Izaiah Brockington commits

[SolarGarlic]

None of them had played a minute at the time they were signed. If we are going to make comparisons, whether they're debatable or not, to be fair we need to view them in the same context...which is what we knew/know at the time of each. Hindsight skews the comparison and should be ignored. If we want to revisit this 3 or 4 years from now, that's a different story.

Apparently everyone's forgotten the concern at the time about the baggage that came with some of those signings. There was legitimate concern whether it was going to work out, and from what I heard in regards to Royce, it was FAR closer to not working out than most will ever know.

If the at the time perceived upside between the two groups were the same, the group without the character issues should be rated higher. TJ could have made an even bigger splash with this first class had he recruited under the same standards as Fred, but chose to not. That only reinforces the argument that he has out of the gate recruited at a higher level than Fred...which was my original point.

Yeah, sorry, that's just super weak.

We all remember the baggage. The strategy was highly criticized at the beginning of the Hoiberg era. But your personal anecdote about White is hilarious. WE KNOW WHAT HAPPENED! IT DID WORK OUT!

But hey, it almost didn't, and that should be remembered lol

 

[usedcarguy]

Yeah, sorry, that's just super weak.

We all remember the baggage. The strategy was highly criticized at the beginning of the Hoiberg era. But your personal anecdote about White is hilarious. WE KNOW WHAT HAPPENED! IT DID WORK OUT!

But hey, it almost didn't, and that should be remembered lol

It's not weak at all. It's reality. And none of this has anything to with Fred's recruits...other than the fact that TJ was involved with their recruitment as well.

Until this current crop spends a year or two or three on the floor, there's nothing you can say to make the case that they aren't better. But feel free to try if you must.

 

[SolarGarlic]

It's not weak at all. It's reality. And none of this has anything to with Fred's recruits...other than the fact that TJ was involved with their recruitment as well.

Until this current crop spends a year or two or three on the floor, there's nothing you can say to make the case that they aren't better. But feel free to try if you must.

So you're using this current class' unrealized potential as a winning argument over a class that we've already seen succeed? I guess any recruiting class ever can be considered the best ever because, hey, the fab five had produced the same amount (zero) at the time of their commitment.

What an insane and dumb argument. I'm out. Go Cyclones.

 

[usedcarguy]

So you're using this current class' unrealized potential as a winning argument over a class that we've already seen succeed? I guess any recruiting class ever can be considered the best ever because, hey, the fab five had produced the same amount (zero) at the time of their commitment.

What an insane and dumb argument. I'm out. Go Cyclones.

No. This isn't complicated, but maybe for you it is. If this class performs to the level expected at the time of Fred's first class, it will have performed better. Partially because it's more highly touted, and partially because there are no (known) character issues. That's why I qualified the original statement by saying "on paper." But maybe reading comprehension isn't your strong suit. Whatever.

Where you got off the rails was when you decided to take the performance of Fred's class and crown it superior because of hindsight. And since we're on the subject of insane and stupid arguments, that one couldn't fit the mold of both any better. It's ironic because it makes you guilty of the same flawed thinking for which you're accusing me.

But maybe your assumption is that this class will not perform to expectations. That's fine, but you've offered no input as to why that could be the case. That tells me you're either arguing simply for the sake of arguing or have boxed yourself into a corner and have been desperately looking for a way out. Whatever.

Thanks for illustrating what sucks about message boards. Carry on.

 

[TedKumsher]

If he has 1 it will be 100% more than we had last yr.

You better check your math on that one.

 

[jmb]

Bohannon will get frustrated and punch him in the face like he did that Oregon player on that fast break and get T'd up.

I don't remember this. What half? Approximate point in game?

 

[VeloClone]

I don't remember this. What half? Approximate point in game?

 

[jmb]

Punk throwing the elbow for just a bit more at the end.

 

[Gibbon]

Bohannon is up there in the running for my most hated Hawkeye athlete of all time award.

 

[BryceC]

No. This isn't complicated, but maybe for you it is. If this class performs to the level expected at the time of Fred's first class, it will have performed better. Partially because it's more highly touted, and partially because there are no (known) character issues. That's why I qualified the original statement by saying "on paper." But maybe reading comprehension isn't your strong suit. Whatever.

Where you got off the rails was when you decided to take the performance of Fred's class and crown it superior because of hindsight. And since we're on the subject of insane and stupid arguments, that one couldn't fit the mold of both any better. It's ironic because it makes you guilty of the same flawed thinking for which you're accusing me.

But maybe your assumption is that this class will not perform to expectations. That's fine, but you've offered no input as to why that could be the case. That tells me you're either arguing simply for the sake of arguing or have boxed yourself into a corner and have been desperately looking for a way out. Whatever.

Thanks for illustrating what sucks about message boards. Carry on.

I will say I think people are overinflating the expectations we should have for this class. Nothing against them but there isn't a single all conference player in the bunch. Yeah, Royce didn't produce but he never played.

My point is simply that we don't know what to expect out of these guys for the most part, just like we didn't totally know what to expect out of those guys. I think comparing them is bad, because the group that Fred and TJ brought in at the start of his tenure kicked off not only one of the eras of the most sustained success in our MBB history but one of the most fun eras of our history.

These guys deserve to stand on their own. I think they'll do well but I don't expect them to launch this program into the tournament like the first group did for Fred. At least not this year.

