Realignment Megathread (All The Moves)

[MountainManHawk]

I still see no way it’s anything but bluster. They can’t do it without collusion with BIG, as BIG will become a P1 if SEC goes it alone

Based on my very flawed analysis of social media, Georgia fans in particular have been in meltdown mode the last year over “how ruined college sports has become”

It’s not surprising to now see so many of their leaders being out front on leaving- I’m guessing they’ve been flaming their base for months. Taking the ball and going home in response to the BIG becoming the top conference

Granted it is common across all the SEC

I’m assuming it will be like Covid where the conferences make an announcement about their intentions, and then if other conferences don’t eventually follow suit they might have to adjust accordingly.

A vote to secede could also mean a lot of different things. For instance I see Georgia talk about never playing any teams other than SEC and forming a new playoff with only SEC teams, etc.

It seems more likely to me that they stop short of that and just announce that they are going to a self governance model while trying to keep everything else the same.

Pollard is obviously already on record saying that if they try that he is going to attempt to force them out in all sports. I have no idea if he could get the votes to actually bar them from all NCAA competitions if they really try to call his bluff.

 

[SolterraCyclone]

I’m assuming it will be like Covid where the conferences make an announcement about their intentions, and then if other conferences don’t eventually follow suit they might have to adjust accordingly.

A vote to secede could also mean a lot of different things. For instance I see Georgia talk about never playing any teams other than SEC and forming a new playoff with only SEC teams, etc.

It seems more likely to me that they stop short of that and just announce that they are going to a self governance model while trying to keep everything else the same.

Pollard is obviously already on record saying that if they try that he is going to attempt to force them out in all sports. I have no idea if he could get the votes to actually bar them from all NCAA competitions if they really try to call his bluff.

That would be the death knell for college football, regionalizing the sport even further. The southeast is not a wealthy enough area of the country to sustain a regional league at these investment levels.

NASCAR would have more reach than SEC-only football and it is majorly struggling

 

[MountainManHawk]

I think Cody is probably correct here that if the SEC secedes, they will still face the same legal challenges the NCAA is facing.

The first time the SEC tries to make a kid ineligible, there will likely be a lawsuit.

The SEC would have a better chance of winning the lawsuit though as they could say the kid is welcome to go try and play for a different conference if they don’t like it.

The article also includes some stuff on state labor laws that I’m not sure I understand fully but I agree with the gist of the article, which is that getting a CBA in place would be very difficult for the SEC.

According to this, the state labor laws can be avoided by just having them be employees of the conference instead of the school.

I still think it will be difficult to convince the players to sign a CBA (the current system seems to be working really well for the players, why would they sign something that would do away with that?), but maybe the issues that Cody raises about state labor laws are overblown.

 

[SolterraCyclone]

According to this, the state labor laws can be avoided by just having them be employees of the conference instead of the school.

I still think it will be difficult to convince the players to sign a CBA (the current system seems to be working really well for the players, why would they sign something that would do away with that?), but maybe the issues that Cody raises about state labor laws are overblown.

Why would schools agree to this? They’d yield a lot of player control to the league.

I don’t think any professional league operates this way. Players are employees of the team, not the league. If they’re employees of the league, does the SEC determine salary, benefits, etc.?

 

[FinalFourCy]

I’m assuming it will be like Covid where the conferences make an announcement about their intentions, and then if other conferences don’t eventually follow suit they might have to adjust accordingly.



It seems more likely to me that they stop short of that and just announce that they are going to a self governance model while trying to keep everything else the same.

According to this, the state labor laws can be avoided by just having them be employees of the conference instead of the school.

I still think it will be difficult to convince the players to sign a CBA (the current system seems to be working really well for the players, why would they sign something that would do away with that?), but maybe the issues that Cody raises about state labor laws are overblown.

That’s long been one of the hopes.

But that’s basically 3rd party ownership, the slippery slope to things like investor owned teams or leagues. I’m all for it

Imo saying “we’ll just leave the NCAA and self govern, but everything else stays the same” is wishful thinking. Then again, these leaders naive wishful thinking that big business could be contained by amateurism is how we got here

It’s clear that in the resistance to employment and eventually CBA, they’re going to make things worse while trying everything else

SEC vs BIG as IPOs. The former shows better revenue (ratings) but I’d buy the latter. It’s the behemoth that can use M&A

 

[SolterraCyclone]

According to this, the state labor laws can be avoided by just having them be employees of the conference instead of the school.

I still think it will be difficult to convince the players to sign a CBA (the current system seems to be working really well for the players, why would they sign something that would do away with that?), but maybe the issues that Cody raises about state labor laws are overblown.

I’d also be curious if this is actually true. Since Covid I’ve worked for companies headquartered in California and Iowa, but live in Colorado. I’m pretty sure my companies have still had to abide by Colorado state laws. Both companies only had certain states they’d hire from for this reason (or so I thought. Maybe it was more due to tax implications).

