This is why Prohm must go........

[FinalFourCy]

Losing by 20 versus 30 make a big difference to you does it? I think we figured on losing, and knew it could get out of hand.

Ask Vegas how much 10 points matters to point differential expectations. In terms of expected spread, that’s significant.


Most expected to lose a non-competitive game. Far fewer expected to get blown-out to the degree that KU’s walkons prevented it from being the worst home loss point differential in decades.

If this type of loss should be universally expected, there’s nothing to lose by cleaning house tomorrow.

 

[simply1]

Ask Vegas how much 10 points matters to point differential expectations. In terms of expected spread, that’s significant.


Most expected to lose a non-competitive game. Far fewer expected to get blown-out to the degree that KU’s walkons prevented it from being the worst home loss point differential in decades.

If this type of loss should be universally expected, there’s nothing to lose by cleaning house tomorrow.

So your expectation was a close game. See, my post was in the form of a question. Hard to answer questions for you?

So before tonight you didn’t want Prohm fired immediately, now you do after this game?

and I have no ***** to give on Vegas.

 

[FinalFourCy]

Prohm isn't the one out there shooting 34% from the floor when KU is playing, at best, half-assed defense for an entire half of the game. That's what I mean when I say the biggest disparity on display tonight was talent.

We have exactly one obviously-good player: Hali. That's it. Quite literally everyone else has major flaws in their game, and giving them a new head coach (promoted from the current coaching staff nobody else trusts anyway) is not going to magically fix that or make the situation any better. Save that for the end of the season when there's actually candidates to interview and hire and potential to work with. All that can be done right this second is further damage.

And even at that point I'm not confident it'll get any better, 'cuz were looking at a complete, multi-year rebuild that we will most-likely be handing to someone else of Prohm's resume caliber when he came in.

We lost to FAMU. It’s not just material, it’s coaching. The lack of coaching talent contributed to the point differential as much as the lack of player talent.

 

[awd4cy]

Prohm isn't the one out there shooting 34% from the floor when KU is playing, at best, half-assed defense for an entire half of the game. That's what I mean when I say the biggest disparity on display tonight was talent.

We have exactly one obviously-good player: Hali. That's it. Quite literally everyone else has major flaws in their game, and giving them a new head coach (promoted from the current coaching staff nobody else trusts anyway) is not going to magically fix that or make the situation any better. Save that for the end of the season when there's actually candidates to interview and hire and potential to work with. All that can be done right this second is further damage.

And even at that point I'm not confident it'll get any better, 'cuz were looking at a complete, multi-year rebuild that we will most-likely be handing to someone else of Prohm's resume caliber when he came in.

Would a new coach at least help us magically beat Florida A&M at least? I sure think so.

 

[FinalFourCy]

So your expectation was a close game. See, my post was in the form of a question. Hard to answer questions for you?

So before tonight you didn’t want Prohm fired immediately, now you do after this game?

and I have no ***** to give on Vegas.

Your question wasn’t worth answering, but a 10-15 point loss in a mostly competitive game seemed the most plausible.

You expected a 26-point loss, with KU’s walkons preventing it from being 30+?

It wasn’t expected, and shouldn’t have been, so no. But if I ever reach your level of pessimism in the staff, yes, I’ll be for firing Prohm yesterday.

 

[simply1]

Your question wasn’t worth answering, but a 10-15 point loss in a mostly competitive game seemed the most plausible.

You expected a 26-point loss, with KU’s walkons preventing it from being 30+?

It wasn’t expected, and shouldn’t have been, so no. But if I ever reach your level of pessimism in the staff, yes, I’ll be for firing Prohm yesterday.

Pretty incredible, the expectation is more important than the result. lol

tickets were so bad for the game you described a potential? Pretty bad commentary on the fans then.

 

[acgclone]

Depressing

 

[MeowingCows]

We lost to FAMU. It’s not just material, it’s coaching. The lack of coaching talent contributed to the point differential as much as the lack of player talent.

Would a new coach at least help us magically beat Florida A&M at least? I sure think so.

Notice how during that game, that one excellent player I named didn't play, and we were completely lost without him there. Also notice that tonight that same guy put up minimal stats and we got crushed. Also notice that same guy fell off a cliff during OT last game and we lost. See a trend yet? The team is very incomplete and needs their most complete player to carry them along. I bet you Hali doesn't turn the ball over to FAMU 18 times (mostly for easy fast break layups), even if he contributes nothing else beyond that. This team's talent is a poor construction and doesn't fit together. It would be great to have some of those early-leaving pro players still around to fill these skill gaps... but they're gone now. Our current best player looks that part as well. It sucks that he has to break his back carrying the team, but that's what it is.

I agree that Prohm isn't a great coach, I think he's about average. He won with good players and has some accomplishments, but has struggled to sustain or rebuild that. Some of that is in-game coaching. Some of it is roster turnover, both for positive and negative reasons. Some of it is recruiting and development (which is tied as much to the assistants as it is specifically Prohm). However, I also don't think firing him now is gonna suddenly make the grass greener. I don't see us going out to make a big, flashy, spendy hire that everyone wants and thinks we deserve, because 1.) we historically just don't do that, and 2.) it'll be hard to pay for such a coach along with a sizable buyout. Personally, I also don't see much in the coaching market that's promising right now, again going back to just hiring another mid-major coach and hoping for the best (although, if you fire Prohm this season, that's an affordable option). The other problem ISU basketball has had frequently since Orr's days is... coaching turnover. Hard to build a stable program without stable, long-term coaching.

