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Caitlyn Jenner

cyrocksmypants said:
I disagree. In fact, it seems like a ton of the stuff that was going on mentally are BECAUSE of how she was physically. Seems like she's starting to make a lot of peace with herself.
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Suicide rates for transgendered folks are much, much higher than both the general population and lesbian/gay/bisexual populations. Why is that? Not sure (and the specific study that looked at it notes more research is needed). But it's a fact.

http://www.speakingofsuicide.com/2015/01/02/transgender-suicide/
 
HitItHard58 said:
You fact check those numbers or are those rough estimates? Weird to me that someone who seems to be a part of the 99% would even bother to call out someone in the 30% or are you actually part of the 1% crew? Confusing stuff.
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To summarize. I don't care what this person does with their body or their sexual preference. I also don't care whether someone agrees or disagrees with this persons choices. I'm not the judge who decides whether it's right for a person to change their gender. If someone doesn't agree with me I don't think that their wrong just that they have a different opinion/take on the subject. I feel the same about a wide range of topics.

Angie mentioned LGBT (assuming she wasn't being intolerant by leaving out qia), sexism, ageism, etc. and being intolerant. Intolerant is a strong word and it means different things to different people. If you don't hire someone because they are in a polygamist that is one thing, if on the other hand you just don't believe a man should have multiple wives, that's another thing. Are both of these examples considered intolerant? To turn it around are you being intolerant to me if you don't believe the same things I believe?
 
CtownCyclone said:
Suicide rates for transgendered folks are much, much higher than both the general population and lesbian/gay/bisexual populations. Why is that? Not sure (and the specific study that looked at it notes more research is needed). But it's a fact.

http://www.speakingofsuicide.com/2015/01/02/transgender-suicide/
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I feel like you're just helping make my point. I can almost assuredly say it's because of the anguish they have to go through in living the life they feel they should and living the life society tells them they're supposed to.
 
Angie said:
Eh, I sort of disagree. I don't like intolerance. I don't like it with LGBT, I don't like it with racism, I don't like it with sexism, ageism, I don't like it at all. I think it's icky. I haven't said anything, but there are several posts in this thread that are pretty close-minded. It's their thing if they want to look uneducated and bad, I guess.
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I hope I am not pushing the envelope by saying this but here's something along these lines that I do not like... in today's society when everyone is supposedly striving for equality we're still essentially segregating everything by putting labels on everything in the process. If you want to be treated equally then we don't need "special" designations/labels and groups for everything, hold special events and rallies that IMO are basically are just ways of saying "look at me, if you don't like it then you're a bad person" yet when that supposed "positive" attention brings on negative responses then we as a society are so quick to start using the racists, sexist, or whatever negative terms in defense. While I may not agree with certain lifestyle choices as I'm sure others probably don't agree with all mine either it's sad we can't just treat people as people and not feel the need to try and tell someone what they believe in is wrong and because of that you are wrong, intolerant, bad person, etc. I don't really want to use any specific examples or scenarios because knowing the audience here it will just turn into 1 big mess but I will be damned if anyone ever calls me intolerant because I don't believe in something that they do. I don't force my beliefs on others, and I expect the same in return from others too. I have friends that I may not agree with certain aspects of their life but I treat them just as I would anyone else and I don't recall times either of us have ever tried to change the views/beliefs of each other because in a perfect world that is how it should be, you treat each other equally and respect that you may not have the same beliefs and views and know that you probably are not going to change them.
 
CYdTracked said:
I hope I am not pushing the envelope by saying this but here's something along these lines that I do not like... in today's society when everyone is supposedly striving for equality we're still essentially segregating everything by putting labels on everything in the process. If you want to be treated equally then we don't need "special" designations/labels and groups for everything, hold special events and rallies that IMO are basically are just ways of saying "look at me, if you don't like it then you're a bad person" yet when that supposed "positive" attention brings on negative responses then we as a society are so quick to start using the racists, sexist, or whatever negative terms in defense. While I may not agree with certain lifestyle choices as I'm sure others probably don't agree with all mine either it's sad we can't just treat people as people and not feel the need to try and tell someone what they believe in is wrong and because of that you are wrong, intolerant, bad person, etc. I don't really want to use any specific examples or scenarios because knowing the audience here it will just turn into 1 big mess but I will be damned if anyone ever calls me intolerant because I don't believe in something that they do. I don't force my beliefs on others, and I expect the same in return from others too. I have friends that I may not agree with certain aspects of their life but I treat them just as I would anyone else and I don't recall times either of us have ever tried to change the views/beliefs of each other because in a perfect world that is how it should be, you treat each other equally and respect that you may not have the same beliefs and views and know that you probably are not going to change them.
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In a perfect world we wouldn't need Affirmative Action either. Unfortunately for all involved, this ain't a perfect world.
 
dmclone said:
To summarize. I don't care what this person does with their body or their sexual preference. I also don't care whether someone agrees or disagrees with this persons choices. I'm not the judge who decides whether it's right for a person to change their gender. If someone doesn't agree with me I don't think that their wrong just that they have a different opinion/take on the subject. I feel the same about a wide range of topics.

