***Official 2024 Chicago Cubs Thread***

[Cyforce]

Your post is a mess to try and read but i will try-

Tiring? What else have I shot down? You started talking about Oriole players so I responded since you obviously dont know what you are talking about.

Who cares about your prospects. The Orioles have the best farm in baseball. They dont need prospects and are in win now mode. If you are looking to argue at least do some research so you dont look so stupid.

I didn't just pull Mayo out of my ass. He's been listed by national writers. The Orioles my not be the Cubs trade partner but they will likely come from your division. We may not get Mayo but if Taillon is dealt we'll get an offensive fix for 25 or we'll keep a quality starter with 2 more years of control.

 

[Carlisle Clone]

I didn't just pull Mayo out of my ass. He's been listed by national writers. The Orioles my not be the Cubs trade partner but they will likely come from your division. We may not get Mayo but if Taillon is dealt we'll get an offensive fix for 25 or we'll keep a quality starter with 2 more years of control.

You forgot to answer my question so I will ask it again, What trades have I shot down to be tired about?

National writers have been talking about the Orioles big 3 of Holliday, Basallo and Mayo for weeks. They have never mentioned Mayo for Taillon so you did in fact pull that out of your ass.

Used to wonder why so many others posters bagged on you all the time. That is no longer the case.

PS. Its ok to enjoy your team and not pretend to be an expert about them. You're not even fooling yourself.

 

[Clonefan32]

You forgot to answer my question so I will ask it again, What trades have I shot down to be tired about?

National writers have been talking about the Orioles big 3 of Holliday, Basallo and Mayo for weeks. They have never mentioned Mayo for Taillon so you did in fact pull that out of your ass.

Used to wonder why so many others posters bagged on you all the time. That is no longer the case.

PS. Its ok to enjoy your team and not pretend to be an expert about them. You're not even fooling yourself.

I'm just curious, what would you give up out of the O's system for Tailion?

 

[ISUCubswin]

One MLB executive believes the Cubs could put a package centered around Taillon for the Yankees Jasson Dominguez. Dominguez has received comparisons to Mickey Mantle and has probably a higher ceiling than any prospect other than Holliday. His only question is his injury history.

If the Cubs could pull Taillon for Dominguez, they could pull off Taillon for Mayo.

And for what it’s worth, Dominguez would be my favorite trade target if we didn’t have a jam in the OF. Dude has a 60 projection for power and is currently a 60 in speed though projected to slow down because of his build. He's about as close to a realistic 40/40 guy that isn't already in the majors right now.

 

[ISUCubswin]

I'm just curious, what would you give up out of the O's system for Tailion?

To add to this question, if the O’s want starting pitching, who does @Carlisle Clone believe they can get for Mayo?

 

[Carlisle Clone]

To add to this question, if the O’s want starting pitching, who does @Carlisle Clone believe they can get for Mayo?

Good question-The Os want a front line starting pitcher with controllable years. The names already mentioned, Crochet and Skubal are who they are after. Either one would cost more than just Mayo. They need a front line starter cause Burnes is all but gone after the season as a top 5 pitcher in baseball right now. If your asking who they could trade Mayo straight up for and get pitching? I dont think Elias is thinking like that and wants to package him for that front line starter.

The Yankees are more desperate to win than the Os so trading a guy like Dominguez for a #3 starter is different. Not exactly apples to apples there.

 

[ISUCubswin]

I just hope that after the trade deadline passes and it's obvious, we are not going to make that run needed to make a wild card spot they start tinkering around a bit with the roster and lineups and give some guys opportunities to see who might be part of the 2025 mix. If they aren't traded away in a few weeks in some kind of deal guys like Canario, Mervis, Vazquez are at a point where they need some extended opportunities in Chicago and I am not talking like some random pinch hit at bats and spots starts I'm talking need to get them in the lineup multiple days a week and see if they can make the adjustment or not. If they aren't going to be part of the future than so be it. Caissie is probably ready for a taste of the bigs too. Maybe give Busch some starts at 3B too and see what happens. Then you have the pitchers, some of that will be based on health and if Taillon or Hendricks get traded but guys like Wicks, Brown, and Wesneski are guys that either need to be given some turns in the rotation or start preparing them for bullpen roles. Give some of the young guys in the pen some high leverage opportunities too.

Just don't want to waste the post-deadline stretch running out the same mediocre lineup that can't win games. Commit to the rebuild and figure out what you have in the system that might be able to contribute next season or at worse figure out of some of these guys need to be moved because there is not a path forward for them in the organization.

