Cytown Update

[GingerNinja]

I assume getting this agreement ironed out has been the holdup, as something like this with 3 different entities and unique ownership/funding/revenue sharing pieces to figure out and run by everyone's legal departments usually takes a bit of time with all of the internal approvals.

I would think they still have been working on lining up tenants and squaring up designs. Hopefully information starts coming out faster once this goes through, it would be nice to have more than just the clinic under construction for next football season.

 

[Cyclonsin]

Cytown - BOR

Per the rendering, 4 of the buildings are ground floor retail while only 1 is for food & beverage. I REALLY hope there's another entertainment establishment or two in those retail spaces. Having only 1 place to grab a drink will be a major disappointment, IMO.

 

[Nor'MidWester]

Per the rendering, 4 of the buildings are ground floor retail while only 1 is for food & beverage. I REALLY hope there's another entertainment establishment or two in those retail spaces. Having only 1 place to grab a drink will be a major disappointment, IMO.

That's what I thought as well. Imagine that place on a football game day. Also I hope there is a sports bar or something closer to Hilton. I imagine they hope fans will go hang out in CyTown after a Saturday basketball game and having people walk basically all the way to Jack Trice after the game might dissuade people, especially in an Iowa winter. People are lazy, especially when cold.

 

[IcSyU]

I think you're seriously overestimating demand for those types of facilities. You better create a HELL of an experience because you are on an island on non game days. There is absolutely no chance multiple food and beverage options can exist on that small footprint and all make it.

You're far more likely to see office and retail space that is filled during business hours and then is less dependent on weekends.

People grossly underestimate how difficult it is to make it in food and beverage. Everyone thinks they can do it and then most end up out of business before they've existed for a year.

 

[Al_4_State]

I think you're seriously overestimating demand for those types of facilities. You better create a HELL of an experience because you are on an island on non game days. There is absolutely no chance multiple food and beverage options can exist on that small footprint and all make it.

You're far more likely to see office and retail space that is filled during business hours and then is less dependent on weekends.

People grossly underestimate how difficult it is to make it in food and beverage. Everyone thinks they can do it and then most end up out of business before they've existed for a year.

I always thought that this is one of the most well known true-isms in the business world.

 

[SeventhSon]

I think you're seriously overestimating demand for those types of facilities. You better create a HELL of an experience because you are on an island on non game days. There is absolutely no chance multiple food and beverage options can exist on that small footprint and all make it.

You're far more likely to see office and retail space that is filled during business hours and then is less dependent on weekends.

People grossly underestimate how difficult it is to make it in food and beverage. Everyone thinks they can do it and then most end up out of business before they've existed for a year.

Agreed.

As a business district, they are going to have to come up with (at least) weekly events that draw people to the district. It obviously has no established entertainment culture or tradition so they are going to need to manufacture one if they have any hope of success. Showing up only on gameday isn't going to cut it.

A live music venue (one that could operate year-round that is) would be interesting.

 

[SeventhSon]

I always thought that this is one of the most well known true-isms in the business world.

I did some googling: https://www.menutiger.com/blog/restaurant-failure-rate-statistics

It kinda cracks me up:

The claim that 90 percent of restaurants fail in the first year of business is false.

forcefully stated with emphasis ... and then followed by:

According to recent restaurant industry statistics, three out of five new restaurants won’t survive a year, while four out of five will most likely fail in the next five years

I would never open a restaurant at 90% failure rate but at 60% failure rate? That's totally different! /sarcasm

 

[Cyclonsin]

I think you're seriously overestimating demand for those types of facilities. You better create a HELL of an experience because you are on an island on non game days. There is absolutely no chance multiple food and beverage options can exist on that small footprint and all make it.

You're far more likely to see office and retail space that is filled during business hours and then is less dependent on weekends.

People grossly underestimate how difficult it is to make it in food and beverage. Everyone thinks they can do it and then most end up out of business before they've existed for a year.

No, I understand it will be difficult for any food/beverage venue to exist there (even just 1). I was cautiously optimistic the goal was to create a district that DID have one hell of an experience to make it a destination.

In fact, I think it might be easier for multiple cool bars to exist in close proximity to one another than just the 1 standalone option.. That's also the only way I can see the stage being utilized outside of gamedays. Sell the idea of going up to Ames to bar hop CyTown and make a day of it.