Angie mentioned LGBT (assuming she wasn't being intolerant by leaving out qia), sexism, ageism, etc. and being intolerant. Intolerant is a strong word and it means different things to different people. If you don't hire someone because they are in a polygamist that is one thing, if on the other hand you just don't believe a man should have multiple wives, that's another thing. Are both of these examples considered intolerant? To turn it around are you being intolerant to me if you don't believe the same things I believe?
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Intolerance doesn't just mean that you aren't hiring or acting based off of prejudices and beliefs; it also means that you are unwilling to accept views, beliefs, or behavior that differ from your own. Your first example is not only an example of intolerance, it's an example of discrimination. Your second example isn't really germane, as polygamy is illegal. If you used the example, "if on the other hand you just don't believe a man should be gay/black/old," it would be more in line with what we're discussing.

Yes, I am intolerant of intolerance. That's absolutely the case. I support your right to think and say it, as that is part of what makes America great - but I also think it makes people who feel that way look disgusting and uneducated.

The other thing that really gets to me is when people try to use Christianity to defend their being judgmental (which is not what you're doing here, but an aside). I say that as a Christian.
 
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Angie said:
Intolerance doesn't just mean that you aren't hiring or acting based off of prejudices and beliefs; it also means that you are unwilling to accept views, beliefs, or behavior that differ from your own. Your first example is not only an example of intolerance, it's an example of discrimination. Your second example isn't really germane, as polygamy is illegal. If you used the example, "if on the other hand you just don't believe a man should be gay/black/old," it would be more in line with what we're discussing.

Yes, I am intolerant of intolerance. That's absolutely the case. I support your right to think and say it, as that is part of what makes America great - but I also think it makes people who feel that way look disgusting and uneducated.

The other thing that really gets to me is when people try to use Christianity to defend their being judgmental (which is not what you're doing here, but an aside). I say that as a Christian.
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I am intolerant of your intolerance to intolerance.
 
CtownCyclone said:
Suicide rates for transgendered folks are much, much higher than both the general population and lesbian/gay/bisexual populations. Why is that? Not sure (and the specific study that looked at it notes more research is needed). But it's a fact.

http://www.speakingofsuicide.com/2015/01/02/transgender-suicide/
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You don't need a study t know it's because of societies reaction or intolerance to their particular lifestyle. The stigmas that are associated with and the fear of how those they love will react to them. Many of them live in the closet because of this, and in a sense they are forced to live a lie. They are not allowed to be themselves therefore get depressed.
 
Angie said:
Eh, I sort of disagree. I don't like intolerance. I don't like it with LGBT, I don't like it with racism, I don't like it with sexism, ageism, I don't like it at all. I think it's icky. I haven't said anything, but there are several posts in this thread that are pretty close-minded. It's their thing if they want to look uneducated and bad, I guess.
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Hmmm and one of them has the gadsden flag as his avitar........ I wonder what affiliation the rest of them are?

No i don't..... and they wonder why they have an image problem of being bigoted/sexist.....
 
CYdTracked said:
I hope I am not pushing the envelope by saying this but here's something along these lines that I do not like... in today's society when everyone is supposedly striving for equality we're still essentially segregating everything by putting labels on everything in the process. If you want to be treated equally then we don't need "special" designations/labels and groups for everything, hold special events and rallies that IMO are basically are just ways of saying "look at me, if you don't like it then you're a bad person" yet when that supposed "positive" attention brings on negative responses then we as a society are so quick to start using the racists, sexist, or whatever negative terms in defense. While I may not agree with certain lifestyle choices as I'm sure others probably don't agree with all mine either it's sad we can't just treat people as people and not feel the need to try and tell someone what they believe in is wrong and because of that you are wrong, intolerant, bad person, etc. I don't really want to use any specific examples or scenarios because knowing the audience here it will just turn into 1 big mess but I will be damned if anyone ever calls me intolerant because I don't believe in something that they do. I don't force my beliefs on others, and I expect the same in return from others too. I have friends that I may not agree with certain aspects of their life but I treat them just as I would anyone else and I don't recall times either of us have ever tried to change the views/beliefs of each other because in a perfect world that is how it should be, you treat each other equally and respect that you may not have the same beliefs and views and know that you probably are not going to change them.
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So you never categorize yourself in any way...... just a person huh? You ever participate in any 4th of july celebrations?
 
I've been in some Twitter drama the past couple days with my stance on the issue and once again the most annoying thing to hear is that I'm so close minded on the issue. Just because I disagree with his life choices does not make me close minded or intolerant. I would make some further points but I don't think this thread needs to go to the cave
 
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