One of my Jed knocks - How he managed the Matt Mervis scenario should be a case study for every future MLB GM/President.

You know going into 2022 it's a rebuild year. You have a guy in Des Moines who is hitting .309 with 40 bombs on the year and a low strikeout rate. But Jed decides he's going to ride with Frank Schwindel and Alfonso Rivas at 1B and Mervis doesn't get a shot.

2023 comes. Jed has zero ******* clue who is going to be 1B, so he signs two first basemen who have shown drastic decline in the previous year. Mervis? Still raking in Des Moines. Call up Mervis in May/June. Does not perform. Goes back to Des Moines the rest of the season.

Jed could've found out in September 2022 that Mervis was not the 1B of the future and shopped him that offseason and pinned it on adjusting to the MLB. Instead he waited until May 2023, lost that excuse, and lost any and all value Mervis once had.

And I say all that to say this - **** 2024. You want to compete in 2025? Bring up Caisse, Vazquez, and anyone else in Iowa in August/September and see if they're going to be a long term asset for this club or if they're guys we want to shop this offseason.

 

[CYdTracked]

One of my Jed knocks - How he managed the Matt Mervis scenario should be a case study for every future MLB GM/President.

You know going into 2022 it's a rebuild year. You have a guy in Des Moines who is hitting .309 with 40 bombs on the year and a low strikeout rate. But Jed decides he's going to ride with Frank Schwindel and Alfonso Rivas at 1B and say "**** the guy in Des Moines" instead of giving him a chance in September to see what he is.

2023 comes. Jed has zero ******* clue who is going to be 1B, so he signs two first basemen who have shown drastic decline in the previous year. Mervis? Still raking in Des Moines. Call up Mervis in May/June. Does not perform. Goes back to Des Moines the rest of the season.

Jed could've found out in September 2022 that Mervis was not the 1B of the future and shopped him that offseason and pinned it on adjusting to the MLB. Instead he waited until May 2023, lost that excuse, and lost any and all value Mervis once had.

And I say all that to say this - **** 2024. You want to compete in 2025? Bring up Caisse, Vazquez, and anyone else in Iowa in August/September and see if they're going to be a long term asset for this club or if they're guys we want to shop this offseason.

Completely agree. From a development standpoint either we are completely missing on prospects or mismanaging their development where we kill any confidence they have or mess them up with the up/down game of callups and how they are used. Another guy I think we are completely messing up his value right now is Canario. Dude has crushed it in Iowa when healthy but never gets a fair opportunity when he gets called up other than making sure the bench doesn't blow away. So we call him up when he's usually on a hot streak just so he can cool off in Chicago then have to adjust to playing every day again when he gets sent back down. And it's not like he's sucked in the big leagues with the few chances he's had, in 45 plate appearances has hit for .286 2 HR and 8 RBI, did strike out 19 times but again first time facing MLB pitching and not regular playing time either as they haven't really given him a stretch to start several games in a row.

Mervis last year looked like a guy with no confidence left by the time he got sent back down and I don't think he's recovered from it since. My worry is if we keep the kid gloves on every guy we call up going forward where they only play sporadically or can't face a certain handed pitcher we are going to see similar results with guys like Caissie too and ruin any trade value they have now. I can go on quite a bit more of just how much they've mismanaged this rebuild and how they "develop" these prospects. At least with the pitchers they get some fair shots out of necessity because when someone is hurt then someone has to make regular starts or appearances out of the pen when they are called up. They can't sit them on the bench for 10 days at a time like the did with Canario last year.

 

[Carlisle Clone]

I will say one thing about guys raking in the minors, the pitching is so bad at most levels down there. Sure teams will have a good 1 or 2 but for the most part the pitching is below average which inflates hitting numbers. I believe this to be one of the reasons why Mayo is expendable. The big club has struggled offensively for a few weeks and not done much to make changes. Carrying proven guys like Mullins, Urias, Mateo and Hays is killing the club because they havent done anything THIS year. The other being service time of course.

 

[ISUCubswin]

Good question-The Os want a front line starting pitcher with controllable years. The names already mentioned, Crochet and Skubal are who they are after. Either one would cost more than just Mayo. They need a front line starter cause Burnes is all but gone after the season as a top 5 pitcher in baseball right now. If your asking who they could trade Mayo straight up for and get pitching? I dont think Elias is thinking like that and wants to package him for that front line starter.

The Yankees are more desperate to win than the Os so trading a guy like Dominguez for a #3 starter is different. Not exactly apples to apples there.

As one who would prefer the Orioles win it all over anyone else in the AL, I'd have no complaints if they landed Skubal and/or Crochet.

