Officiating question

[Cyrok]

Just re-watched the Okie State game (we still won!!) and I'm confused about a call. An unnecessary roughness penalty was called on OSU after the last play of the first half was blown dead and the officials announced it would be enforced at the start of the third period. As far as I can tell, it wasn't enforced on the kick-off and it wasn't enforced when OSU's offense came out. Did the ref's forget about it? Or am I missing something.

TIA

 

[Covenant Clone]

It was enforced...we kicked off from the 45 to start the second half.

 

[IcSyU]

Just re-watched the Okie State game (we still won!!) and I'm confused about a call. An unnecessary roughness penalty was called on OSU after the last play of the first half was blown dead and the officials announced it would be enforced at the start of the third period. As far as I can tell, it wasn't enforced on the kick-off and it wasn't enforced when OSU's offense came out. Did the ref's forget about it? Or am I missing something.

TIA

We kicked off from the 45 and Mahoney punched it straight into the air on the second half kickoff.

 

[JMCato]

What I was confused by was at one point in the 2nd half OSU got a 1st down and then after the play was over got an unnecessary roughness penalty. Why was it then 1st and 10 not 1st and 25?

 

[IcSyU]

What I was confused by was at one point in the 2nd half OSU got a 1st down and then after the play was over got an unnecessary roughness penalty. Why was it then 1st and 10 not 1st and 25?

I believe that was a dead ball penalty but could be wrong.

 

[TedKumsher]

What I was confused by was at one point in the 2nd half OSU got a 1st down and then after the play was over got an unnecessary roughness penalty. Why was it then 1st and 10 not 1st and 25?

I wondered that also.
I assume:
1) Play is over.
2) First down earned.
3) Penalty occurred.
4) Penalty enforced.
5) Chains are moved.

 

[TedKumsher]

What I was confused by was at one point in the 2nd half OSU got a 1st down and then after the play was over got an unnecessary roughness penalty. Why was it then 1st and 10 not 1st and 25?

I believe that was a dead ball penalty but could be wrong.

Right, but the question is this --

If it's 2nd and 8 and the play goes for 5 yards and then there's a dead ball foul for 15 yards, it'll be 3rd down and 18 (not 3rd and 5). What's special about earning a 1st down that makes it a "yardage only" penalty, instead of a yards-to-first-down penalty (if that makes sense).

I'm fine with it -- but it does seem inconsistent. Like it should be:

1) Play is over.
2) 1st down earned.
3) Yard line required for the next 1st down is established (chains are moved and established instantly in theory).
4) Dead ball penalty.
5) Penalty enforced.
6) 1st down and 25.

 

[Madclone1]

Just re-watched the Okie State game (we still won!!) and I'm confused about a call. An unnecessary roughness penalty was called on OSU after the last play of the first half was blown dead and the officials announced it would be enforced at the start of the third period. As far as I can tell, it wasn't enforced on the kick-off and it wasn't enforced when OSU's offense came out. Did the ref's forget about it? Or am I missing something.

TIA

How about that GREAT review of the TD pass? Confirmed versus Upheld!! Only a frickin lawyer could come up with that nuance to "cover down" for the screw ups on the field. Thank goodness ISU scored again just to PROVE em wrong!

Officials should learn to tell the truth by what they SEE and not worry about overturning a screwed up call on the field. But they are SOoooo insecure aren't they!

 

[IcSyU]

Right, but the question is this --

If it's 2nd and 8 and the play goes for 5 yards and then there's a dead ball foul for 15 yards, it'll be 3rd down and 18 (not 3rd and 5). What's special about earning a 1st down that makes it a "yardage only" penalty, instead of a yards-to-first-down penalty (if that makes sense).

I'm fine with it -- but it does seem inconsistent. Like it should be:

1) Play is over.
2) 1st down earned.
3) Yard line required for the next 1st down is established (chains are moved and established instantly in theory).
4) Dead ball penalty.
5) Penalty enforced.
6) 1st down and 25.

The result of the play stands, so the chains are picked up. However, the chains aren't set back down until the ball is set for play, which is after the penalty is assessed. In the other case, the chains aren't picked up because the result of the play wasn't a first down.

 

[ChiefCy]

Just re-watched the Okie State game (we still won!!) and I'm confused about a call. An unnecessary roughness penalty was called on OSU after the last play of the first half was blown dead and the officials announced it would be enforced at the start of the third period. As far as I can tell, it wasn't enforced on the kick-off and it wasn't enforced when OSU's offense came out. Did the ref's forget about it? Or am I missing something.

TIA

What if this had been the end of the game, would the game then have to be extended in order to enforce the personal foul?

