2005 vs 2009 talent

[jaretac]

Comparing position by position talent for the 2009 squad (based on the spring depth chart) versus the talent of our last bowl team- 2005.


Offense
......2005...............2009..................Better Player
QB....Bret Meyer.........Austen Arnaud.........Arnaud
RB....Stevie Hicks.......Alexander Robinson....Robinson
FB....Ryan Kock..........Taylor Mansfield......Kock
WR....Todd Bylthe........Marquis Hamilton......Bylthe
WR....Austin Flynn.......Sedrick Johnson.......Flynn
WR....Jon Davis..........Darius Darks..........Darks
TE....Ben Barkema........Collin Franklin.......Barkema
LT....Scott Fisher.......Hayworth Hicks........Hicks
LG....Kory Pence.........Reggie Stephens.......Stephens
C.....Scot Stephenson....Alex Alvarez..........Stephenson
RG....Seth Zehr..........Ben Lamaak............Lamaak
RT....Aaron Brant........Kelechi Osemele.......Brant

2005..6 players
2009..6 players

Notes-
-Chose Robinson mostly due to health
-We really don't have a FB in the new system (guess it's a good thing)
-I admittedly don't know as much about the OLine (then or now)

Defense
......2005...............2009..................Better Player
RE....Cephus Johnson.....Christopher Lyle......Johnson
NG....Nick Leaders.......Nate Frere............Leaders
DT....Brent Curvey.......Austin Alburtis.......Curvey
LE....Jason Berryman.....Rashawn Parker........Berryman
SLB...Jamarr Buchanan....Josh Raven............Raven
MLB...Tim Dobbins........Jesse Smith...........Dobbins
WLB...Matt Robertson.....Fred Garrin...........Garrin
LCB...DeAndre Jackson....Leonard Johnson.......Jackson
RCB...LaMarcus Hicks.....Ter’ran Benton........Hicks
SS....Nik Moser..........Zac Sandvig...........Moser
FS....Steve Paris........James Smith...........Paris
2005..9 players
2009..2 players

Notes-
-Johnson is good and will likely be better than Jackson in time
-The two spots that I gave to 2009, they could go either way, but it was to painful to put down only 2005 players.

Special Teams
......2005...............2009..................Better Player
PK....Bret Culbertson....Grant Mahoney.........Mahoney
P.....Tony Yelk..........Mike Brandtner........Yelk
PR....Ryan Baum..........Allen Bell............Baum
KR....DeAndre Jackson....Leonard Johnson.......Johnson
2005..2 players
2009..2 players

Notes-
-Brandtner is a good P, but Yelk could coffin corner the ball like a pro
-Jackson had some pretty good returns, but Johnson beats him here by far

Thoughts?

 

[delt4cy]

Awesome thread! Posts like this are why I come to this site.

 

[jaretac]

As we saw in 2006, the defense was mostly to thank for our bowl game in 2005. That was a extremely good defense, so it shouldn't be surprising, but it is still sobering to see how many positions were better then.

I think as a unit, this offense is better than 2005's. Also, this is not including some of the incoming recruits like Money, that are likely going to win starting roles.

 

[delt4cy]

1. I think Robinson is a better runner to the hole than Stevie. He also seems quite a bit faster. Stevie was on and off, but when he was on the dude would go on tears, god bless him. Arob seems to be more consistent though. I also like our 2nd and 3rd options much better than 05.

2. I think this group of WR's and TE's has a chance to be better than the 2005 group. Why? Because the uptempo offense will highlight the abilities of our possession style receivers (consistency & finding open holes). My only concern is lack of a slasher/maclin type, maybe Money can step up?? I also think Franklin is better than Barkema. (that dropped catch vs. Mizzou is burned into my retnas)

3. I think the only player on the 2009 defense better than their counterpart is LJ. That 05' defense was special. I hope the 09' surprises. The 05' dbacks seemed to always be in the right spot. Also, I don't think we'll see Sandvig starting this fall, just a hunch.

4. Oline- I'm not very well versed here but I'll say that Stephenson is the only player off the 2005 line better than 2009. Brant and Zehr we're stallwarts for years but I think Lamaak and the other potential match can be better. The left side in 09' vs. 05' would appear much stronger.

 

[jaretac]

3. I think the only player on the 2009 defense better than their counterpart is LJ. That 05' defense was special. I hope the 09' surprises. The 05' dbacks seemed to always be in the right spot. Also, I don't think we'll see Sandvig starting this fall, just a hunch.

4. Oline- I'm not very well versed here but I'll say that Stephenson is the only player off the 2005 line better than 2009. Brant and Zehr we're stallwarts for years but I think Lamaak and the other potential match can be better. The left side in 09' vs. 05' would appear much stronger.

I agree with 1&2. LJ is a good player, but do you really think he is right now, better than DJ was in '05? Honest question. I think LJ could be a much better player than DJ, but I'm still a little concerned with his coverage.

Brant went NFL if I remember right and though we are hearing good things about Osemele, he is still unproven.

 

[arganbright2]

Sandvig will not start ahead of Sims. My guess is Maggitt will probably be taking alot of snaps away from Parker and the two late signees will get alot of playing time at LB. Other than that, I thought it was an awesome post and agree with most of it.

 

[cmoore_23]

i think the key to this team this year.. is it seems like we actually have some depth at all the positions.. but for that to be affective everyone will need to be on the same page.. mental errors i think are going to be key.. the less amount of mental errors the better this team will be...

 

[Omaha Cy]

i think the key to this team this year.. is it seems like we actually have some depth at all the positions.. but for that to be affective everyone will need to be on the same page.. mental errors i think are going to be key.. the less amount of mental errors the better this team will be...

