Opinions on that INT

[19clone91]

The refs were stuck between two rules of thumb.

On one hand dual possession is supposed to go to the offense, on the other hand you need conclusive evidence to over turn a call on the field.

I think the problem was that the wrong call was made on the field, no matter what they should have called it a TD to be consistent with the rules (the fact that it took the refs about 10 seconds to make a call proves this point), then go back and change it if necessary. But since they called it an INT on the field, then they needed conclusive evidence to overturn it which I dont think exists. The replay officials were stuck between these two rules of thumb and I guess they felt like they had to stick with the call on the field since that call was made first.

That is my guess at least.

 

[HFCS]

Need to see the other angle that shows OSU player’s right hand...can’t really tell from that clip, but I’m starting to see that as a touchdown or incomplete due to the process of a catch.

It seems like they flip out more about "process of a catch" in NFL than in college. In the NFL I really don't think they'd have called that an OK St interception.

College football now has a similar rule too but it seems like they are way less consistent actually requiring it:
The receiver must complete the process by performing “an act common to the game” or by maintaining “complete and continuous control” if he contacts the ground while catching the ball.

When viewed through "complete the process" it would have to be incomplete or a TD. There's absolutely no way the process ends up with another player having the ball that soon and his hand on it the whole time.

Does the OK State player have complete and continuous control? Obviously he does not. Not even close. I hate to say it but this is a scenario where it looked like a tough but correct call live and looks more and more like the wrong call the more you analyze the rules.

 

[Doc]

Damn, I go out for a bit thinking that was a legit INT. Wow, we did get a little screwed.

 

[HFCS]

The refs were stuck between two rules of thumb.

On one hand dual possession is supposed to go to the offense, on the other hand you need conclusive evidence to over turn a call on the field.

I think the problem was that the wrong call was made on the field, no matter what they should have called it a TD to be consistent with the rules (the fact that it took the refs about 10 seconds to make a call proves this point), then go back and change it if necessary. But since they called it an INT on the field, then they needed conclusive evidence to overturn it which I dont think exists. The replay officials were stuck between these two rules of thumb and I guess they felt like they had to stick with the call on the field since that call was made first.

That is my guess at least.

I'm fine with them making the call on the field that it wasn't dual possession and they couldn't overturn that part (that part is subjective and difficult). But the more I look at it the OK State player just never completed any process of catching the ball. That's in the rules as well as the dual possession and he 100% did not. There is definitely enough video evidence to say he didn't complete the process. I don't think Murdock cleanly caught the ball in bounds either...it probably is incomplete if you really look exactly at the letter of the law.

 

[FinalFourCy]

The refs were stuck between two rules of thumb.

On one hand dual possession is supposed to go to the offense, on the other hand you need conclusive evidence to over turn a call on the field.

I think the problem was that the wrong call was made on the field, no matter what they should have called it a TD to be consistent with the rules (the fact that it took the refs about 10 seconds to make a call proves this point), then go back and change it if necessary. But since they called it an INT on the field, then they needed conclusive evidence to overturn it which I dont think exists. The replay officials were stuck between these two rules of thumb and I guess they felt like they had to stick with the call on the field since that call was made first.

That is my guess at least.

Except they confirmed it, which really makes you wonder what the hell they were looking at, or whether they are unbiased in their subjective decisions. Then you consider the inconsistency on PI, and it’s clear those refs ****** us.

 

[CNECloneFan]

Bottom line IMO is that they should have gotten the ball to Montgomery on that last series. A short pass underneath and let him score. Those endzone fade passes are a lot to ask of a freshman QB

 

[HFCS]

Except they confirmed it, which really makes you wonder what the hell they were looking at, or whether they are unbiased in their subjective decisions. Then you consider the inconsistency on PI, and it’s clear those refs ****** us.

I think because they CONFIRMED it is why on Monday they need to come out and say exactly what in that footage shows OK State with clear sole possession of the ball completing a process of a catch.

That video evidence doesn't exist so it'll be an apology or some nonsense, but it requires addressing.

If it "stands" they don't need to issue anything for that call but the non call on PI just the play before is still a blown call and gift for OK State.

 

[jdoggivjc]

The refs were stuck between two rules of thumb.

On one hand dual possession is supposed to go to the offense, on the other hand you need conclusive evidence to over turn a call on the field.

I think the problem was that the wrong call was made on the field, no matter what they should have called it a TD to be consistent with the rules (the fact that it took the refs about 10 seconds to make a call proves this point), then go back and change it if necessary. But since they called it an INT on the field, then they needed conclusive evidence to overturn it which I dont think exists. The replay officials were stuck between these two rules of thumb and I guess they felt like they had to stick with the call on the field since that call was made first.

That is my guess at least.

I'm fine with them making the call on the field that it wasn't dual possession and they couldn't overturn that part (that part is subjective and difficult). But the more I look at it the OK State player just never completed any process of catching the ball. That's in the rules as well as the dual possession and he 100% did not. There is definitely enough video evidence to say he didn't complete the process. I don't think Murdock cleanly caught the ball in bounds either...it probably is incomplete if you really look exactly at the letter of the law.