I just think the asking prices, while affordable for the O's, might be too astronomical. The Tigers aren't that far away from being a good team. White Sox have two stars but they need a complete rebuild and I'm not sure that organization is smart enough to either rebuild or rebuild and get high end assets.

 

[ISUCubswin]

I will say one thing about guys raking in the minors, the pitching is so bad at most levels down there. Sure teams will have a good 1 or 2 but for the most part the pitching is below average which inflates hitting numbers. I believe this to be one of the reasons why Mayo is expendable. The big club has struggled offensively for a few weeks and not done much to make changes. Carrying proven guys like Mullins, Urias, Mateo and Hays is killing the club because they havent done anything THIS year. The other being service time of course.

I'm sure it was a good reason but watching the Cubs-Orioles series, I think the Orioles would've won the series had they not moved the LF wall back so damn far. They hit a ton of warning track shots. With all the pop you guys have, you'd shatter records if that wall was moved in a bit. It's become the least hitter friendly left field in all of baseball.

 

[BigJCy]

 

[TClone99]

I hope they don’t give Taillon up unless they LOVE what they’re getting back. Really solid rotation veteran who isn’t all that expensive the next 2 years. Gonna be hard to replace next year.

 

[ISUCubswin]

This would be an interesting one. My guess is they wouldn’t take any of the prospects because the Astros farm is trash but I don’t see anything on their current roster I’d want and they’d give up

 

[ISUCubswin]

I hope they don’t give Taillon up unless they LOVE what they’re getting back. Really solid rotation veteran who isn’t all that expensive the next 2 years. Gonna be hard to replace next year.

There’s a path to getting rid of Taillon, pocketing that money, and having a much better rotation

 

[isucy86]

To add to this question, if the O’s want starting pitching, who does @Carlisle Clone believe they can get for Mayo?

IMO the O's should have interest in Taillon if they can't get a top tier arm. Losing guys like Bradish & Means leaves the O's rotation thin. And I haven't seen if Suarez will be out after being hit by a batted ball the other night. A multiple player trade might be easier to pull off:

Taillon
+ Leiter/Lopez/Neris
+ Cubs MiLB prospect

for Mayo
+ O's MiLB prospect

The prospect angle could be the icing to fill pipeline gaps. Would O's be willing to trade their #2 prospect Basallo, a catcher whose MLB ETA is 2025/26. Would Cubs be willing to trade an arm like Horton, Brown, Arias?

 

[Cyforce]

Honestly I think I'd rather get the catcher from Boston. Solely because I think our pipeline is closer to providing a better option than Morel at 3rd but Ballesteros rakes buts a long way from being a regular behind the plate. Amaya's hot streak does change that a bit but who knows if it's real or just an blip on the radar?

 

[TClone99]

There’s a path to getting rid of Taillon, pocketing that money, and having a much better rotation

I don’t know man. Kyle Gibson got 13 mil this offseason at age 36. Prices are only going up. Maybe you trade a couple of positional prospects for a stud pitcher that’s ready to impact next year? Obviously getting Brown Wicks and Horton healthy is huge but that has little to do with Taillon.

 

[isucy86]

I hope they don’t give Taillon up unless they LOVE what they’re getting back. Really solid rotation veteran who isn’t all that expensive the next 2 years. Gonna be hard to replace next year.

I feel the Cubs can trade a solid starting arm because they have depth. Especially if they go after an elite FA starter like Burnes (personally I'd prefer the Cubs spend on bats).

But here are starter arms if Cubs were healthy:

Steele
Imanaga
Taillon
Assad
Brown
Wicks
Wesneski

Next Up
Horton
Kilian

Sure they could shift a guy like Brown to the bullpen. But if they get injured arms like Almonte, Alzolay, Little, etc back in 2025 they have a deep bullpen as well.

 

[TClone99]

I feel the Cubs can trade a solid starting arm because they have depth. Especially if they go after an elite FA starter like Burnes (personally I'd prefer the Cubs spend on bats).

But here are starter arms if Cubs were healthy:

Steele
Imanaga
Taillon
Assad
Brown
Wicks
Wesneski

Next Up
Horton
Kilian

Sure they could shift a guy like Brown to the bullpen. But if they get injured arms like Almonte, Alzolay, Little, etc back in 2025 they have a deep bullpen as well.

I mean aside from those first 4 (Taillln being one of them) none of those guys have proven much of anything. Mostly just flashes of potential. There are a lot of innings to cover over the course of a season. The FO would be leaving themselves a ton of work this offseason and it won’t be cheap either.