Jeff Orr...Super fan?

[marothisu]

If you still think that a racial slur was used, why did Smart apologize to Orr,then? No ifs ands or buts about it.

First of all, I'm not saying a racial slur was used or not, but I could see why he would apologize for it:

1) Because he represents Oklahoma State University and his use of physical violence was inexcusable
2) Because if he swallows his pride and apologizes publicly, the media can stop making such a big deal about something that wasn't really that big of a deal.
3) It shows NBA organizations who are looking at drafting Smart that they shouldn't question his character and the incident was a fluke.


I've worked in corporate types of environments long enough to know that when something bad happens, you move on with it and you listen to what your superiors tell you to do for damage control. The more you fight it, the worse off it ends up for everybody.

 

[JAB]

Pretty sure he was making a point on free speech....but your kinda busy trolling...so might have missed it,


anyway....the video doesn't do much for me. Orr texting someone saying and admitting he said something real bad combined with Smarts reaction....leads me to think it was more than "piece of crap".

Your ticket..is not a free pass to be a moron, his scholarship is not a piece of paper that says hate speech is ok because I'm a full ride athlete.

whoooa there mattyice, whether you believe it or not, I've been a Cyclone fan for 42 years.

I'm also fairly well versed on race relations and civil rights and my questions for you are:

where is your evidence of "hate speech"?
is there a possibility that Smart might have misconstrued a white man's "piece of crap...." has racist?

 

[marothisu]

is there a possibility that Smart might have misconstrued a white man's "piece of crap...." has racist?

Of course there's a possibility but that doesn't give Smart an excuse to act out violently for it.

 

[mattyice]

whoooa there mattyice, whether you believe it or not, I've been a Cyclone fan for 42 years.

I'm also fairly well versed on race relations and civil rights and my questions for you are:

where is your evidence of "hate speech"?
is there a possibility that Smart might have misconstrued a white man's "piece of crap...." has racist?

Ha...got me by 5 years.....oh no no....wàsnt questioning your fandom...sorry if that's how it came off.

sure...there's a real possibility he misheard it, it's a bad misunderstanding and unfortunate event......I'm just speculating....as we do on this board....that given what little information we have...I personally tend to side with Smarts version of events. Doesn't mean I condone what he did.....but i do hope some changes come to fan behavior.

 

[MIClone]

If you still think that a racial slur was used, why did Smart apologize to Orr,then? No ifs ands or buts about it.

If you think a racial slur WASN'T used, then why did Jeff Orr apologize and why has he said that he will attend no more TT games this year. It is WAY more understandable why Smart would apologize, even if there is a racial slur, than why Orr would apologize if there wasn't.

 

[JAB]

Really? I stated a fact of why the KKK can say racial **** in the US and get away with it if they're non violent and non threatening about what they say, and not be arrested. If you think that's me "defending" the KKK, then you're not very bright.

Oh for the record, I'm a minority and I very much dislike any organization which preaches hate against any group, especially ones based on generalizations and stereotypes. I'm not defending the KKK. I'm stating how a part of "freedom of speech" in our country works. If you have trouble understanding that, then may God help you. The only prescendent now for which it's illegal to say racial slurs is if you're at work because it creates a hostile environment.


Let me state this more clearly: There was no reason for Marcus Smart to act out physically against someone even if what they said was the N-word. I'm not defending anybody here - I think both Jeff Orr and Marcus Smart are ******* idiots for what they did.

marothisu, what does the KKK First Amendment rights to say racial slurs have anything to do with a fan saying a racial slur at an NCAA athletic event?? And I'm not suggesting Jeff Orr did this. What you don't understand is that a fan does not have the right to make a racial slur at a game - that is justification to immediately remove him/her from the arena and it has nothing to do with First Amendment Rights.

And may God help you if you can't fathom why it is not tolerable to have fans use racial slurs at NCAA games.

Lastly, hardly no one is defending Smart's physical push - there's no excuse.

 

[marothisu]

marothisu, what does the KKK First Amendment rights to say racial slurs have anything to do with a fan saying a racial slur at an NCAA athletic event?? And I'm not suggesting Jeff Orr did this. What you don't understand is that a fan does not have the right to make a racial slur at a game - that is justification to immediately remove him/her from the arena and it has nothing to do with First Amendment Rights.

And may God help you if you can't fathom why it is not tolerable to have fans use racial slurs at NCAA games.

Lastly, hardly no one is defending Smart's physical push - there's no excuse.

You again, are not understanding what I'm saying at all. All I said was that in a court of law, using "he called me a racial slur!" in a non workplace environment would never be a justification for physical violence. It would have to be self defense. I used the KKK as an example of freedom of speech in America and how they are able to say it without having anything happen to them.

I understand your "house rules" point, but this is not talking about house rules, and I'm not making an excuse for Jeff Orr either. He's an idiot too. I'm trying to say that anybody defending Marcus Smart for even reacting is not very bright. There is no justification for what he did at all. Even if someone calls you a name, you walk away unless you need to use self defense. I've been called **** in my life, and I've had death threats against me before just because of who I am. I know exactly what it's like, and in the end, reacting to most people doesn't do ****. It just makes them want to say it more when you react too. If you don't react, they realize they have no power over you and they stop eventually (except the really bad ones).

 

[temperflare]

Oh please, because somebody flops to try to help win a basketball game his integrity is questionable? We've never had players flop or try to get away with something illegal that the refs don't catch to try to win a game? And a reporter on ESPN just reported that he was told by somebody from t-tech that a racial slur was used, but was quick to add that he didn't know what was actually said anymore than anybody else. You don't know that a racial slur wasn't used any more than somebody else thinking that it was, both have been reported. And it's good Orr has also issued a public apology, so time for people to move on. Somehow I doubt some fans will let Smart forget this though, even though he's rightly apologized for something he didn't start.