It's a ****** spot to be in. I don't envy Pollard right now.

 

[kingcy]

I am going to start by saying I'm a stand by your coach and usually support them later than most. If this staff doesn't get this turned around soon they are not going to win this fan base back, even those like myself. There has always been this question about him with some fans and now that is growing. Yes a lot of fans you will win back but that is getting to be less and less. He cannot do what he did last year with the line and then make the same mistake again this year. You cannot roll the same lineup out there the same rotations and expect a different result. Being loyal to a player is great its never a bad thing, but at some point it is just not working and it is time to move on or shake it up. The players know what is going on, they see when something should be done with player z, and by not making that change he could be hurting how the other players play.

 

[simply1]

Oh man

 

[alarson]

I didnt listen to the radio on the way home (or see if they put anything on tv), but did they mention this tied for the second worst margin of defeat in hilton coliseum history, and worst margin of defeat in hilton since 2003?

http://cbbref.com/tiny/I1nLr

Kansas is a good team, but kansas usually is a good team. In the space of just over a week we've had two not just bad games but historically bad games. (oh, and the iowa game ranks in the top 25 worst hilton margins of defeat as well)

I think everyone knows we're bad right now, but i'm not sure if people are grasping just how bad.

 

[BringBackJohnny]

Why did we extend Steven last year.... worst AD decision of the last decade. Writing was on the wall the big 12 tourney was a fluke. A happy fluke but not real. The regular season showed us what was real.

 

[isubb79]

Notice how during that game, that one excellent player I named didn't play, and we were completely lost without him there. Also notice that tonight that same guy put up minimal stats and we got crushed. Also notice that same guy fell off a cliff during OT last game and we lost. See a trend yet? The team is very incomplete and needs their most complete player to carry them along. I bet you Hali doesn't turn the ball over to FAMU 18 times (mostly for easy fast break layups), even if he contributes nothing else beyond that. This team's talent is a poor construction and doesn't fit together. It would be great to have some of those early-leaving pro players still around to fill these skill gaps... but they're gone now. Our current best player looks that part as well. It sucks that he has to break his back carrying the team, but that's what it is.

I agree that Prohm isn't a great coach, I think he's about average. He won with good players and has some accomplishments, but has struggled to sustain or rebuild that. Some of that is in-game coaching. Some of it is roster turnover, both for positive and negative reasons. Some of it is recruiting and development (which is tied as much to the assistants as it is specifically Prohm). However, I also don't think firing him now is gonna suddenly make the grass greener. I don't see us going out to make a big, flashy, spendy hire that everyone wants and thinks we deserve, because 1.) we historically just don't do that, and 2.) it'll be hard to pay for such a coach along with a sizable buyout. Personally, I also don't see much in the coaching market that's promising right now, again going back to just hiring another mid-major coach and hoping for the best (although, if you fire Prohm this season, that's an affordable option). The other problem ISU basketball has had frequently since Orr's days is... coaching turnover. Hard to build a stable program without stable, long-term coaching.

It's a ****** spot to be in. I don't envy Pollard right now.

I don’t think CSP is a average P5/6 coach. Most coaches at that level have the ability to make adjustments on the fly and can deal with challenging personalities. I’m not sure which Prohm is worse at but both are way below average. He does excel at being a nice guy.

 

[Clonefan32]

That roster was amazing last year, and he recruited it. Totally gets credit there, but looking back I would say they under performed. I don't think I could have said that last year, but looking at Wiggy, THT, Lard and a soon to be Hali playing professionally, we should have done way better than what we did.

After Hoiberg's recruits, we have under performed. You could make an argument that he under performed WITH Hoiberg's recruits.

Not to mention a very so-so Big 12 last year. Being .500 in the conference was a very poor result given our talent relative to the rest of the Big 12.

 

[stuclone]

Oh man

If Beilein gets fired from Cleveland, throw all the money we can to get him

 

[CycloneErik]

If Beilein gets fired from Cleveland, throw all the money we can to get him

Maybe he could pay Prohm's buyout.......

 

[awd4cy]

If Beilein gets fired from Cleveland, throw all the money we can to get him

Definitely down on that. Skip the $10 million pedestrian bridge.

 

[BWRhasnoAC]

If the bolded is true it's on the coaching staff. They had to know Wigginton was gone after last year. THT started popping up on draft boards in November. Lard was obviously iffy. There's just no way their leaving could have been a surprise to them such that they couldn't start to plan for it.

He missed on all recruiting targets last year.

 

[Clonefan32]

He missed on all recruiting targets last year.

I think the Leech and Anderson thing gets overlooked. If you know after a month of practices that those guys aren't going to be able to cut it in the Big 12, that is a monumental recruiting miss. That is very, very poor talent evaluation.

I mean, 1/2 our recruiting class didn't even make it to the first exhibition game. That's going to set you back quite a bit.

 

[Messi]

90-60 at ISU

53-19 at Hilton

37-41 away/neutral

55-56 vs high major opponents


Home winning percentage
Hoiberg .872
Eustachy .831
Morgan .800
Floyd .758
Prohm .736
McDermott .666