 

[CyTwins]

Bohannon is up there in the running for my most hated Hawkeye athlete of all time award.

Just think if he was actually good

 

[Aclone]

I will say I think people are overinflating the expectations we should have for this class. Nothing against them but there isn't a single all conference player in the bunch. Yeah, Royce didn't produce but he never played.

I’m going to gently point out that there is a difference between “hopes” and “expectations”.

Yep, in a “best case scenario”, if everything comes together, they could be a bubble team. That’s a hope.

What I actually expect as a fairly reasonable result is somewhere around .500—but I’m not investing much in that, either. Too many examples of “anything that could go wrong, did go wrong”.

Whatever proves to be the case, will be. I don’t have any influence on how things pan out on the court, so it would be silly of me to evaluate results otherwise.

 

[VeloClone]

I’m going to gently point out that there is a difference between “hopes” and “expectations”.

Yep, in a “best case scenario”, if everything comes together, they could be a bubble team. That’s a hope.

What I actually expect as a fairly reasonable result is somewhere around .500—but I’m not investing much in that, either. Too many examples of “anything that could go wrong, did go wrong”.

Whatever proves to be the case, will be. I don’t have any influence on how things pan out on the court, so it would be silly of me to evaluate results otherwise.

Don't you think that depends on whether or not you wear your lucky underwear?

 

[Aclone]

Don't you think that depends on whether or not you wear your lucky underwear?

I’m pretty sure you don’t want me to answer that! I’ll file it under...rhetorical question.

 

[CyCloned]

Agree with that but I’m already seeing “bubble team”, and “if things go right” posts.

We all can dream. Hunter looks like he is pretty good, and we don't know much about Foster, or the transfer with the medical issues. If everything fall the right way and ISU gets lucky in a handful of games, they could be a bubble team. Just would take a lot of things going better than expected at this point in time. We need to find some Hilton Magic.

 

[usedcarguy]

I will say I think people are overinflating the expectations we should have for this class. Nothing against them but there isn't a single all conference player in the bunch. Yeah, Royce didn't produce but he never played.

My point is simply that we don't know what to expect out of these guys for the most part, just like we didn't totally know what to expect out of those guys. I think comparing them is bad, because the group that Fred and TJ brought in at the start of his tenure kicked off not only one of the eras of the most sustained success in our MBB history but one of the most fun eras of our history.

These guys deserve to stand on their own. I think they'll do well but I don't expect them to launch this program into the tournament like the first group did for Fred. At least not this year.

Some are overinflating, but that isn't and never was my point. What got me sucked into this brouhaha was saying (5 pages ago) that I thought TJ out of the gate was recruiting at a higher level than Fred and that because of how he was recruiting (focusing on character) his ceiling appears to be higher. And in typical CF fashion, a couple of members of the nit-picker police came out and wanted to start a war over it.

With that being said, I believe Hunter is definitely all conference material, although it may only be something like 3rd team or HM next year. King and Lipsey will be at some point as well. No, we don't know what this first group is going to do, but at the time we didn't know what Fred's group was going to do either. And like Fred's first group, TJ's are not all going to see the floor this year either. For our program to date, Fred's performance is the benchmark. It's only natural to draw comparisons to it.

My expectations are that they end up at least within a couple of games of .500, with the hope that they exceed that and maybe enter the conversation of post season play.

 

[BryceC]

Some are overinflating, but that isn't and never was my point. What got me sucked into this brouhaha was saying (5 pages ago) that I thought TJ out of the gate was recruiting at a higher level than Fred and that because of how he was recruiting (focusing on character) his ceiling appears to be higher. And in typical CF fashion, a couple of members of the nit-picker police came out and wanted to start a war over it.

I guess I just don't agree because I think it's an insult to those guy to say they weren't focusing on character. Let's be honest, TJ was recruiting those same guys so let's not act like the game plan is extremely different here.

 

[clonedude]

Bohannon is up there in the running for my most hated Hawkeye athlete of all time award.

To be fair, even most Hawk fans don’t like JorBo either.... and don’t want him back.

Eventually JorBo will go out like McCabe did..... by flipping off the Iowa fans in Carver booing him.

 

[BryceC]

Bohannon is up there in the running for my most hated Hawkeye athlete of all time award.

That's giving him way to much credit. He's merely an annoyance that's exacerbated by the fact he's played unnaturally long. I don't even hate him, he's just kind of a dork.

 

[usedcarguy]

I guess I just don't agree because I think it's an insult to those guy to say they weren't focusing on character. Let's be honest, TJ was recruiting those same guys so let's not act like the game plan is extremely different here.

If my comment was about focusing on character, I would agree. But it wasn't. As I mentioned in a previous post, Fred recruited some very high character guys.

Coaches are going to get the best kids they can to build their program and win. That is the game plan pretty much everywhere. If you have two players with comparable skills AND the opportunity to choose from both, you're going to take the one without the baggage. Every. Single. Time. It's not saying the kid with the baggage is being judged fairly or that it isn't going to work out, just that someone with a comparable skillset without it is going to get picked first. That TJ didn't have to make the choice illustrates the level for which he's recruiting. And the fact that we've been told of at least one high level recruit TJ wasn't interested in because of character/culture issues reinforces that.

Was he going after some of those players during Fred's tenure because Fred wanted to, or has his experience as a HC caused him to change his approach to recruiting? I can't answer that question. But regardless, he hasn't had to make any of those stretches in his first days on the job.