 

[IcSyU]

What if this had been the end of the game, would the game then have to be extended in order to enforce the personal foul?

I believe the game is over because the foul didn't occur on a timed down.

If I get a chance this weekend, I will see if any of the above are covered in the rule/case books I have laying around. I very well could be wrong.

The post below is correct. QB runs out of bounds, corner crushes him. Dead ball personal foul. 15 yard penalty or half the distance and another untimed down. Part of me is shocked some *** clown hasn't called someone for excessive celebration on a defender at the end of a game and gotten the offense one more play.

 

[Covenant Clone]

What if this had been the end of the game, would the game then have to be extended in order to enforce the personal foul?

One more un-timed down...the game can't end on a defensive penalty. It wouldn't matter if its a dead ball it was still on the defense.

 

[Jordanj6502]

On a different officiating note... Someone on refstripes.com pointed this out.
(Onside KO (video))

[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QUcyCn88Yjs]Onside KO - YouTube[/ame]


Mahoney didn't bounce the ball like a traditional onside kick. It should have been Kick Catch Interference because the block occurred before the ball hits the ground, and the Receiving team has the right to the attempt to field the ball until it hits the ground.
So remember when you next get mad at officiating, that somethings do go our way. :twitcy:

 

[Cycsk]

It has been a while since I have been on that site. It is one of the best places for objective consideration of referee calls.As I watch the ultra-slow motion, it seems that the ball does indeed hit the ground (or at least he hits the ball down). I don't think his kick angle could explain hitting the ball in the air without coming off the ground. And it doesn't look like the OSU guy is going for the ball. He looks more like he is going for our guy who is going for the ball. If he is not making a play on the ball, then you should be able to block him just like anyone else on the receiving team, IMO. At any rate, your point about the refs not screwing us on this one is certainly true.

 

[CyFan61]

It has been a while since I have been on that site. It is one of the best places for objective consideration of referee calls.As I watch the ultra-slow motion, it seems that the ball does indeed hit the ground (or at least he hits the ball down).

No, actually it's pretty clear that the ball does not hit the ground before it's caught. Good point by Jordan, if that is indeed the rule (and I would assume that it is) then we caught a break on that one.

 

[Clonehomer]

What if this had been the end of the game, would the game then have to be extended in order to enforce the personal foul?

One more un-timed down...the game can't end on a defensive penalty. It wouldn't matter if its a dead ball it was still on the defense.

So why the difference between end of half and end of game? If it were going to OT, would the penalty be enforced in OT, or would there still be an un-timed down? Seems like that rule should be changed so any penalty is enforced in the half that it occurred. I can understand a personal foul as the teams are leaving the field, but this was a result of a play that happened in the first half.

 

[CyCloned]

On a different officiating note... Someone on refstripes.com pointed this out.
(Onside KO (video))

Onside KO - YouTube


Mahoney didn't bounce the ball like a traditional onside kick. It should have been Kick Catch Interference because the block occurred before the ball hits the ground, and the Receiving team has the right to the attempt to field the ball until it hits the ground.
So remember when you next get mad at officiating, that somethings do go our way. :twitcy:

So does that make up for the one where ISU was called for Offsides and it wasn't even close????

 

[Sloup]

How about that GREAT review of the TD pass? Confirmed versus Upheld!! Only a frickin lawyer could come up with that nuance to "cover down" for the screw ups on the field. Thank goodness ISU scored again just to PROVE em wrong!

Officials should learn to tell the truth by what they SEE and not worry about overturning a screwed up call on the field. But they are SOoooo insecure aren't they!

The rule is intended to make sure the game isn't overrun by video review, not to boost the self-esteem of the refs. When overturning the call is only possible with indisputable video evidence, you ensure the booth only gets to review when its absolutely necessary. The fact that there is a difference between the "stands" and "confirmed" may be nuance, but there's an important distinction to be made.

 

[cyclonefreak5]

On a different officiating note... Someone on refstripes.com pointed this out.
(Onside KO (video))

Onside KO - YouTube


Mahoney didn't bounce the ball like a traditional onside kick. It should have been Kick Catch Interference because the block occurred before the ball hits the ground, and the Receiving team has the right to the attempt to field the ball until it hits the ground.
So remember when you next get mad at officiating, that somethings do go our way. :twitcy:

I was actually talking to my dad about this. Couldn't the receiver throw his hand up in the air and signal for a fair catch since it didnt bounce?

 

[00clone]

No, actually it's pretty clear that the ball does not hit the ground before it's caught. Good point by Jordan, if that is indeed the rule (and I would assume that it is) then we caught a break on that one.

You are interfering with our ability to praise the Zeb's when calls go our way, and whine when they don't. 15 yards from the current spot on the interwebbies.