Flopping isn't disengrnuous and doesn't demonstrate a lack if integrity or class?

Flopping is lying. It's saying, "he hit me", when it didn't happen. It's childish, it's weak, and it demonstrates a lack if character. So, I am not inclined to believe Smart and will not give him the benefit of the doubt.

 

[Rural]

Jeff said he called Smart a "piece of ****" and regrets doing so (I would hope).

 

[mattyice]

Flopping isn't disengrnuous and doesn't demonstrate a lack if integrity or class?

Flopping is lying. It's saying, "he hit me", when it didn't happen. It's childish, it's weak, and it demonstrates a lack if character. So, I am not inclined to believe Smart and will not give him the benefit of the doubt.

Uhhhh no. Flopping is part of the game...selling calls is part of the game. In no way does that link up with a persons integrity....that's idiotic.

 

[bozclone]

Only a few people really know what happened for sure. Both Orr and Smart were wrong in their actions no matter what was truly said. I think the 3 game suspension of Smart is fair and the season suspension of Orr is fair. Hopefully they both have learned from the incident and can be better men going forward. After an incident like this, both are sure to be watched very closely so they better be model citizens.

 

[swarthmoreCY]

Orr speaks the truth about Smart on the court. Well done Jeff Orr, UT and OU thank you.

 

[twocoach]

Heres what I know.....
-Smart melted down and shoved a fan and claimed a racial remark
-Orr texted someone saying he said "something really bad"
-Orr isn't coming to any more games this year
-Orr has a history of crap behavior at games

so if you want to believe Smart made it all up because he was mad in those final seconds and melted down on national tv knowing he's a high draft prospect...and that Orr is guilt ridden over saying "piece of crap" and not coming to any more games over it...and admitting he said something bad (which POC doesn't seem too bad)....knock yourself out. I think you can guess what I think of your intelligence level...but hey...go for it.

Smart clearly lied about what was said to him. There is enough evidence now to show that. My assumption is that he played the race card to his teammates and the refs to try to justify the actions that he knew were wrong. If he told them the truth they would have all told him that the fan was RIGHT and that he is a piece of crap for screwing his team for a childish reaction to a mild incident.

 

[twocoach]

Leave it to the "beaker" to remind us that video evidence is pretty worthless. After all, if video evidence can't help void a dead ball three made between free throws by the other team, why should we expect it to help clarify an allegation of racism?

Just saying that one video alone does not provide enough. As the story has continued to unfold, it appears that the statements of ORr about what he said are accurate and that Smart was lying about it.

 

[Cyientist]

Uhhhh no. Flopping is part of the game...selling calls is part of the game. In no way does that link up with a persons integrity....that's idiotic.

I have absolutely no problem saying that Smart plays the game with a lack of integrity due to his flopping. Just because it has become part of today's game does not make it right. Does ISU have players that flop? Sure they do, I cringe if they get a call because of it.

 

[Cyclone1985]

If you think a racial slur WASN'T used, then why did Jeff Orr apologize and why has he said that he will attend no more TT games this year. It is WAY more understandable why Smart would apologize, even if there is a racial slur, than why Orr would apologize if there wasn't.

Because his taunting caused a blemish on TTU. If he went to another game, the cameras would be focused on him, reporters might ask him questions..... attention, attention, attention.

 

[mattyice]

I have absolutely no problem saying that Smart plays the game with a lack of integrity due to his flopping. Just because it has become part of today's game does not make it right. Does ISU have players that flop? Sure they do, I cringe if they get a call because of it.

Must cringe a lot then....every time Kane flails away on drives, or hogue drops to the floor playing post defense, ejim does that as well....almost every player does it on some fashion. It's part ofnthe game.....

guess Jordan and Kobe played with a lack of integrity too.

 

[Cyientist]

Must cringe a lot then....every time Kane flails away on drives, or hogue drops to the floor playing post defense, ejim does that as well....almost every player does it on some fashion. It's part ofnthe game.....

guess Jordan and Kobe played with a lack of integrity too.

I don't think it is a cut and dry issue, I'd say there is a spectrum from selling a foul (that actually happened) to trying to manufacture a call by blatant flopping. Charges can be hard to get a call unless the defender goes to the ground even if it is a legit charge. If the defender doesn't go to the ground he probably gets the foul called on him, even if he is set. I'd call that selling a foul.

I do cringe when Kane flails. I didn't when Hogue flopped against Nash in OT. I felt that was more of a bail out to not pick up his own 5th more than it was an attempt to get a call on Nash.

When Kobe and Jordan flop, they would have been playing with a lack of integrity at that moment. It definitely didn't define them as players as it didn't define their game.

 

[heitclone]

Deandre Kane said he can't hate on Smart for flopping, because he does it too. What DK did against Smart is a trend that will continue. If guys flop and the offensive player doesn't here a whistle they need to go right at him.

 

[cyeah]

Jeff Orr 2010 Tech vs A&M his reaction to Davis after he dunked on one of Tech's players right before half.
View attachment 24801
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[video=youtube;i0NdJahHN0w]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i0NdJahHN0w#t=29[/video]

Are you posting this to exonerate Orr? I ask because he didn't even use the middle finger, he used the italian (more polite) version. I also think it is interesting that he is at least inside Davis' head enough for Davis to look at him after...

What Orr did there to Davis is definitely not that bad.