 

[1UNI2ISU]

What's funny about this is that Cody's blatantly obvious plan was to make enough noise to get that SEC invite and he just napalmed that bridge because his ego just couldn't help itself.

 

[CyCrazy]

What's funny about this is that Cody's blatantly obvious plan was to make enough noise to get that SEC invite and he just napalmed that bridge because his ego just couldn't help itself.

He couldn't be this dense to not realize the backlash that would ensue could he?

 

[1UNI2ISU]

He couldn't be this dense to not realize the backlash that would ensue could he?

The guy thinks he's the savior of college athletics and pumped millions of dollars of his own money into making sure this was the outcome. Of course he could be that dense.

 

[FinalFourCy]

What's funny about this is that Cody's blatantly obvious plan was to make enough noise to get that SEC invite and he just napalmed that bridge because his ego just couldn't help itself.

That’s a misread on both his objectives and motives imo

But regardless, he’ll be able to sleep well at night knowing he’s still a billionaire and can fund Tech through turbulence

It’s the supporters of other schools that will have trouble from any collateral damage from this

 

[isucy86]

Why can't you have both ,strong academics and solid sports programs, NW, Michigan, Vanderbilt and many others do, it does not have to be one or the other. Do you believe that if ISU or like schools dropped down that money would somehow start flowing to the academic side of the university?

Whether we like it or not, a universities athletic teams is a major driving factor of these schools bringing in students, unless you are an elite academic institution. Indiana got more positive press for their university these past couple year than anything that has happened there in the last 25 years, all because of the success of their football team, which means more students enrolling there, a few will be scholarship athletes.

I question your reading comprehension. Obviously, being elite in sports and athletics is the goal. The one thing I love about Jamie Pollard is he has built a culture where winning, strong academic results and developing solid young people is expected and not just lip service.

My point is, if there becomes a P2 and Iowa State is excluded, we would be just fine in football. People's narrative seems to be if we aren't part of the CFP path, ZERO people will show up for football games. There will be no football revenue. Will ISU continue to draw 60k to games, maybe not. But I have confidence if we are in a conference with K-State, Okie State, Colorado, Arizona, BYU, TCU, Cincy, etc. that Cyclone football will still draw 40k+ to games. And I would hope more.

Will our budget still be $120M? Probably not, but smart people will figure it out.

 

[1SEIACLONE]

I question your reading comprehension. Obviously, being elite in sports and athletics is the goal. The one thing I love about Jamie Pollard is he has built a culture where winning, strong academic results and developing solid young people is expected and not just lip service.

My point is, if there becomes a P2 and Iowa State is excluded, we would be just fine in football. People's narrative seems to be if we aren't part of the CFP path, ZERO people will show up for football games. There will be no football revenue. Will ISU continue to draw 60k to games, maybe not. But I have confidence if we are in a conference with K-State, Okie State, Colorado, Arizona, BYU, TCU, Cincy, etc. that Cyclone football will still draw 40k+ to games. And I would hope more.

Will our budget still be $120M? Probably not, but smart people will figure it out.

No need to throw out insults, but if you think that ISU will not make the cut and will be fine with it, and not be harmed is beyond crazy. The reason that we still draw well is the hope of getting in the playoff or the championship game. You take away those chances and a lot of fans are going to find something else to do on a Saturday afternoon in the fall.
I expect to see season tickets drop a lot from Campbell leaving and taking our better players with him. We went from being one of the conference favorites to hoping we finish .500 for the year.

The current system is not tenable for teams like ISU, we do not have the funds to continue to throw more and more money at the ever increasing costs. Pollard stated we are using our reserves to pay out the $20 million in NIL currently, buy only have reserves to do that a few years. So if the attendance drop is 20K like you saying, that means millions less in money coming into the system, we can't cut more sports, close to having enough now. ISU has been able to have enough money to put a competitive team on the field that past decade, without more funds coming in, that will not be possible in the next decade.

 

[FinalFourCy]

we would be just fine in football. People's narrative seems to be if we aren't part of the CFP path, ZERO people will show up for football games. There will be no football revenue. Will ISU continue to draw 60k to games, maybe not. But I have confidence if we are in a conference with K-State, Okie State, Colorado, Arizona, BYU, TCU, Cincy, etc. that Cyclone football will still draw 40k+ to games. And I would hope more.

Will our budget still be $120M? Probably not, but smart people will figure it out.

Let’s drop the strawman

No one is saying zero fans or no football revenue

But it won’t be commensurate of current costs or output. It will be divested, which will impact attendance.

Even worse, basketball is the biggest casualty. Afterall, JP is advocating for a split across all sports.