All of these are reasons why I'm not mad about that play in particular. The mor I look at that the more I think it's TD ISU, but 1. I'm biased as hell, and 2. we're still looking at this, what - 1, 2 hours later? The refs had seconds and minutes to decide that, and while I don't agree with their outcome, at least I understand why that outcome happened.

I'll say it before, and I'll say it again - I'm much more upset about the inconsistency in holding and PI calls.

 

[HFCS]

Bottom line IMO is that they should have gotten the ball to Montgomery on that last series. A short pass underneath and let him score. Those endzone fade passes are a lot to ask of a freshman QB

Here's the thing...let's say they call PI correctly against Lazard the play before. Now it's 1st and goal from the 2. I think it's a lot more likely the coaches try a running play with DM at that point.

 

[CNECloneFan]

Here's the thing...let's say they call PI correctly against Lazard the play before. Now it's 1st and goal from the 2. I think it's a lot more likely the coaches try a running play with DM at that point.

I agree. That no call on PI was terrible, especially after Okie lites do-overs on their 2 point conversion

 

[HFCS]

All of these are reasons why I'm not mad about that play in particular. The mor I look at that the more I think it's TD ISU, but 1. I'm biased as hell, and 2. we're still looking at this, what - 1, 2 hours later? The refs had seconds and minutes to decide that, and while I don't agree with their outcome, at least I understand why that outcome happened.

I'll say it before, and I'll say it again - I'm much more upset about the inconsistency in holding and PI calls.

I could have made the same mistake/interpretation as it happened with the interception even being a biased ISU fan.

The only way I wouldn't have called PI on OK State the play before having watched the rest of the game was if I was actively cheering for OK State or against ISU. A bad call is the only explanation there.

In the end though the "CONFIRMED" call is still complete BS. There's no reason for that at all whether you take 5 seconds or 5 years you could never CONFIRM that interception call where the guy barely ever has the ball in bounds and the other player has an arm/hand on it as well.

 

[jdoggivjc]

Bottom line IMO is that they should have gotten the ball to Montgomery on that last series. A short pass underneath and let him score. Those endzone fade passes are a lot to ask of a freshman QB

I would have been a lot more comfortable giving the ball to Montgomery in open space than just handing off to him and having him fight for the TD. Yes, he has an uncanny ability to make plays after contact, but in that situation he's likely to get buried, and if he gets buried, that's a lot of time off the clock and potentially a wasted down killing the clock.

 

[ForbinsAscynt]

What about the missed hold on Okie State's last TD?

Can't speak to this from where I was sitting but doesn't surprise me. Blatant holds are missed in every game at every level

 

[CYEATHAWK]

I agree. That no call on PI was terrible, especially after Okie lites do-overs on their 2 point conversion

Yes, the INT. call was tough. The blatant holding on Washington right in front of the official for their go ahead TD was not. Would they have scored even if called.......who knows. But like I and many here have stated........after they had diarrhea of the whistle during their missed two point conversions......it's like they all drank a bottle of pepto bismol and got all bound up.

 

[kcbob79clone]

Touchdown, didn't read all the posts. Has Blum weighed in yet?

 

[Rods79]

His other arm is behind his back, no where near the ball.

On initial contact, looks like it, but on TV the angle from the ISU sideline appeared to show the OSU player getting his right hand on the ball after the initial struggle before going to ground while Marchie still only had one hand on it pinned to the defender. I don’t know though...had too little time to process that angle. The other angle looks like touchdown or incomplete.

Like others, I’m still more upset at the blatant no-calls and the fact that it was “confirmed”.

 

[HFCS]

I would have been a lot more comfortable giving the ball to Montgomery in open space than just handing off to him and having him fight for the TD. Yes, he has an uncanny ability to make plays after contact, but in that situation he's likely to get buried, and if he gets buried, that's a lot of time off the clock and potentially a wasted down killing the clock.

As strong as Lanning and DM are we haven't done well all year going right up the middle. I feel like some teams where we've had less strong runners and much worse pass protection were able to run inside better somehow.

From the 4 or 5 I think I pass until 4th down and then anything is in play. If we had got the PI to make it 1st and goal from the 2 I think I would have wanted to give it to DM off tackle on 1st down and then spike after if we didn't get it for two more downs after that with potential 4th down being another possible 1-2 yard run.

 

[cyclonedave25]

 

[Spam]

Touchdown, didn't read all the posts. Has Blum weighed in yet?

Brent Blum‏ @brentblum
By rule in dual possession situations, ball goes to passing team. Therefore, officials ruled OSU defender had possession solely. For what that's worth.

10:36 PM - 11 Nov 2017

 

[CRcyclone6]

No doubt it was an int. Some of you...

After further review...a bunch of time....this should have been incomplete