If they wanted to build an outdoor mall, tearing up prime tailgating space to do it is disappointing.

 

[IcSyU]

No, I understand it will be difficult for any food/beverage venue to exist there (even just 1). I was cautiously optimistic the goal was to create a district that DID have one hell of an experience to make it a destination.

In fact, I think it might be easier for multiple cool bars to exist in close proximity to one another than just the 1 standalone option.. That's also the only way I can see the stage being utilized outside of gamedays. Sell the idea of going up to Ames to bar hop CyTown and make a day of it.

If they wanted to build an outdoor mall, tearing up prime tailgating space to do it is disappointing.

They don't want an outdoor mall...they want commercial real estate space with realtors, lawyers, accountants, architects, doctors, etc. who utilize the space M-F and then leave it for ISU to use on weekends.

Of course when the concept of Cytown was announced commercial real estate wasn't teetering on a ridiculous level of vacancy.

And they don't care about tailgating space. They kept the money from shrinking everything and are now trying to utilize it with tenants 365 days a year. Basically the net cash flow they can collect is free money to them because they didn't lose anything on the donors being displaced.

 

[cybychoice]

No, I understand it will be difficult for any food/beverage venue to exist there (even just 1). I was cautiously optimistic the goal was to create a district that DID have one hell of an experience to make it a destination.

In fact, I think it might be easier for multiple cool bars to exist in close proximity to one another than just the 1 standalone option.. That's also the only way I can see the stage being utilized outside of gamedays. Sell the idea of going up to Ames to bar hop CyTown and make a day of it.

If they wanted to build an outdoor mall, tearing up prime tailgating space to do it is disappointing.

The other thing with bar/food/entertainment options is campus is right by, it’s walking distance for a good chunk of students, a second floor open patio type bar kind of like whiskey river in Ankeny would likely do well if they put a stage up and did live music in nicer weather

 

[IcSyU]

The other thing with bar/food/entertainment options is campus is right by, it’s walking distance for a good chunk of students, a second floor open patio type bar kind of like whiskey river in Ankeny would likely do well if they put a stage up and did live music in nicer weather

I would be SHOCKED if anyone would build a space aimed at students.

1. They don't have the disposable income.
2. A vast majority are gone 4 months a year.
3. Typically adults don't want to frequent places with strong student attendance.
4. Most aren't 21.
5. Students will age a building unbelievably quickly.

 

[Cyclonsin]

They don't want an outdoor mall...they want commercial real estate space with realtors, lawyers, accountants, architects, doctors, etc. who utilize the space M-F and then leave it for ISU to use on weekends.

Of course when the concept of Cytown was announced commercial real estate wasn't teetering on a ridiculous level of vacancy.

And they don't care about tailgating space. They kept the money from shrinking everything and are now trying to utilize it with tenants 365 days a year. Basically the net cash flow they can collect is free money to them because they didn't lose anything on the donors being displaced.

Right, but office/residential space has been a known component all along (as it should be, just like Titletown), What makes up the ground floor has always been a mix, but seemingly shifted more towards retail (per this new rendering, which I know is not the end-all/be-all) and away from entertainment. In the fly-through video on the CyTown site they show rooftop bars on either side of Cyclone Alley near the stage, and those appear to have been cut for the time being.

My concern is that it's not enough of a shopping district for anyone to go out of their way to visit it, and having 1 brewery isn't enough of a draw either. Not to mention that shopping there will be a nightmare 6-7 Saturdays a year. Mix in a decent sized stage at the end that will likely just be taking up space most of the time, and I'm unenthused. The employees from the offices won't shop there often, and I suspect the overwhelming majority of the residential space will be used as "vacation homes" for our richer fans on game days/weekends, so they won't be spending at the shops regularly either.

I was excited and optimistic at the start of this when it was pitched as our own Junior Power & Light or Titletown Lite. But I'm coming to terms with the reality it won't offer enough to be close to either of those, and will be more like Ultra Diet Tanger Outlets.

 

[BillBrasky4Cy]

I would be SHOCKED if anyone would build a space aimed at students.

1. They don't have the disposable income.
2. A vast majority are gone 4 months a year.
3. Typically adults don't want to frequent places with strong student attendance.
4. Most aren't 21.
5. Students will age a building unbelievably quickly.