Even if that doesn’t occur, schools with mid football and basketball will struggle mightily to keep up in basketball. There’s a reason why no G league football conference currently has basketball at same level as P4. Now imagine P2 with basketball salary cap millions above mid Big 12

This will get even worse in future when CBB postseason is redone and P2 (with KU and other bluebloods) are keeping most of the revenue

And if the split is for all sports, basketball is absolutely tanked. No chance of competing

M2 schools will either find a way to get to top level, or they’ll divest. Playing Cincy, BYU, Houston, KSU and UCF in new FCS, the first time ISU isn’t in top level, isn’t drawing 40k. And TJ has moved on, and basketball at pre-Orr level

 

[isucy86]

No need to throw out insults, but if you think that ISU will not make the cut and will be fine with it, and not be harmed is beyond crazy. The reason that we still draw well is the hope of getting in the playoff or the championship game. You take away those chances and a lot of fans are going to find something else to do on a Saturday afternoon in the fall.
I expect to see season tickets drop a lot from Campbell leaving and taking our better players with him. We went from being one of the conference favorites to hoping we finish .500 for the year.

The current system is not tenable for teams like ISU, we do not have the funds to continue to throw more and more money at the ever increasing costs. Pollard stated we are using our reserves to pay out the $20 million in NIL currently, buy only have reserves to do that a few years. So if the attendance drop is 20K like you saying, that means millions less in money coming into the system, we can't cut more sports, close to having enough now. ISU has been able to have enough money to put a competitive team on the field that past decade, without more funds coming in, that will not be possible in the next decade.

Think outside the box.

If Iowa State isn't part of a P2- then Cook, Pollard and all other university presidents and athletic directors outside the P2 have to reset their college sport model.

So if university leadership projects revenues for a typical school among Big12/ACC/Pac12/Etc. will reasonably be only $75M annually, then the athletic department structure will need to reflect the money available. Would that mean the following topics are on the table? Yes

• Fewer Olympic Sports
• Sport Specific Spending Caps (impacting coach salaries, facilities, travel costs, etc)
• Right-size Athletics Department salaries & staffing levels.
• Does the House Settlement still apply with a P2 & Others structure?
• If there is a P2, how does that impact Mens & Womens basketball?

 

[Kinch]

According to this, the state labor laws can be avoided by just having them be employees of the conference instead of the school.

I still think it will be difficult to convince the players to sign a CBA (the current system seems to be working really well for the players, why would they sign something that would do away with that?), but maybe the issues that Cody raises about state labor laws are overblown.

Regents (and state legislators) have final say for most colleges.

 

[Kinch]

 

[FinalFourCy]

Think outside the box.

If Iowa State isn't part of a P2- then Cook, Pollard and all other university presidents and athletic directors outside the P2 have to reset their college sport model.

So if university leadership projects revenues for a typical school among Big12/ACC/Pac12/Etc. will reasonably be only $75M annually, then the athletic department structure will need to reflect the money available. Would that mean the following topics are on the table? Yes

• Fewer Olympic Sports
• Sport Specific Spending Caps (impacting coach salaries, facilities, travel costs, etc)
• Right-size Athletics Department salaries & staffing levels.
• Does the House Settlement still apply with a P2 & Others structure?
• If there is a P2, how does that impact Mens & Womens basketball?

We don’t need to think outside the box

We have UNI as the model- a school that has to survive without football competing at top level. At a level below other schools in the state

It could be higher given hopefully the media deal would be at least similar to new PAC, but we also would have the disadvantage of being recently demoted. That will kill interest

 

[Kinch]

Let’s drop the strawman

No one is saying zero fans or no football revenue

But it won’t be commensurate of current costs or output. It will be divested, which will impact attendance.

Even worse, basketball is the biggest casualty. Afterall, JP is advocating for a split across all sports.

Even if that doesn’t occur, schools with mid football and basketball will struggle mightily to keep up in basketball. There’s a reason why no G league football conference currently has basketball at same level as P4. Now imagine P2 with basketball salary cap millions above mid Big 12

This will get even worse in future when CBB postseason is redone and P2 (with KU and other bluebloods) are keeping most of the revenue

And if the split is for all sports, basketball is absolutely tanked. No chance of competing

M2 schools will either find a way to get to top level, or they’ll divest. Playing Cincy, BYU, Houston, KSU and UCF in new FCS, the first time ISU isn’t in top level, isn’t drawing 40k. And TJ has moved on, and basketball at pre-Orr level

Do you really think the P2 takes KU and Duke? It’s a net loss money wise for the P2. A big net loss.

 

[FinalFourCy]

Do you really think the P2 takes KU and Duke? It’s a net loss money wise for the P2. A big net loss.

If we’re talking about separation (of at least football), yes

First, you’re assuming equal revenue sharing, which is unlikely. They can expand with partial payouts.

Second, it’s not that big of loss now, and if CBB postseason is redone in similar fashion to CFP, they’ll grab the bluebloods to justify keeping majority of base distributions. Unlikely that all postseason deals were lined up by accident

That doesn’t even get into other factors like consolidation of power benefits that comes with P2 at 40 to 48, basketball’s increased value in streaming era, the benefits to P2 networks of eliminating inventory for entry of new media

 

[MugNight]

Media discourse has SEC and B1G leaders saying maybe they should breakaway to be with peers who have similar (ahem, better) values.

It’s gonna be sickening if they do break away to consolidate AND have the moral high ground in the court of public opinion.