger gif>

Carvers: Better?

Velo (now wearing cardinal): Better!
 
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runbikeswim said:
Cavs aren't - have you missed all the drama about Lebron whining about management not bringing in Carmelo this week? Or his hissy fits to get Kevin Love previously? or the dirty looks Lebron gives his coach.

Spurs I'll grant you.
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I think you're combining two stories, LeBron wanting the Cavs to get another point guard and the Knicks offering Melo for Love and the Cavs turning them down.

And hey LeBron's method has worked in Cleveland, that front office has historically been a mess, there's no reason he shouldn't be driving them to build the team in the way he wants. He came back to Cleveland to win titles. He didn't come back to waste the rest of his prime developing Andrew Wiggins.
 
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Tornado man said:
The front office didn't have to listen to the players, but they did. Big mistake.
I doubt Butler, Wade, or Rondo pull this stuff if Popovich were their coach - or Budenholzer of the Hawks - or Thibodeau certainly. I also think the players are waiting for their HC to grab the team by the throat and coach it, demand things - Fred won't do it.
The dirty secret is that the intense Thibs actually overachieved with his roster; he made Noah a first Team all-NBA center. Think about that. The Bulls front office mistakenly thought his method stood in the way of even more victories, maybe even a title. Remember Fred has proclaimed before each season that he has a roster that could contend for an NBA title. Laid-back Fred, who looks invisible on the bench, doesn't appear to have a plan to me.
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In the regular season, and I don't think this was a secret at all. Their front office wanted him to pull back in the regular season, even if it meant a few less wins to not have an injured, exhausted team come playoff time each year, which wasn't a crazy idea at all. Hiring Fred has solved that problem in one way though, you don't have to worry about saving anything for the playoffs if you don't make them.
 
CyJack13 said:
I think you're combining two stories, LeBron wanting the Cavs to get another point guard and the Knicks offering Melo for Love and the Cavs turning them down.

And hey LeBron's method has worked in Cleveland, that front office has historically been a mess, there's no reason he shouldn't be driving them to build the team in the way he wants. He came back to Cleveland to win titles. He didn't come back to waste the rest of his prime developing Andrew Wiggins.
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Yes two stories, and two different times, with the same theme, LeBron trying to publically shame his front office into doing what he wants
 
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runbikeswim said:
Yes two stories, and two different times, with the same theme, LeBron trying to publically shame his front office into doing what he wants
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That's called taking care of business. The Cavs aren't defending champs because they have David Griffin as GM.
 
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CyJack13 said:
That's called taking care of business. The Cavs aren't defending champs because they have David Griffin as GM.
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Agree. It's no big secret who's running that organization. It's just a question of him telling them what they need to do in public or behind closed doors.

But Lebron is a special case. There isn't another player in the league who has the power over everyone else in the franchise. He's just using his leverage.
 
ThatllDoCy said:
I heard that Fred likes Larry Brown's quote that he doesn't want to Coach effort. Yeah, well he did.

I love Fred, but maybe Gar will retire Fred will accept a GM or Asst GM Role.
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It's really disappointing that coaching guys making millions to play the game requires coaching effort. If only there were a few more evenly skilled players at the top perhaps guys like that would fear for their jobs if they mail it in regularly.
 
ThatllDoCy said:
Hoiberg is going to lise his job barring a turnaround. At least, that is what is going around Chicago.
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Seriously? Most gurus I hear suggest he wasn't given the team he needed and not his fault. Now if you said the front office Gar/Pax are fired, and new management wants a different coach, then it 'might' be more of a possibility.
 
Fred's in the middle of a freaking mess.

Sorry for the double post, never done that before Maybe cause it is just really a freaking mess..
 
LOL at Butler. You ain't Kobe; you're a nice player on a bad team.

i hope for Fred's sake he gets fired so he can get out of that **** show
 
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