People here don't want to hear that... People can't get past their visions of places like Power & Light and Title Town. CyTown was never going to be anything like that. I was all about it at first but after stepping back and really thinking about it, there was never going to be more than maybe 2 food/drink establishments. JP did one of two things. 1.) he made a decision based off of emotion from his connections to KC and Green Bay or 2.) he tricked fans into thinking that this was going to be something similar when he really just wanted it for commercial/office spaces.

 

[Hoggins]

I know this needs to happen, but this thing feels destined to fail. Idk, I’m an idiot but man this feels off

 

[Messi]

Per the rendering, 4 of the buildings are ground floor retail while only 1 is for food & beverage. I REALLY hope there's another entertainment establishment or two in those retail spaces. Having only 1 place to grab a drink will be a major disappointment, IMO.

i am reading map below that buildings

• C 11047 sq ft
• D 16000 sq ft
• E 11705 sq ft
• F 16000 sq ft

could be used for retail / food & beverage

 

[Cyclonsin]

They don't want an outdoor mall...they want commercial real estate space with realtors, lawyers, accountants, architects, doctors, etc. who utilize the space M-F and then leave it for ISU to use on weekends.

Of course when the concept of Cytown was announced commercial real estate wasn't teetering on a ridiculous level of vacancy.

And they don't care about tailgating space. They kept the money from shrinking everything and are now trying to utilize it with tenants 365 days a year. Basically the net cash flow they can collect is free money to them because they didn't lose anything on the donors being displaced.

Oh, one other thought, prime tailgating spots is one of the best commodities our AD has. People are very willing to increase their donation levels for better/closer tailgate spots, and this is a terrible time to reduce incentives to increase donation levels.. I understand that's relatively small potatoes compared to things that generate revenue year-round, but every bit is needed.

 

[Cyclonsin]

i am reading map below that buildings

• C 11047 sq ft
• D 16000 sq ft
• E 11705 sq ft
• F 16000 sq ft

could be used for retail / food & beverage


View attachment 140674

Correct, which is why I said I hope there's another 1 or 2 in those retail spaces. Still sad to see the rooftop bars near the stage at the North end gone.

 

[Mr.G.Spot]

An easy fix for lack of restaurants: food trucks. I understand that won't work in dec-march, but if properly researched, you could have 30-50 food trucks lined up for game days.

There will never be 5-8 restaurants there, but there are other solutions.

 

[Cloned4Life]

Right, but office/residential space has been a known component all along (as it should be, just like Titletown), What makes up the ground floor has always been a mix, but seemingly shifted more towards retail (per this new rendering, which I know is not the end-all/be-all) and away from entertainment. In the fly-through video on the CyTown site they show rooftop bars on either side of Cyclone Alley near the stage, and those appear to have been cut for the time being.

My concern is that it's not enough of a shopping district for anyone to go out of their way to visit it, and having 1 brewery isn't enough of a draw either. Not to mention that shopping there will be a nightmare 6-7 Saturdays a year. Mix in a decent sized stage at the end that will likely just be taking up space most of the time, and I'm unenthused. The employees from the offices won't shop there often, and I suspect the overwhelming majority of the residential space will be used as "vacation homes" for our richer fans on game days/weekends, so they won't be spending at the shops regularly either.

I was excited and optimistic at the start of this when it was pitched as our own Junior Power & Light or Titletown Lite. But I'm coming to terms with the reality it won't offer enough to be close to either of those, and will be more like Ultra Diet Tanger Outlets.

Yeah it was marketed as a TitleTown/P&L lite from the very beginning, and this messaging has been reiterated throughout the years. If it turns out that that is not at all what it ends up being - is really, really disappointing. And yeah, everyone understands (and understood) how 'hard' it was going to be to actually pull that off. Doesn't make it any less disappointing...

They don't want an outdoor mall...they want commercial real estate space with realtors, lawyers, accountants, architects, doctors, etc. who utilize the space M-F and then leave it for ISU to use on weekends.

Pollard has literally always used the Titletown-lite comparison. This is one of the major components of why it was (and continued to be) such an exciting and hopeful idea. In none of the videos were there mocked up flyovers of realtors sitting on their laptops inside an office window...

 

[NWICY]

The one thing we can all agree on it's a giant experiment and we all are hoping for the best so the A.D. succeeds