Great thread BTW from the OP.

About this comment, i feel there is some decent depth on offense(RB/WR and O-line to an extent), and the defensive secondary but thats about it. We incur any D-line or LB injuries and that will be bad...very bad.

 

[tyrelrobert]

First off - Great Post! Two things (just my opinion)

1. Jon Davis was one heck of a WR. I like Darks but Davis kind of was lost behind Blythe. I would call this a toss up

2. Matt Robertson was better than Garrin. If he would have played his senior season at ISU our Defense would have been even better than it was. He was an animal who wanted to knock anyone's head off who got in his way

 

[BryceC]

Agree about Robo, that guy was a machine.

However it's not like any of these guys can't make their way above some of the 05ers with their play this year. Nothing's for sure yet.

 

[MaxPower57]

I agree with most, but have some differing opinions...

Meyer in 05 was no slouch, by far his best year so I put him equal to Arnaud..hard to say how AA will do with the new O but hoping for the best.

Match up Flynn with Darks and Davis with Johnson and 05 sweeps the WR.

If Haugton starts at LT he gets the nod, but Hicks really hasn't done anything so I give Fisher/Egbers the nod.

Defense is our weakest unit and Lbs our weakest position so I'd have Robo (pretty good player) over Garrin on the weakside and the combo of Buchanan and Carper over Raven on the strongside. Also, Moorehead ended up starting quite a bit at DE in 05.

 

[dualthreat]

I agree with every post so far

Speaking of "burned into my retinas" How about Steve Paris' KO hit on Drew Tate! :biggrin: Or any of Tim Dobbins' hits! Yay that team was fun to watch

 

[jaretac]

I agree with most, but have some differing opinions...

Meyer in 05 was no slouch, by far his best year so I put him equal to Arnaud..hard to say how AA will do with the new O but hoping for the best.

Also, Moorehead ended up starting quite a bit at DE in 05.

Arnaud had more total yards last year than Meyer did in 05. I agree that Meyer had a good year in 05, but with the new offense and another year under his belt, I expect Arnaud to be much better.

 

[armount]

I'm nervous about our d-line and slightly about our line-backers (not as much anymore for the lb's because of the two juco's we recently got, but then again they are unproven at this level so we will see).

I think the key to a decent or better defense will have to be the blitz schemes. I unfortunately feel that if we don't blitz, our d-line is not good enough to get to the qb unless they get lucky or if the qb can't get rid of the ball in a somewhat timely fashion.

I hope i'm wrong about our d-line and would love to eat my words in 3-4 months.

 

[LeBron]

Meyer was the better QB. 19-10 ratio on a team that was 7-5 and 4-4 in the Big 12. I like Arnaud but he hasn't shown he can be a winner yet, but hopefully that will change after this year. We can only compare Meyer to the '08 Arnaud because we obviously don't know what he'll do in '09.

 

[jaretac]

Meyer was the better QB. 19-10 ratio on a team that was 7-5 and 4-4 in the Big 12. I like Arnaud but he hasn't shown he can be a winner yet, but hopefully that will change after this year. We can only compare Meyer to the '08 Arnaud because we obviously don't know what he'll do in '09.

But as we have already established, Meyer had better WRs in 05. How many drops were there last year. I think Arnaud is/will be better. As for winning. I also attribute the 7-5 record to the defense. I know of a least 3 games that were won because of the defense, not offense.

 

[MaxPower57]

Arnaud had more total yards last year than Meyer did in 05. I agree that Meyer had a good year in 05, but with the new offense and another year under his belt, I expect Arnaud to be much better.

Meyer threw for more yards, more TDs, higher comp %, and higher efficiency. The only reason Arnaud has more total yards is because Meyer was constantly being sacked. Although I'm not a fan of the coaches from last year, they did run an offense that got the ball out at least semi quickly. McFarland>Cotton. It then seemed like Meyer's psyche got rocked and was not the same the next two years. I don't know if Arnaud is better than Meyer in 05, but I hope he is and with our offense he will have plenty of chances to prove himself. The main thing I think Arnaud has on Meyer is the leadership and determination needed from a QB.

 

[swarthmoreCY]

I agree that AA in 09 > Meyer in 05.
I would take Lyle over Johnson.
Like others have said, at this point Robo > Fred
Comparing going into 09 to into 05, I would say the only WR position that is clear cut is Blythe. Before 05, we thought AF would be good at WR, but it had yet to happen. Sed had a better first year than Jon Davis, and Davis's second year was better than 2005...
Certainly looks like the offense could be as good, if not better, and the defense will need to be "coached up".

 

[LeBron]

Meyer threw for more yards, more TDs, higher comp %, and higher efficiency. The only reason Arnaud has more total yards is because Meyer was constantly being sacked. Although I'm not a fan of the coaches from last year, they did run an offense that got the ball out at least semi quickly. McFarland>Cotton. It then seemed like Meyer's psyche got rocked and was not the same the next two years. I don't know if Arnaud is better than Meyer in 05, but I hope he is and with our offense he will have plenty of chances to prove himself. The main thing I think Arnaud has on Meyer is the leadership and determination needed from a QB.

If we compare Meyer's early years (14-10, 8-8 in big 12 with 29-16 ratio)to Arnaud, he wins by far. But I'll be very disappointed if Arnaud doesn't top Meyer's junior and senior seasons (7-17, 3-13 in big 12 with 21-25 ratio).

 

[Ace000087]

LG....Kory Pence.........Reggie Stephens.......Stephens

Kory Pence was pretty solid from what I recall... he opened up some monster holes for Steve Hicks in 2004.